Why does a place of birth matter so much? Hazrat Ali (R.A.) was a great person, regardless of the circumstances of his birth.
Miracles do not make a person great, deeds do. His deeds are certainly worthy of highest praise.
because some people hold that doing so would be equated to hating/degrading/not giving due respect, the person. hazrat Ali wasnt much liked by many, especially after the death of the Prophet(sa), mauwiya for example in speciic and the umayyads in general often resorting to curses heaped upon him in public. The family of the Prophet (s) as a whole was subject to enormities. Did you know that NONE of the shia imams died natural deaths? Most of them were poisened and the rest murdered! So since shias claim to align themselves with the family of the prophet(s) they are particularly touchy and sentimental on issues which somehow degrade the status of the imams...but they also need to understand that Ahle Sunna's certain rejection of historical happenings cannot be constituted as hateful or degrading.
If Ka'aba was to open like that for someone's birth, nobody except Muhammed SAW deserved that honor.
This is the end of argument.
Sahih Muslim, Book 10, Hadith 3662:
A hadith like this has been transmitted on the authority of Hakim b. Hizam (Imam Muslim) said: Hakim b. Hizam was born inside the Ka'ba and lived for one hundred and twenty years.
A hadith like this has been transmitted on the authority of Hakim b. Hizam (Imam Muslim) said: Hakim b. Hizam was born inside the Ka'ba and lived for one hundred and twenty years.
hmm..
Peace Jafri
Smooth-guy was not talking about being born in the ka'bah but for tha ka'bah to have miraculously opened. The hadith that you have quoted says nothing of the concept that rukn-e-yamani was opened up miraculously.
The historical events and facts (not something found in one sect's books) show that Hz Ali R.A held the highest post in Shura during Umar R.A, even Umar R.A whenever used to go outside Medina, will make Ali responsible for the capital. On several important historical occassions Ali's suggestions were welcomed and accepted like during Al Qadissiyah. Even Ali used to freely critisize Umar on the demotion of Khalid Bin Walid etc etc. Umar used to answer him like anyone else in the Shura. Both princes Hassan and Hussain R.A were treated well and were asked to advocate Bilal R.A to do Adhaan on his return from Syrian front. Ali R.A even married Umar's close relative. I mean tens of thousands of Muslims of high ranks lived in Medina and elsewhere. How come a single incident of Ali complaining or humiliated not reported. This is rather a serious question, really. Not all Muslims (as per Shia theory) reverted from Islam and turned into Munafiq (naudobillah). Nor a man like Ali will keep quiet for 23 years for his stolen divine right of Caliphate. I have read numerous articles and websites referencing asoole-kaafi and other Shia books. No historical reference is made and the writers are failed to justify the 'taqqiyya' of Sayyedina Ali R.A for so long.....on the other hand pride on Hussain R.A 's shahaada for speaking up against tyrant.
How come father does taqqiyya for his divine right (that is against Allah's will actually if he wanted Ali to be the Caliphate, and Ali R.A should have resisted not for himself but for Allah's order), but the son decides not to keep quiet like father.
Never got this point in my head. It sounds all exaggerated for political reasons by specific groups that wanted to divide Muslims on pre-Islamic clan rivalry.
I see this thead going nowhere.Sunni muslims will never accept the Shia muslim version and Shia muslims will never accept the Sunni version.Sunnis back up their claim by citing examples and logic while Shia's do the same to support their claim but neither one is willing to accept other one's point of view.So what do we do now???
Almighty Allah tells you what to do in the Holy Quran,
"And hold fast, all of you together to the Rope of Allah, and be not divided among yourselves" (3:103)
Now its up to you.You can either talk on differences and create division amongst the ummah or gather on the similarties that is the Quran and the Hadith and unify.
Not all Muslims (as per Shia theory) reverted from Islam and turned into Munafiq (naudobillah). Nor a man like Ali will keep quiet for 23 years for his stolen divine right of Caliphate. I have read numerous articles and websites referencing asoole-kaafi and other Shia books. No historical reference is made and the writers are failed to justify the 'taqqiyya' of Sayyedina Ali R.A for so long.....on the other hand pride on Hussain R.A 's shahaada for speaking up against tyrant.
How come father does taqqiyya for his divine right (that is against Allah's will actually if he wanted Ali to be the Caliphate, and Ali R.A should have resisted not for himself but for Allah's order), but the son decides not to keep quiet like father.
Never got this point in my head. It sounds all exaggerated for political reasons by specific groups that wanted to divide Muslims on pre-Islamic clan rivalry.
A very simplistic interpretation of Islamic history where examples like yours are cited as a matter of course. What would hz Ali's failure to pay allegiance to hz Abu Bakr for six months mean? Could it be that 'some' did not want to see Prophethood and caliphate combined in Banu Hashim on pre-Islamnic clan rivalries? it wasnt taqiyya! hz Ali and his devout followers made no secret about his claim for caliphate right from the start. Furthermore, the events of Saqifa werent as peaceful and harmonious as some would like to believe. Do read about the selection of hz Umar and the subsequent selection of hz Usman. It isnt as delightful as our Islamic books teach us to be.
Ummm i dont know where you fit,if you believe that HAZRAT ALI A.S was born in KAABA you are believing the truth but if you deny that the crack is miracle,i challenge you to go and close that crack or ask saudi government to close that crack.
Why does a place of birth matter so much? Hazrat Ali (R.A.) was a great person, regardless of the circumstances of his birth.
Miracles do not make a person great, deeds do. His deeds are certainly worthy of highest praise.
Miracles do make a person great.QURAN is the miracle of HAZRAT MOHAMMAD S.A.W.W which distinguishes him from other prophets and many KAFIRS asked HAZRAT MOHAMMAD S.A.W.W to show different miracles after which they embrace islam.
A very simplistic interpretation of Islamic history where examples like yours are cited as a matter of course. What would hz Ali's failure to pay allegiance to hz Abu Bakr for six months mean? Could it be that 'some' did not want to see Prophethood and caliphate combined in Banu Hashim on pre-Islamnic clan rivalries? it wasnt taqiyya! hz Ali and his devout followers made no secret about his claim for caliphate right from the start. Furthermore, the events of Saqifa werent as peaceful and harmonious as some would like to believe. Do read about the selection of hz Umar and the subsequent selection of hz Usman. It isnt as delightful as our Islamic books teach us to be.
Just want to add something for SMOOTH GUY,there is also a pricking point in my head that where was HAZRAT ABU BAKR AND HAZRAT UMAR at the time of death of HAZRAT MOHAMMAD S.A.W.W?why didnt they attend the NAMAZ-e-JANAZA of HAZRAT MOHAMMAD S.A.W.W?why did the say GHAIBANA NAMAZ-e-JANAZA of HAZRAT MOHAMMAD S.A.W.W on third day after his death?
Was matter of khilafat importand than the death of HAZRAT MOHAMMAD S.A.W.W?if so then why HAZRAT MOHAMMAD S.A.W.W didnt appointed his heir in his life.....as you people say so?
There was no grand funeral prayer for Prophet saw, He remained in his own room after death, small groups of people used to enter the room, say the funeral prayer and leave, followed by another group. Prophet saw was buried in the same room, His pure body was not taken anywhere.
Just want to add something for SMOOTH GUY,there is also a pricking point in my head that where was HAZRAT ABU BAKR AND HAZRAT UMAR at the time of death of HAZRAT MOHAMMAD S.A.W.W?why didnt they attend the NAMAZ-e-JANAZA of HAZRAT MOHAMMAD S.A.W.W?why did the say GHAIBANA NAMAZ-e-JANAZA of HAZRAT MOHAMMAD S.A.W.W on third day after his death?
Was matter of khilafat importand than the death of HAZRAT MOHAMMAD S.A.W.W?if so then why HAZRAT MOHAMMAD S.A.W.W didnt appointed his heir in his life.....as you people say so?
CAorMBA Please use the search facility on this board and it will ease off the 'pricking point in' your head.
Let me know if you don't find it. It has all the information that you require.
There was no grand funeral prayer for Prophet saw, He remained in his own room after death, small groups of people used to enter the room, say the funeral prayer and leave, followed by another group. Prophet saw was buried in the same room, His pure body was taken anywhere.
NOT answer to my question MR moderator,and above story is i am reading from you.never heard that small groups of people used to enter the room and say the funeral prayers,Questions exists,where was HAZRAT ABU BAKAR AND HAZRAT UMAR when HAZRAT MOHAMMAD S.A.W.W namaz-e-janaza was being performed.
CAorMBA Please use the search facility on this board and it will ease off the 'pricking point in' your head.
Let me know if you don't find it. It has all the information that you require.
ANS: sorry sir,i didnt find the information so please help me in this regard
But you are going off topic!!
ANS: there is a valid reason of going off the topic,i was answering smooth guy that why HAZRAT ALI stayed silent and HAZRAT IMAM HUSSAIN fought the war with yazeed LANTI,so before letting me know the i am getting off the topic,address smooth guy to stay to the topic.
Ummm i dont know where you fit,if you believe that HAZRAT ALI A.S was born in KAABA you are believing the truth but if you deny that the crack is miracle,i challenge you to go and close that crack or ask saudi government to close that crack.
Peace CAorMBA
I'm not sure you know anything about rocks and rock formation and physics of masonry, because if you did you would not have made such statements about cracks in stone.
1st) Nails will split rock they do not tie it together like they would to wood. In fact breaking rock is often done with nail type objects called chisels.
2nd) Rock formations have something called seams in them. It is impossible to join seams that they become seamless. What you see in the pictures are seams.
3rd) The crack does not go all they way through to the other side. Even if you can see the line (vein/seam) you cannot possibly equate this to a crack that you can see the other side through it. In other words if you blast water on that seam it will not reach the other side of the rock.
About my previous post ... you need to read the opening post again. It is the Shi'ah claim that it reopens every year on the birthday of Imam Ali(AS) not mine. So by disregarding this you are disregarding the first post.
I wonder which heavenly scent and light emanates from the Place where the best of Mankind and Creation (RasoolAllah (peace be upon him)) pace was born.
Anything from Shia sources??
Look at the life of previous Prophets. If Prophet s.a.w didnt repeat miracles of Musa a.s and Isa a.s doest that make Isa a.s and Musa a.s better than Prophet Mohammed s.a.w ?
Look at the life of previous Prophets. If Prophet s.a.w didnt repeat miracles of Musa a.s and Isa a.s doest that make Isa a.s and Musa a.s better than Prophet Mohammed s.a.w ?
Peace aqeel123
It is not the position of Ahl-us-Sunnah Wal-Jammat to compare prophets with non-prophets. (AS).
'Ali is from me and I am from him; he is the guardian (wali) of every believer after me."
Musnad Ahmad Ibn Hanbal: v.5, p.356.
(Al-Albani has declared it sahih, citing also similar declarations by al-Hakim and al-Dhahabi in his Silsilah al-Ahadith al-Sahihah, Vol. 5, p. 261, No. 2223. Ibn Hajar al-Asqalani, in his al-Isabah, Vol. 4, p. 468, has called it "strong".)
At Mubahila, Imam Ali (as) is called "self" (nafs) of the Prophet (saww) by Allah (swt);
[3:61] "If any one disputes in this matter with thee, now after (full) knowledge Hath come to thee, say: "Come! let us gather together,- our sons and your sons, our women and your women, ourselves and yourselves: Then let us earnestly pray, and invoke the curse of Allah on those who lie!
Miracle of Imam Ali (as) is one of the great miracles of the Prophet (saww) himself. There are many relevant hadiths and verses on this topic.
Opening of the Ka'aba wall for Hz Ali R.A 's mother does not make him the first choice for Caliphate.
Prophet Muhammed SAW's appointment of Abu Bakr for first ever Islamic Hajj as Ameer of Hujjaj and the Imamat of Salah in Masjid e Nabwi SAW by Abu Bakr on Prophet's insistence in His last two days of his life surely suggest who he wanted to be Caliph.
Nobody can reach the heights AbuBakr and Ali R.A reached under Prophet's guidance. They are at their maqaam. But the whiners will always cry till Qiyamaah. The Bughz will not earn paradise for either side. Love and respect Prophet, His family and companion. Thats what he has taught us.
