I recently attended a penal discussion, where they said that Sufism flourish where there is a tradition of ‘Expectation’ then ‘Invitation’
Western culture is all about invitation. You need to get appointment to visit someone, otherwise, you may face cold behavior.
In East ‘expectation’ culture prevail thats why Khanqah culture flourished, where unexpected arrivals were also welcomed. In east, there has been a tradition of entertaining ‘bin bulae mehmaan’.
Traditionally the West - the legacy of a Judeo-Christian Neoplatonian setting was responsible for the Crusades. For them Muslims were a problem to be eliminated. What the West excels at that the East continually fails at doing is analysing culture and learning from history. I feel the single most critical aspect of Western culture has to be their ability to understand and influence the mentality of nations. In fact the three biggest non-Islamic regions on the Earth have worked hard to dispel the very attractive potency of Islamic thought and belief - especially when presented in the form of Sufism. But they have had to do this at a price - and that is to demonise us, they have had to lie.
Part of this lie is to remove the more attractive elements and the more attractive propagators ... They know very well who spread Islam in the East so they made sure that would not happen in their own lands. Even to this day they allow air time to come to the ugliest manifestation of Muslims and show in opposition to them only the completely assimilated Muslim ... internally the historically acute and fringe groups were given power and wealth and nationalism was instigated in to our ranks to break us up in to little groups and countries. Suddenly Sufism was lost and Islamic Protestantism flourished furthermore Sufism became hidden and the portrayal of it became mythological and heresy set in to groups that had no true legacy ... Today you have to search to find the true picture even in the East.
Basically - the East welcomed Sufi Islam because it did not strategise the process, the West learnt what Sufi Islam could do and prepared for it and still fights it until today. The biggest weapon they have is to ignore it and give it little press and for what little press it does give it is obscure ...
And the West makes it out to non-Sufi orientated from Islam that the Sufi manifestation is friendly and hence those who wish to oppose the West, the West count on the notion that they will also oppose those who they have "befriended" from among the Muslims. Whereas that is simply the misunderstanding of the position of the people of Ihsan by the non-Sufis ... Neither do Sufis call anyone to aid neither do they favour the kuffar. Rather the Sufis are true to the meaning of "Peace" and see how it can be best accomplished.
So there is inbuilt resentment among western countries / cultures for Islamic Sufism? But can we call Sufism a complete domain of Muslims / Islam only. Other religions also have Sufi traits. Did west accept them?
the west has plenty of takers for mysticism, but not if it comes chained with the mind-numbing baggage of dogma.
But Sufism is not all about dogma in east well. If that was the case, how come people from different religions attracted to same sufi orders or a particular sufi?
So there is inbuilt resentment among western countries / cultures for Islamic Sufism? But can we call Sufism a complete domain of Muslims / Islam only. Other religions also have Sufi traits. Did west accept them?
Peace muqawwee123
No the West did not accept them - There was a group of Gnostics who started off as mystical Jews and then Christians ... they had they own books - after several meetings in the 3rd and 4th centuries - Gnostics were declared heretics and pushed out in to Asia or killed. Then came the Renaissance period, which tried to bring more rationalism and empiricism in to play. The cool thing about Sufi practices is that they are empirical - i.e. they can be tested and experienced, the problem is they are hard to reproduce - because the premise behind their test condition is true faith and sincerity - whereas the empirical methods adopted by the West are predominantly skeptical.
Spiritualism has been accepted - but not asceticism or gnosticism because the latter required hard work and effort but the Christian world does away with that and has it that belief alone is enough. This provided that platform for further degradation ... Philosophy was left behind and Science took over coupled with no moral or soul cleansing led to what we have today - might is right and satisfaction in the idea that life is nothing more that animalistic processes.
But Sufism is not all about dogma in east well. If that was the case, how come people from different religions attracted to same sufi orders or a particular sufi?
those sufis would be stoned to death by today's neocon sufis. at least that's been my experience.
But Sufism is not all about dogma in east well. If that was the case, how come people from different religions attracted to same sufi orders or a particular sufi?
another factor is race that attracted Sufis from across the religions. For for example punjabi muslim sufis would praise Shiv Kumar or Guru Nanak. Same was the reason Bhulley shah got huge following from sikh
I recently attended a penal discussion, where they said that Sufism flourish where there is a tradition of 'Expectation' then 'Invitation'
Western culture is all about invitation. You need to get appointment to visit someone, otherwise, you may face cold behavior.
In East 'expectation' culture prevail thats why Khanqah culture flourished, where unexpected arrivals were also welcomed. In east, there has been a tradition of entertaining 'bin bulae mehmaan'.
I think its about times. West too has gone through some phases of exhibiting cultural values that East exhibits today like joint family system and usual gatherings of people at street level etc. Now you can see westernized tradition in Pakistan as well.
For sufism, when West was following Christianity practically there must be some sort of sufism there. Instead, there are some parallels between Islamic sufism and Chritianity. Rahbaniat/ seclusion is a practice from Chritianity which is followed by sharia condemning sufis same way followed in Christianity. And religious sufis apporve temporal seclusion.
for another example, you could observe the similar attitude in sufis as Christianity says, whoever slaps you on your right cheek, turn the other to him also
where as this was updated in Islam as if someone slaps you, you have full right to take revenge.
another factor is race that attracted Sufis from across the religions. For for example punjabi muslim sufis would praise Shiv Kumar or Guru Nanak. Same was the reason Bhulley shah got huge following from sikh
You mean same race? people attracted to the sufis of their own race ?
You mean same race? people attracted to the sufis of their own race ?
for most, yes. The message of bhulleh shah and shah latif is almost same. But you could find only a few punjabi who would know shah latif poetry but same is not the true for poetry of sikh poets, among punjabis. Similarly following of punjabi sufi poets in sindh is hardly seen. Even though i think the level of punjabi literature produced by guru nanak is hard to grasp then understanding sidhi poetry but punjabi sufis would still praising guru nanak.
for most, yes. The message of bhulleh shah and shah latif is almost same. But you could find only a few punjabi who would know shah latif poetry but same is not the true for poetry of sikh poets, among punjabis. Similarly following of punjabi sufi poets in sindh is hardly seen. Even though i think the level of punjabi literature produced by guru nanak is hard to grasp then understanding sidhi poetry but punjabi sufis would still praising guru nanak.
Well, I think its getting offtopic.
Don't worry about off topic.
I think its a different thing to follow a message than actually understanding the language / medium which convey such message. I mean if the message of two sufis from different languages is same, then just knowing the fact that falan sufi also said the same thing will create respect for that sufi. We can see many Punjabis visiting Qalandar Shahbaz as many Sindhis going to Data Ganj Bux in Lahore or Bahaudin Zakariya in Multan.
Apart from all this, a little effort can make you understand the other language. Just one example is Abida Parveen who not only sung Shah Latif, but also Bulleh Shah, Shah Hussain from Punjab and Kabir from India.
I think its a different thing to follow a message than actually understanding the language / medium which convey such message. I mean if the message of two sufis from different languages is same, then just knowing the fact that falan sufi also said the same thing will create respect for that sufi. We can see many Punjabis visiting Qalandar Shahbaz as many Sindhis going to Data Ganj Bux in Lahore or Bahaudin Zakariya in Multan.
Apart from all this, a little effort can make you understand the other language. Just one example is Abida Parveen who not only sung Shah Latif, but also Bulleh Shah, Shah Hussain from Punjab and Kabir from India.
agree, but i was trying to make point that one reason of influence of sufis across the religion is race.
If anything, the Westerners are prone to spirituality as much as people in East (or may be more so). Keeping the historical background in mind, the arrival of crusaders stopped Islam and hence sufism entering the West…just like the wave of wahabism hijacked Islam and tassawuf in East. This is the simplest explanation I could come up with.
If anything, the Westerners are prone to spirituality as much as people in East (or may be more so). Keeping the historical background in mind, the arrival of crusaders stopped Islam and hence sufism entering the West...just like the wave of wahabism hijacked Islam and tassawuf in East. This is the simplest explanation I could come up with.
What I meant flourishing of Sufism as an institute like we had 'Khanqah' culture which played an important role.
people in west may follow sufi values because they had interaction with people from east.
Sufism is linked with beliefs and there's no reasoning
the west deals with reasoning
But west was not always like that as we see it today. Remember power of church which also supported the idea of aged ladies by considering them witches.
But west was not always like that as we see it today. Remember power of church which also supported the idea of aged ladies by considering them witches.
yes their beliefs were vague even about humans like considering aged women as witches
