Why Pakistan is right not to trust US and Indian Intentions

saroo · April 9, 2009, 12:52pm

DAWN.COM | World | US criticised for ignoring Pakistan?s concerns

This is worth a read

Captain1 · April 9, 2009, 12:55pm

Re: Why Pakistan is right not to trust US and Indian Intentions

[mod]Please post your opinion and what you want to discuss following forum's policy[/mod]

saroo · April 9, 2009, 2:05pm

Re: Why Pakistan is right not to trust US and Indian Intentions

Dear MOD.........Frist of all I thought this was worth a read especially for those who see no wrong with the current US policy. I was hoping that some of them will have something to say about it.

Punjabee_in_USA · April 9, 2009, 2:12pm

[quote]

Mr Shah says that ‘it should not be surprising that the Pakistani military continues to patronise groups it sees as useful in the regional race for influence’ because of what the Indians have been doing in Afghanistan.
'They seem to be saying: the Pakistanis did it to us in Kashmir, so we will pay them back in Balochistan and elsewhere.’

[/quote]

[quote]

Mr Ganguly, a professor of Political Science at Indiana University, acknowledges that Indian objectives in Afghanistan are ‘not purely humanitarian’.
India, he says, is working on ‘a pincer movement designed to relieve the pressure in Kashmir’. Mr Ganguly says he also knows that ‘the Indians have mucked around in Sindh in retaliation for Pakistani involvement in the Punjab crisis.’

[/quote]

This article talks about Pakistan's concerns about India using its presence in Afghanistan to create instability in Balochistan, FATA etc in retaliation for what Pak has done/is doing in Punjab/Kashmir.

Its a valid fear, however Pak should have thought about it when messing around in Kashmir/Punjab. Did they really think India would remain quiet and do nothing ? You've got to reap what you have sown :)

Slickstar · April 9, 2009, 2:26pm

****ing lol, this person doesn't half break down into histrionics.

saroo · April 9, 2009, 2:30pm

Re: Why Pakistan is right not to trust US and Indian Intentions

So basically you are saying that India was reaping the reward of its actions in East Pakistan.............and by the same justification Pakistan should now be free to do what it wants....Hence a never ending cycle.

Punjabee_in_USA · April 9, 2009, 2:39pm

Re: Why Pakistan is right not to trust US and Indian Intentions

^ Or you could go back and say that Pakistan reaped the reward for breaking India in 1947 through the creation of Bangladesh in 1971 :) We can keep going back in history - its a never ending cycle.

Bangladesh was done & over with in 1971 and Pak should have stayed out of Kashmir and Punjab. You mess with a bigger and more powerful country, there is a good chance that you will come out the loser in the end. Its elementary my friend :)

saroo · April 9, 2009, 3:08pm

Re: Why Pakistan is right not to trust US and Indian Intentions

History my friend is never elementary.........Muslims would never have ruled India for a Millennium........You are right we can keep going back in history and its a never ending cycle and India is doing its best to ensure the cycle doesnt break now. The problem lies at the very denial of the existence of Pakistan.
India is the bigger country and will be the biggest looser if Pakistan were to fall. Stakes are high for Pakistan but they are higher for India. If I were an Indian I would be praying for Pakistan's stability. Hope you know what I am talking about

Punjabee_in_USA · April 9, 2009, 3:33pm

India does not want Pakistan's instability. However, Pakistan has considered this as India's weakness and supported terrorism in India.

I am not sure that Indian embassies in Afghanistan are trying to destabilize Pak, but even if we assume that is true, Pakistan has brought it upon itself by carrying out anti-India activities over decades. I guess its payback time now !!

If Pakistan fails there might be problems for India, but we are capable of handling it.

ehtasab · April 9, 2009, 3:37pm

From "No we don't do anything in Pakistan, we are peaceful, we want stable Pakistan".... to "Did they really think India would remain quiet", things are changing, lies are coming out, people are admitting.

Bail_Out · April 9, 2009, 3:46pm

Re: Why Pakistan is right not to trust US and Indian Intentions

I think you guys are just plain paranoid. We provide assiatance to Afghanistan with monetary, know how and man power. We have historical links with them and think they are good friends.

Instead of realizing the huge problems internal to Pakistan which are causing the current chaos, blaming India or America or any 3rd party is not going to help.

Punjabee_in_USA · April 9, 2009, 3:48pm

Read through the thread my friend ;)

[QUOTE]

I am not sure that Indian embassies in Afghanistan are trying to destabilize Pak, but even if we assume that is true, Pakistan has brought it upon itself by carrying out anti-India activities over decades. I guess its payback time now !!

[/QUOTE]

saroo · April 9, 2009, 3:50pm

Re: Why Pakistan is right not to trust US and Indian Intentions

Its very natural to assume that you are capable of handling it. Two of the many insurgencies in India namely Kashmir and Punjab , India only managed when BB handed over the list for Punjab and when Kashmir was quite for a few years in hope of peace and it seems that things are changing there again. Pakistani forces have experience in dealng with this as they faught the Afghan war with these people and are still finding it pretty hard. Look at the state of US and Nato in Afganistan. I admire your confidence in your forces but dont fool yourself. India is playing the dangerous of all games and is gambling with the biggest of stakes. Indian / US gamble is that India can prop up these Talibans in the west of Pakistan, US will force Pakistan to attack them gradually bringing them both close to a full out war giving a perfect excuse for some surgical strikes and take away the nukes. I am not ready to accept that Indian leadership is fool enough to bring Pakistan down, not at this stage anyway. So they are gambling and if it goes out of hand of which there is a good chance, well, good luck to us all.

saroo · April 9, 2009, 3:59pm

It was not intended as a complaint but to point out the facts to those who are not ready to accept them.
This is only to indentify the real enemies for Pakistanis. We have internal problems but so does every other nation. Inshallah we will fix them both.

junaid001 · April 9, 2009, 4:12pm

to be very frank if thats the logic then you guys have to fear the most, because ISI and our MI is much into india that RAW would take another 50 yrs to equal that.

a pampered child of the west to counter china..

Salahuddin_Ayyubi · April 9, 2009, 4:14pm

I think you nailed it....

junaid001 · April 9, 2009, 4:15pm

something relevant to the topic.

although i hate ahmed qureshi but there is something he has written today in the news and may be interest to you guys.
The CIA’s footprints

here are few excerpts.

The immediate test centres on Baitullah Mehsud, the leader of the bandits who present themselves as Pakistani Taliban. The Americans have begun some cosmetic drone attacks on Baitullah’s territory and there are reports Washington has agreed to launch a joint operation with Pakistan against this bandit. The purpose is to assuage Pakistani concerns about the US role. In July last year, Pakistan’s military leadership confronted senior CIA and US military commanders with evidence showing Washington indirectly protecting anti-Pakistan terrorists on the ground. This newspaper broke that story on Aug. 5, 2008, with a front- page headline, “US told not to back terrorism against Pakistan.”

Mehsud is a good example. This bandit and his former leader and associate, Abdullah Mehsud, pioneered the attacks on Chinese interests in Pakistan, which was the first thing Abdullah did after being released from Gitmo in 2003. Interestingly, he was not handed back to Pakistan despite being a Pakistani citizen, but was released to Afghanistan where he went back into the custody of the US military and the Karzai government. Abdullah was killed when Pakistani security forces caught him sneaking back into Balochistan from Afghanistan, where he most probably was meeting his handlers. How he financed, armed and sustained a 25,000-strong militia remains beyond explanation. This militia continues to have quality arms and generous funding.

aam_bandha · April 9, 2009, 4:18pm

RAW played a vital role in "creation" of Bangladesh.... in 9 months !!!! ....... this is proof that they are not operating in Baluchistan, cause if they were, then you would have seen "creation" of a "khushal " and "independent" Baluchistan !!!!

ISI and MI can only create trouble and kill innocent people .....

Salahuddin_Ayyubi · April 9, 2009, 4:27pm

It wasn't RAW but the people of Pakistan both East and West who created BD... RAW cannot finds its a$$ on the map let alone thinking of BD. RAW is good for training and arming terrorist outfits like LTTE and god knows who...

But that is beside the point now with the introduction of nukes bharat knows when and where to cash its chips and Pak counter is certainly not oone if unless bharat is in the mode of hara kari.

junaid001 · April 9, 2009, 4:28pm

i am not sure about baitullah but bugti group is supported by them and we have documentary and video evidence, of his meetings, travels etc.

bangladesh was not created by raw and not in 9 months but it was process that started when ayub khan took over and seeds sown when floods came and we were unable or not eager to help and last stroke happened when elections were held and we didnt give mujib power, also when we knew he was indian asset and was in our custody we should have finished him off.