why dont tableghi call before coming??? [Split discussion]

Society Religion & Philosophy
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[QUOTE]
*Originally posted by kewlsolara: *

considering that you are opposing me on both threads :) and telling me that i dont know any thing

then why are you telling us to not to give them more than 3-4 days ???? why not have few weeks and 40 days with them???
and
you are the one who claimed the tablegi's books being fabricated not me.

care to explain????
[/QUOTE]

Right is right and wrong is wrong. And you ARE wrong.
I already mentioned that during the first 3 or 4 days they talk about
Aqeeda, Namaz and wudu.
But than comes in their book(fabricated book). And the ways and
means of their BUZARGS(taqleed). I really don't care about them.

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DEVIANT GROUPS \ Jamaa'ah at-Tableegh \

Jamaa'ah at-Tableegh: Teachings of Shirk in the book -"Fadhaa.il A'maal" - Part 1

Tableeghi Jamaat: Teachings of Shirk in the Book -"Fadhaa.il A'maal" (popularly referred to as - " Fazail Amal")

Part 1: Readings in "Fadhaa.il Durood"

All praise is due to Allaah. We praise Him, seek His help and forgiveness. And we seek refure in Allaah the Most High from the evils of our ownselves and from our bad deeds. Whomsoever Allaah guides none can misguide him and whomsoever Allaah misguides there is none to guide such an individual. I bear witness that there is no true god worthy of being worshipped except Allaah alone, without partner or associate. I further bear witness that Muhammad (sal-Allaahu `alayhe wa sallam) is His slave and Messenger. May Allaah the Exalted bestow his peace and blessings on the final messenger Muhammad, upon his family, his noble companions and all those who follow them.

To Proceed:

That the most truthful speech is the Qur.aan, the word of Allaah and the best of guidance is that of Muhammad (sal-Allaahu alayhe wa sallam). And the worst of affairs in this religion of ours are the innovations and every innovation is a Bidah and every Bid`ah is misguidance and every misguidance is in the hell fire.

This paper which is the first in its series is being compiled in order to inform the Muslim who yearns and strives to know Islaam. The Islaam as revealed by Allaah (Subhaanahu wa Ta'aala) on His final Messenger (sal-Allaahu alayhe wa sallam); free from any alterations, deletions and additions. But today a dark shadow has been cast over the truth. Shirk and Bidah have a firm grip on the Muslims. Falsehood has worn the garb of righteousness and the ignorant ones the robes of the scholar.

Illegitimate partisanship to one's group, party and organisation has divided the hearts of the Muslims. The rules of the party and groups transcend the laws of the Qur.aan and authentic Sunnah. False interpretation of the verses of the Noble Qur.aan and incidents of Seerah to suit the agenda of the party are rampant today.

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Today, the Tableeghi Jamaat is considered to be the largest "evangelical group" calling Muslims to prayer, fasting, Hajj etc. Those who ascribe themselves to this Jamaat CLAIM that the book "Fadhaa.il A'maal" (also known as Tableeghi Nisaab) is the collection of various verses from the Qur.aan and ahaadeeth describing the virtues and great rewards of Hajj, Zakaah, Salaah, Dhikr etc. BUT a close examination of this book in the light of Qur.aan and authentic Sunnah reveals horrendous teachings of Shirk, innovations, lies on the Messenger of Allaah, belittling the pious generation of the noble companions and the scholars. Indeed, in the name of loving the Prophet (sal-Allaahu `alayhe wa sallam) and the Righteous People, Shaytaan has seduced this firqah and enticed them into Shirk and Kufr - to which they appear to be so blind.

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This paper and further studies into the book will provide irrefutable arguments along with accurate references to prove, inshaa.-Allaah, that the ideology propagated in this book is nothing but grave worship, supplication to other than Allaah and to prove that the 'aqeedah (beliefs) propagated in this book has nothing to do with Islaam but with Paganism and may Allaah (Subhaanahu wa Ta'aala) protect us from it.

Note: The version of Fadhaa.il A'maal (Urdu Version) that is going to be used is printed from:

Idara Irshaad-e-Diniaat Pvt. Ltd.
Nizamuddin, No-13
Delhi, India

.

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Shirk in the Section "Fadhaa.il Durood" (Virtues on sending salutations on the Prophet)

[As for sending salaat and salaam upon the Messenger (sal-Allaahu alayhe wa sallam), then it is indeed one of the greatest of virtues and most praiseworthy acts. And the manner of sending salaat and salaam has been indicated in the Authentic Sunnah, and is far removed from the lies and fabrications you will soon read in this paper, from the books of Jamaa'at-ut-Tableegh. What is important to note is the great fabrications and exaggerations that have been made, around the subject of sending salaat and salaam upon the Messenger (sal-Allaahualayhe wa sallam) and which are known to be such in the most evident and clearest of ways.]

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1) The 'aqeedah of grave worship in "Fadhaa.il Durood"

It is the belief of every Muslim that invoking and supplication to other than Allaah (Subhaanahu wa Ta'aala) (ex: angels, saints, dead prophets, scholars) in times of distress or ease with the anticipation that that being has the ability to cause the removal of distress and suffering, or that by that being's intermediation, distress and suffering is removed, is an act of Shirk. Allaah (Subhaanahu wa Ta'aala) has said in the Noble Qur.aan (meaning of which):

{And invoke not besides Allaah any such that will neither profit you nor hurt you, but if (in case) you did so, you shall certainly be one of the Zaalimoon (polytheists and wrongdoers)}, [Soorah Yoonus, Aayah 106]

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Also from the authentic ahaadeeth.

Reported 'Aa.ishah (radhi-yallaahu 'anhaa): "Umm Salamah mentioned to Allaah's Messenger (sal-Allaahu alayhe wa sallam) that in Abyssinia she saw a church full of pictures and statues. He (sal-Allaahualayhe wa sallam) said:

((When a righteous man or pious worshipper among them dies they build a place of worship over his grave and set up all kinds of pictures and statues. They are the worst of all creatures before Allaah. They combine two evils; worshipping at the graves and making graven images and statues)), [Reported by Bukhaaree and Muslim].

Also in al-Bukhaaree and Muslim it is reported that 'Aa.ishah (radhi-yallaahu 'anhaa) narrated: "When the death approached Allaah's Messenger (sal-Allaahu alayhe wa sallam) he began to draw a piece of cloth (bed sheet) over his face, (sometimes covering and sometimes removing because of distress), he (sal-Allaahualayhe wa sallam) said in this state:

((Allaah's curse be upon the Jews and Christians for taking the graves of their Prophets as places of worship)), thus he (sal-Allaahu `alayhe wa sallam) warned the people about their actions."

Muslim reported from Jundub bin 'Abdullaah (radhi-yallaahu 'anhu) who narrated: I heard the Prophet (sal-Allaahu `alayhe wa sallam) say only five days before his death:

((I am free and clear towards Allaah of having any of you as my Khaleel (specially close friend). Verily, Allaah has taken me as His Khaleel just as He had taken Ibraaheem (`alayhis-salaam) as a Khaleel. If I would have taken anyone from my Ummah as a Khaleel, I would have taken Abu Bakar (radhi-yallaahu 'anhu) as a Khaleel. Beware! those who preceded before you, used to make their Prophet's graves into places of worship. Beware! Don't take (any) graves as places of worship. I forbid you to do so))

He (sal-Allaahu `alayhe wa sallam) forbade this at the end of his life. After this (forbidding of taking graves as place of worship), he cursed anyone who did such deed within this context.

Imaam Abu Haneefah said:

((It is not befitting for anyone to call upon Him, except by Him, and with the supplication that He has permitted and commanded, that which is instructed in His statement:

{And Allaah has Beautiful Names, so call upon Him by them, and leave the company of those who deviate concerning His Names. They will be recompensed for what they used to do})), [Soorah al-A'raaf, Aayah 180], [ad-Durrul-Mukhtaar ma'a Haashiyah Raddul-Mukhtaar (6/396-397)]

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sorry Gupshups bandwidth. I should have given the address.

http://www.fatwa-online.com/deviantgroups/jamaaahattableegh/index.htm

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:salam:
sorry rehman bro…but i cant open the link…some problem with my browser…can u give in concise from…what r the contents…

:salam:

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[QUOTE]
*Originally posted by bao bihari: *

Brother Baoo
Here is a brief excerpt(i hope the spelling is correct) from Fazail Ammal.

Fazail Amaal.
Wrong statement by the shaitan:

Fazail Amaal contains all fabricated shirk.

Answer:

In Fazail Amaal there are some hadith that are considered to be weak by some, however to denote them as 'shirk' is going too far. A person must be careful that they don't call others by derogatory names, especially people that are very close to Allah. On the day that they stand before Allah, Allah will transfer the deeds (good and bad) from one person to another. Anytime a person calls someone else with a bad name; even in cases where it may be true, the person takes for himself some sins of the person he called the name.

Some people prefer to read books which contain only the most authentic narrations. It is recommended for people who have this preference to study the collection of Ahadith "Riyadh al Saliheen". However, there is nothing wrong with reading and following any other books on Islam. Tabligh is the propagation of Allah's message, originated by prophet Muhammad (May Allah's peace and blessings be upon him), continuing on till today. Learning and teaching other books is also Tabligh. May Allah accept from all the believers.

The book Fazail Amaal, is a good book, because of the blessings it contains, (Please see the article labeled blessings ).

A good example of authenticity and blessings could be given with a phone book. A phone book lists the names of people and their phone numbers, which are very authentic. Some people would say that the listings are more authentic than Ahadith found in the Sahihs. However memorizing the phone book, though more 'authentic', does not have the blessings.

When a person becomes devoted in the work of Allah, and propagating Allah's religion, they understand the importance of Blessings. Allah puts things on levels of blessings, which determine the effectiveness of their work. It is Allah that gives the blessings.

Comment my Rehman01:
Please, see that Kandalvi is himself saying that fazail Amal has
weak Ahadith. And that its OK to use them for Tabligh.
Now you make your own judgement.

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:salam:

i have not yet figured out any refrence ,quotation of any fabricated ahadith from fazail e aamal…
as far as weak ahadith is considerd…yes it is debated…but the consensus is that weak ahdith can be used for fazail …if the “zauf”(weakness) is not great…and this is not present in any ahadith mentioned in fazail e aamal…

2-it is not an aqaed book…it is just to catch the attention of fellow muslim brothers…

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Well, Bao mera opinion about Tableeghis NEEM Hakeem
Khatra e Jaan and Neem Mullah Khatra Emman.

I have read few Fatwas about Tablegehis given by Ahl-Hadith(PAK)
and Salafees. In my opinion both have them have exaggerated
the wrong doings of Tableeghis. Lekn There are faults in their
book.To me its seems they use fabricated Hadith mix them up
authentic verses and Koranic ayats. And there is a lot of TALK
ABOUT BUZURGS.
and Kandalvi on his website said that some the Hadith are weak.
So INME fault he so STAY AWAY from them.

Jo hadith me changes karee uskaa kia BAROOSAAA.

and ALLAH(SWT) knows best.

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[QUOTE]
*Originally posted by rehman1: *
its like their routine on first day that people gather around and recite
Last SURAHS of Koran. And it was pointed out that I WAS making a few mistakes. And even one mistake, IS ONE TOO MANY.
So they helped me out.....
[/QUOTE]

Bhai mere, its not part of their "job" to teach others how to pronounce Quran. You may be one of few lucky ones who got educated. They do recite last surahs of Quran in first few days, may even point to the mistakes, but they USUALLY help you correct it. When I went out with them, people who had been going for YEARS were pronouncing horribly, I wanted to correct them, but they stopped me, said that its not part of agenda, if anyone wants to learn pronounciation he should go to some "teacher".

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[QUOTE]
*Originally posted by Changez_like: *

Bhai mere, its not part of their "job" to teach others how to pronounce Quran. You may be one of few lucky ones who got educated. They do recite last surahs of Quran in first few days, may even point to the mistakes, but they USUALLY help you correct it. When I went out with them, people who had been going for YEARS were pronouncing horribly, I wanted to correct them, but they stopped me, said that its not part of agenda, if anyone wants to learn pronounciation he should go to some "teacher".
[/QUOTE]

Interesting, Kher They helped me out. Jaab 8 or 10 laug bhethee
he and than we recited koran. Yes, sirf 30 Pare ke akhree Ayats.

I went with them for one day. Learned some thing. Lekn they read
a WAQIYA from their book and i asked HIM(Tabkeeghi) what does it
mean. Tu isne muhjko JHIRAK dia ke WHY are you asking these
questions in the first day. and they offered some namaz(sharrok)
after FAjar. I have never heard of it. But as far as Namaz goes it may
right.

Fazail Ammal Buzurgs ke Kisssoo se bharee pareee hee.

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They discourage "why", mostly because not everyone in jamaat is a "scholar" or has any knowledge, sometimes all of them may be 'un-parh' but well versed in "tableeghi kaam". But "jhirakna" is in no way a "good" thing.

Nawafil after "Fajr" is offered AFTER sunrise, it is fine.

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So it means to spread truth we can use WEAK information. And than
every sect (yes, deoband is a sect) can use weak ahadith.Allah APP per RAHAM karee.
Bro, me Scholar naheee. But I thought only Saheeh hadith
or Asnnad( i guess) were suppose to be used.
Kia Rasool(SAW) se ko JHOOT gharna hum ko achaa lagee gaaa.
and its sufi organization.
Allah hum sub per RAHAM karee.

IN HIS WEBSITE KANDALVI SAID MOST AUTHENTIC BOOK IS
RIAZ UZ SALEEHEEN. SO WHY CAN’t he use that.
Don’t think that i am WAHABI because i am not. And i am least
interested in who Abdul Wahab was.

This is how I see them. He(Kandalvi) just wants his name everywhere.
Thats how i see it.

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[QUOTE]
*Originally posted by Changez_like: *

Bhai mere, its not part of their "job" to teach others how to pronounce Quran. You may be one of few lucky ones who got educated. They do recite last surahs of Quran in first few days, may even point to the mistakes, but they USUALLY help you correct it. When I went out with them, people who had been going for YEARS were pronouncing horribly, I wanted to correct them, but they stopped me, said that its not part of agenda, if anyone wants to learn pronounciation he should go to some "teacher".
[/QUOTE]

What is your opinion about them.
and also have a look at Hadith that i posted from their
book.

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Thats the whole point.
They gave references of Hadith and than they don’t give references
of Hadith. The point is THEY DON"T Have references of Hadith.

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[QUOTE]
*Originally posted by rehman1: *
What is your opinion about them.
and also have a look at Hadith that i posted from their
book.
[/QUOTE]

I have been with them for a few days, I dislike this jamaat. Though what they are doing is fine to SOME extent but there are many wrongs too. I have read fazaail-e-aamal, I agree with you that it contains many "zaeef" ahadith.

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person came to the Prophet (Sallallaho alaihe wasallam) and said:
"0 Prophet of Allah! I love you so much." The Prophet (Sallallaho alaihe wasallam):
"Think well before you say this." The person:
"I have already given thought. I love you very much, 0, Prophet of Allah."
The Prophet (Sallallaho alaihe wasallam): "Think once again before you declare such a thing."
The person:
"I still love you very much, 0, Prophet of Allah." The Prophet (Sallallaho alaihe wasallam):
"Well, if you are sincere in what you say, then be prepared to face privation and want coming to you from all directions, for it pursues all those who love me, as swiftly as water running down-stream."

I need reference of this hadith about its authenticity.
Copied it from Tableeghi website.

That is why we find the Sahabah living mostly a life of poverty. Similarly the eminent Muhaddithin, Sufi's and theologians lived hand to mouth throughout their life