Who killed Hazrat Hussain r.a?

Re: Who killed Hazrat Hussain r.a?

Actually , i will agian say that """""'"Divine Right""""""""' concept of Iran Sassanid empire that is ruler will always from "same chain of family" and the ruler is of divine status , God man , something like "Halooliat" etc............

Ibne saba exactly used the same concept and whole of shia doctrine is based upon these 2 rules............

Yes , if in iraq , namrood was "God" (remeber its conversation with ibrahim) and same family of namrood was there for centuries .................

Yes , if in egypt , firoan was "God" (remeber its conversation with moosa) and same family of firoan was there for centuries .................

Yes , if in india, karshina was "God" (remeber its conversation with argun) and same family of karshina was there for centuries .................

Then why not , In ARABIA" ali(ra) can be "Maula-i-Kainat" and its family will be there for centuries !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

So , it is "UNJUST" that the" FamilyPossesion Right" of banu hashim has been """""""""""""""""LOOTED""""""""""""""""" !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Re: Who killed Hazrat Hussain r.a?

oooppss. . .

another theory.

You are good at proposing theories dude. Cheer up!

Re: Who killed Hazrat Hussain r.a?

Brother , one thing i want to clear to all muslim brothers and sisters that Allah will not ask from me , on the day of judgement , that why muavia(ra) and ali(ra) fighted and who was corect and if you give wrong answer , I will put you into hell.Brother , He will not ask me anyhing like that , He will ask me , did you offerr 5 prayers , gave zakat , kept roza , hajj, helped poor , jihad aginst your nafs and so that .He will not ask what other did , Allah will ask what i did and that what i believe in..............So we keep on fighting our whole life who is true or who is false or who is better or who is worse ,It is none of my business , Allah has the ultimate domain of ""Justice" and let him exercise this domain......
Secondly, i think , both sides have to do some concessions , because it takes two make a quarrel means " tali hamaisha do haton sai bajti hai"
I do not know from which conutry you belong but me , living in ,Pakistan , experienced many things which are not islamic but yet we do it .For example , in our marriages in indo-pak region , we do "mehandi" on first day then "barat" and finall""walima" , now this"mahaindi" has nothing to do with isalm , it is purely a "hindu" festival but now 99.99% marriages cannot take place witout "mehendi" why ? because for 1000 years we have benn living with hindus so due to this long period now , it looks very common to us .Hardly anyone , who very strictly follow quran and sunnah , not do "mehendi" otherwise everyone do it .Similarly , "juta chupai"(steal shoes) ad " doodh pilai"( to drink milk) are also very common so that with 1000 years of living , eating , drinking together , both sides have intermixed so many things , customs , rituals and festivals that now nobody knows particarly about a festival that whether is it a muslim originated or a hindu one???? just as " basant"( flying kites ) etc etc..
Similarly , the peple living in Iran and Iraq before islam , for thousand of years , under Sassanid empire , like dara , jamshed , kaikoous , kiyani , nowsherva , bahman , and the first one was "namrood" in abraham(as) period .Now all these kings called themselves as Allah in manly form(God man) , that Allah has spirtually come to earth in the form of a ruler and secodly , the"fire domes" were keep on burning for thosands of years in these two conuntries as they follow "Zartisht" or Zartosht & Zoroastrianism and religious leaders of these fire-domes had a very powerful authority over people as well as government , the took taxes , religious gifts"Nazrana" from people , people asked the religious problems and their commandment was final , they took wealth from poor people in their fire-domes with a plea that God will happy from you as much as you give your money .They were also in administration and they had a right to "punish" anyone or"relaese" anyone.So ruler also has a respect to them as people do .So this"religious" class whether we call them" pujari" , " mazbhi taikhaidar" or " nazranai khanai walay" the similar as we see in indo -pak a diffrent shrines and graves of aulia like " Ajmir sharif" or"Pak patan" etc etc.The similar was the case , in those days , in India where"Brahman" also enjoyed all thse "luxuries" and " benifets" and also in "Roman empire " where "chritians fathers" , "padriis" also have a commandment on people.
Science was abandoned and no right of freedom of speech and expression.
So when islam came in Iraq and Iran , the first thing happened that all fire -domes extinguished , secondly , the "government" of these religious classs also came to end because in islam there is no concept of such things ,To obey Allah and rasool , is a simple way .No grave , shrines and people giving wealth to them.So , this was a end of thier rule of thousands of year. Secondly , they cannot accept that thier ruler , which they consider as God in human form can ever be defeated , again anger .Third and most importantly , they could not believe that the " camel riders" and " budhhu" of "Arabia" , which they used to call them " ignorant " , barbarian and "un cultered" , how they can defeat " wold super power " in only few years .Now this thing is beyond thier mental limits that how can this be possible .We , the super power , of thousands of years , advanced in litrerature , arts , cultures , architechture , buildingds , domes , scruptures and tradionally so rich people , and how these "tribe men" living in deserts and have no culture and arts , came over us...................
So brother , their reaction is natural .Just think , if Afghanistan in 4 or 5 years " will defeat whole europe and then rled them , although create a justice system , have a freedom of religion except a small amount of " jazya" , will europe not react that these barbarian ansd tribel men of "uzbek" , "tajik" and "pakhtun" , living for centuries into mountainns and fighting over each other , cvulturally illeterate now become our ruler , the ruler of Europe , a centre of culture , arts and architechture so it was a natural behaviour of " iran" and " iaqi" people of that time .And this was the beginning of """" Clash between Arabian and Persian nationalism""""""""""""" .And the "religious" leades of fire-domes added fire to the fuel becuse they had lost thier rule .Abdullah ibne Saba , a cunning jewish , came to medina , obseved all this , then came back to egypt anf "kufa" and used all these points in his favour and and burnt such a huge flame of fire of revenge , misconceptions and hatred thar , everything disappeared into it and this also happened because some "umayyad" caliphs preached"Arabian nationalism" and showed hatred towards "persians" and "ajum" but the ultimate loss was to all muslims................
Psychologically , he played with the psyche of iranis and iraqis that who , thousands of years , have been experiencing their ruler as "god" or say it " autar " or "duata" etc.. and other thing that in persian empire , the next ruler is the closest relative of previou one and their always continued a chain of a same family ruling for thousands of years and like above i discussed about " mehaendi" in indo-pak , these two concepts are so common for iranis and iraqis that they accepted it at once that is "every prophet has a ""wasi"" and the wasi of muhammad )peace be upon him) is hazrat ali(ra) and secondly the ruler is appointed from God or himself in human form , so to obey him as like a god .Abdullah ibne Saba did exactly , exactly exactly the same technique and unfortunatlet he had a complete success in dividing the muslim nations into two .Tose "religious" leaders of fire-domes preached this concept to its all swing and deviated thousands of them so that they again "regain" thier previous rule .They could impose tax , gave rulings and exercised powe sharing with rulers .In "safvi" rulers of iran and "qachari" rule , they gained so much power that they had a firm grip on government , "Raza shah pehelvi" and "muhammad shah pehelvi" decreased thier power to great extent but after revolution , they again got their powers .Now although Iran is a complete democratical country , yet supreme is not president , or parliment but"Rahbar" who have many many powers and to appoint army , naval ,air chiefs , disapprove any electrol candidate and final ruling will be his. I am not critising anyone but just telling from history . You have observed that we use word "ayt" for verses of quran which mean "nishani" or "symbol" , the same word shia muslims use for their grand ulema" ayoutullah" means " nishani of Allah" that shows they consider them and their rulings from God , a very high place , something from divine and God's connection and to disobey them means you have disobeyed the god almighty . Just read "Al-hakoomata_i_ Islamia" from "Ayoutullah Khoemani" , you will see on pg.no 79 , 78 that " Our ulemas and faqeeh have knowledge of everything , they neither sleep nor they get tired " and on pg no. 141 he writes" we cannot expect the least mistakes from our aymma or ayatullahs" Now you see in "aytul -qursi" the same properties are mention for Allah almighty.
It is very unfortunate that abdullah ibne saba got the weak point and we easily fell prey to it ...................

Re: Who killed Hazrat Hussain r.a?

Another thing, its a punishment on them from Allah, they will beat themselves till Qiyamat for leaving and betraying their so called 12 Imams. Those 11 Imams have nothing to do with Shias or their beliefs, I say 11 because 12th one doesnt even exist. Beating your self in the name of religion and reward? :snooty:

Re: Who killed Hazrat Hussain r.a?

Very nice read, thanks for sharing.

Re: Who killed Hazrat Hussain r.a?

Very true. Allah :swt: knows best.

Re: Who killed Hazrat Hussain r.a?

Just analyse what I had said and what you have spilt. . .Gosh man its unbelievable.

How the concept of Taqaiyyah came into play here?

I ask you to pin point any battle after the death of Proaphet till the battles of Ali's caliphate in which 'Ali participated either as a commander or as a soldier? If you can't find out any I request you to find out in history that what happend to "LION OF GOD" who fought with Prophet and killed hundreds of enemies of God and who also fought and killed thousands of enemies of God when he was old. Why the same LION OF GOD sat in home for nearly 25 years.

Also, find out for me that why the person who was regularly appointed by the Prophet as his deputy and governer of various provinces did not assume governship of any province for 25 years? wasn't he the same ALI? or is there some other game going on at that time?

btw, who told you that 'Ali was acting caliph when Umer went to Jerusalem?

Re: Who killed Hazrat Hussain r.a?

Those who lived with those Imams, listened to them, collected their sayings and traditions and complied it in books most certainly and most undoubtedly know better than those who are born in this century.

and beating ourselves due to grief and sorrow which comes from the atrocities inflicted by the Leaders of the Ahl-e-Sunnah on ahl-e-bait.

It is as simple as it is:

Re: Who killed Hazrat Hussain r.a?

[QUOTE]

I ask you to pin point any battle after the death of Proaphet till the battles of Ali's caliphate in which 'Ali participated either as a commander or as a soldier?

[/QUOTE]

Hazrat Ali r.a served as minister and vizer to the first three Caliphs.

[QUOTE]

btw, who told you that 'Ali was acting caliph when Umer went to Jerusalem

[/QUOTE]

Read your history, you will find out. If Khilafat was the right of Hazrat Ali r.a, now Hazrat Ali r.a had a good chance to take over, Hazrat Umer r.a was in Jerusalem.

Re: Who killed Hazrat Hussain r.a?

This argument certainly goes against your own standards.

If you think its "unjust" that caliphate is only for 'Ali's family, then how do you see that hadith [which you believe to be true] that all caliphs will be from Quraysh? Why on earth, should all caliphs had to be from Quraysh? Why any Irani or Egyptian couldn't be Caliph?

Was it Qurayshi hegemony?

Similarly, why all the major prophets had to be from Prophet Abraham's family? The Prophet [pbuh] was from Ishmael's and not from Isaac's? Why on earth The seal of the Prophets, the last and final Messenger, Khatam-al-mursaleen, Muhammad-e-Mustafaa ibn-e-Abdullah was born in Banu Hashim. Why not in Banu Umayyah?

Re: Who killed Hazrat Hussain r.a?

شہادت پر غم یا صبر ۔۔۔ ؟!۔

شہادت پر غم یا صبر ۔۔۔ ؟!۔
حضرت حسین (رض) اہل بیت میں سے ہیں ۔ لیکن ۔۔۔
حضرت علی رضی اللہ عنہ (آنحضرت صلی اللہ علیہ وسلم کے چچا زاد بھائی ) اور حضرت حمزہ رضی اللہ عنہ (آنحضرت صلی اللہ علیہ وسلم کے حقیقی چچا ) کا بھی اہل بیت میں شمار ہوتا ہے ۔
اسلام میں اگر کسی کی وفات کا دن بطور یومِ سوگ یا بطور یادگار دن ۔۔۔ منانے کا حکم ہوتا تو ۔۔۔
٭ کیا خلیفہ ء چہارم ، دامادِ رسول صلی اللہ علیہ وسلم ، حضرت علی (رض) کی شہادت کچھ کم غم انگیز تھی ؟ ۔(جسکے بعد خلافتِ راشدہ کا نظام ہی دگرگوں ہو گیا)۔
٭ کیا زبانِ رسالت سے ‘سید الشہداء‘ کا لقب پانے والے ، رسول اللہ صلی اللہ علیہ وسلم کے حقیقی چچا حضرت حمزہ (رض) کی شہادت کم درد انگیز تھی ؟
٭ کیا خلیفہ ء سوم ، دامادِ رسول صلی اللہ علیہ وسلم ، ذوالنورین حضرت عثمان (رض) کی شہادت کا واقعہ کچھ کم المناک واقعہ تھا ؟
٭ کیا خلیفہ ء دوم ، حضرت عمر فاروق (رض) کی شہادت اسلامی تاریخ کے لئے بالکل معمولی بات تھی ؟
٭ کیا اسلام میں سب سے پہلے شہادت پانے والی خاتون حضرت سمیہ (رض) کا واقعہ کچھ کم دردناک تھا ؟
٭٭ اور ان سب سے بھی بڑھ کر ۔۔۔
متعدد انبیاء اکرام علیہم السلام ، ظالموں کے ہاتھوں شہید ہو چکے تھے ۔۔۔
۔۔۔ تو پھر اِن تمام کے نام پر بھی ۔۔۔ یومِ سوگ یا یومِ ماتم یا یومِ وفات کی یادگار ۔۔۔ قدیم ترین زمانوں سے یا کم از کم نبی کریم صلی اللہ علیہ وسلم کے عہدِ مبارک سے ہی جاری ہونا چاہئے تھی ۔۔۔ کیونکہ ان تمام کا قتل ، حضرت حسین (رض) کے قتل سے زیادہ بڑا گناہ اور امت کے لئے زیادہ بڑی مصیبت تھا !!۔
لیکن ۔۔۔

یہ بالکل درست ہے کہ ۔۔۔
سیدنا حضرت حسین (رض) کی شہادت ، عظیم ترین گناہوں میں سے ایک گناہ تھا ۔
جنہوں نے یہ فعل کیا ، جنہوں نے اس میں مدد کی ، جو اس سے خوش ہوئے ۔۔۔ وہ سب کے سب اُس عتابِ الٰہی کے سزاوار ہیں جو ایسے لوگوں کے لئے شریعت میں وارد ہے !۔

یہ حوادث کتنے ہی دردناک ہوں ، ہر حال میں ان پر صبر کرنا اور ( اِنَّا لِلّٰہِ وَ اِنَّا اِلَیْہِ رَاجِعُونَ ) کہنا چاہئے کیونکہ اس سے اللہ خوش ہوتا ہے ۔ فرمانِ باری تعالیٰ ہے ؛
ان صبر گزاروں کو خوش خبری دے دیجئے ، جب انھیں کوئی مصیبت پہنچتی ہے تو ان کی زبان پر ( اِنَّا لِلّٰہِ وَ اِنَّا اِلَیْہِ رَاجِعُونَ ) جاری ہو جاتا ہے ۔۔۔
۔( سورۃ البقرہ : ١٥٥ ـ ١٥٦)۔
اور ہمارے مکرم ، ہمارے ہادی ، ہمارے شفیع رسول اللہ (صلی اللہ علیہ وسلم) کا ارشادِ مبارک ہے :
وہ شخص ہم میں سے نہیں ، جس نے رخسار پیٹے ، گریبان چاک کیے اور زمانہ ء جاہلیت کے سے بین کئے ۔
۔(صحیح بخاری ، کتاب الجنائز ، باب لیس منا من ضرب الخدود ح : ١٢٩٧)۔

Re: Who killed Hazrat Hussain r.a?

Books such as Al-Kafi were written 100s of years after your Imams and they attributed those lies to the Imams. They are free from that slander.

Re: Who killed Hazrat Hussain r.a?

NO he did not. and if you claim he did, the burden of proof lie on your shoulders.

[quote]
Read your history, you will find out. If Khilafat was the right of Hazrat Ali r.a, now Hazrat Ali r.a had a good chance to take over, Hazrat Umer r.a was in Jerusalem.
[/quote]

He certainly advised Umar as to what would be the best policy in that partiular battle but he did not serve as his deputy. I have read my books well. You need to read yours bro.

[quote]
If Khilafat was the right of Hazrat Ali r.a, now Hazrat Ali r.a had a good chance to take over, Hazrat Umer r.a was in Jerusalem.
[/quote]

So you want to equate 'Ali with Muaviyah? THIS is exactly what which differentiates 'Ali with his predecessors and his so called political successors. Even though his right was usurped, he never tried to snatch it back for the fear of the division among the newly Muslim Arabs. According to 'Ali's own words if he would have done that, the discord would have destroyed Islam in its infancy.

Re: Who killed Hazrat Hussain r.a?

yeah, The Prophet [pbuh] himself wrote a number of chapters of "Sahihs" of Bukhari and Muslim, right?

and you know, Sunan-e-Nisai and Tirmidhi was written by Umar and Uthman respectively.

Btw, State the date when Kafi was completed and how many years after Imam Mahdi's date of occulation. Also give the date of the first Sahih and the gap between dobs of its author's birth and Prophet's death.

Re: Who killed Hazrat Hussain r.a?

poor arguments
you totally have no knowledge of ahadees
i think you have read only the books and arguments of eniemes of islam

**
and second to all of you
stop abusing sahaba RA
they all are better then all of us
who ever abuse anyone , will do nothing to them but to himself
**

Re: Who killed Hazrat Hussain r.a?

My God, man. . .

put my lines into context and see what i'm trying to say and who i'm replying to.

It'll become clear.

on other note, I do not abuse Sahaba. I despise those who do so. I respect Sahaba from the core of my heart. I respect all those who stood for Islam and upheld the teachings of Al-Quran and Sunnah of the Prophet.

Re: Who killed Hazrat Hussain r.a?

the way you abuse Hazrat Ayehsa RA
shows your ignorance
you assigned wrong words from her

totally wrong and just an attempt to disrespect Hazrat Ayesha RA


its seems that some one injecting wrong statements on behalf of Hazrat Ali RA on one side and Hazrat Ayehsa RA on the other side
that muslim keep on fighting each other

this is totally useless thread and most of the arguments on both side are based on imagination and nothing more

plz plz just stop that

by this you all are abusing sahaba RA
and your fight will do nothing to them but add your punishment in the next life

we are not judge to make sentence that who was good and who was wrong

Re: Who killed Hazrat Hussain r.a?

topic going where it shud not, hence closed