Which calender system is Islamic?

Society Religion & Philosophy
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Salamun Alaikum
Can anybody tell me which Ayat of Holy Quraan leads towards sighting of moon for the purpose of starting the month and calculation of calendar?

Iltemase dua

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Re: Which calender system is Islamic?

Quran 9:36
Lo! the number of the months with Allah is twelve months by Allah's ordinance in the day that He created the heavens and the earth. Four of them are sacred: that is the right religion.

if u focus on "four of them are sacred" u will get your answer....

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Re: Which calender system is Islamic?

Sorry! I could not understand what you are indicating for. does it have any relevance to my question?

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Re: Which calender system is Islamic?

Salamun Alaikum

The Ayat you refer as has been translated by Shakir says:

Surely the number of months with Allah is twelve months in Allah's ordinance since the day when He created the heavens and the earth, of these four being sacred; that is the right reckoning; therefore be not unjust to yourselves regarding them, and fight the polytheists all together as they fight you all together; and know that Allah is with those who guard (against evil).

You can ascertain the following meanings from the above ayat;[/FONT

It is for sure that the count of months is twelve in Allah’s Ordinance;
It has been fixed since inception, i.e., from the day of creation of heavens and earth(s).

It means that the first day of first month should be the day of creation or you can say that the New Year should be started from the day of creation.

Out of these twelve months four are declared as sacred and fighting with enemies and invasion is prohibited in these months;

The most important phrase in this ayat to which you can say the ‘punch line’ is “zalika deen-il-qayyam” which in fact means that “that is what the un-changeable and eternal constitution”.

So in the light of above kindly explain me if there is any reference to moon sighting in these verses?

Moon was created on 6th day of creation week, and in ahadees it is revealed that moon was created at its ‘*Badr’ i.e., *14th night position. So how can moon sighting be possible for ascertaining the beginning of calendar?

Iltemase Dua

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Re: Which calender system is Islamic?

the verse clearly tells u that the number of months by Allah is twelve, of which 4 are sacred....
so this means that these r the months that Allah orders u to follow....
which r these 12 months????
Allah says that 4 of these r sacred....
we all know that the sacred months r according to the lunar calendar followed by arabs....
so it is this lunar calendar that Allah wants u to follow....
the calendar was not started by Muhammad (saw), it existed before him....

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Re: Which calender system is Islamic?

Salam

If someone else may share his views as brother Armughal seemingly not understanding the question. In his opinion, I think, Islamic months are synonymous to lunar date system or Lunar Calendar. I humbly differ.

Iltemase dua

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Re: Which calender system is Islamic?

Salam

If someone else may share his views as brother Armughal seemingly not understanding the question. In his opinion, I think, Islamic months are synonymous to lunar date system or Lunar Calendar. I humbly differ.

Iltemase dua

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Re: Which calender system is Islamic?

Salam

If someone else may share his views as brother Armughal seemingly not understanding the question. In his opinion, I think, Islamic months are synonymous to lunar date system or Lunar Calendar. I humbly differ.

Iltemase dua

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Re: Which calender system is Islamic?

Solar calender is twelve months as well! :5:

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Re: Which calender system is Islamic?

You mean Islamic calender should also be based on solar movement instead of lunar movement?

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Re: Which calender system is Islamic?

Salamun alaikum

I simply asked that "which Ayat of Holy Quraan leads towards sighting of moon for the purpose of starting the month and calculation of calendar?"

Iltemase dua

Eye Makeup!
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Re: Which calender system is Islamic?

so which of the four months of the solar calendar r “sacred”???

danish bhai, i cant be more clear in saying it than i have already…

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Re: Which calender system is Islamic?

And which is the first date of the first month? (mind it that moon has not yet been created. The creation/birth date of the moon is 6th of first month. and it was created at the position for 'Badr' (14th night position) 6th day of creation. Isn't it interesting?

I understand what you have said, but my question is a little bit different. Be patient and you will understand soon what I was asking for.

Iltimase dua

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Re: Which calender system is Islamic?

This site may help you in understanding things.

Sheyn Barah bajega
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Re: Which calender system is Islamic?

Thanx, it is really informative one and I found a lot of usefull articles there but none have discussed the issue I have raised. ICOP mostly discussed the visibility problems, procedures of abserving new moon and universal Hijric Calendar based on various methods. So my question remains un-answered.

Naina Is leaving GS Gud Bye Frndz
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Re: Which calender system is Islamic?

هُوَ الَّذِي جَعَلَ الشَّمْسَ ضِيَاء وَالْقَمَرَ نُورًا وَقَدَّرَهُ مَنَازِلَ لِتَعْلَمُواْ عَدَدَ السِّنِينَ وَالْحِسَابَ مَا خَلَقَ اللّهُ ذَلِكَ إِلاَّ بِالْحَقِّ يُفَصِّلُ الآيَاتِ لِقَوْمٍ يَعْلَمُونَ
10.5] He it is Who made the sun a shining brightness and the moon a light, and ordained for it mansions that you might know the computation of years and the reckoning. Allah did not create it but with truth; He makes the signs manifest for a people.

Both calendars can be used, in my personal opinion Solar is good for calculating a day and Lunar for month.
In Lunar calendar just by viewing cresent we can mark first day of month and similary from waxing to full moon and then from waning to its disappearing we can calculate complete month.
Even though you've mentioned moon was created as 'Badr' but it doesn't mean we should use 'Badr' as first day of month, like Adam was created as an adult but life span of a normal human begins from birth. You know what I mean.

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Re: Which calender system is Islamic?

Peace shriek11 and Others

The solar calendar has not always been a twleve month calendar. There used to be only 10 months.

July and August I believe are add ons. The proof is in the names:

Sept = 7, but now it is the 9th month
Oct = 8, but now it is the 10th month
Nov = 9, but now it is the 11th month
Dec = 10, but now it is the 12th month

We follow the Gregorian calendar system in the West, this used to be the Julian calendar system. Orthodox Christians still celebrate their festivals in accordance with the Julian calendar.

Jews follow the lunar calendar system, but the Islamic calendar system is only slightly different to the standard lunar calendar.

The standard lunar calendar starts the new moon from conjunction i.e. no parts of moon visible.

The Islamic calendar system starts each month from the hilal, which is the visual determination of the waxing crescent.

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Re: Which calender system is Islamic?

I accept your right to form your own opinion, but being a Muslim we should prefer to find as to what the will of Allah Swt is. And for this you should first consult the Quraan and then the Ahadeeth. It is my principle instance for forming opinion on any issue.

In this case, the translation of Ayat you referred in Abdullah YousufAli is "10:5] It is He Who made the sun to be a shining glory and the moon to be a light (of beauty), and measured out stages for her; that ye might know the number of years and the count (of time). Nowise did Allah create this but in truth and righteousness. (Thus) doth He explain His Signs in detail, for those who understand." Can you just told me how can your determine the number of years and count of time leaving apart the Sun? Knowing the number of years and count of time can only be attributed to the Sun which is made to be a shining glory.

And if you feel some difficulty in understanding it then refer Ayat No.12 of Sura Al-Asraa~ Which says "We have made the Night and the Day as two (of Our) Signs: the Sign of the Night have We obscured, while the Sign of the Day We have made to enlighten you; that ye may seek bounty from your Lord, and that ye may know the number and count of the years: all things have We explained in detail." In this ayat Allah has used the words 'Lail' and 'Nahar' instead of Qamar and Shams. and you can easily understand that it is the only "Sun" which causes the transitional phenomena of day and night, Moon has nothing to do in changing day into night and vice versa. Therefore, it is obvious that Moon has nothing to do with calendar system.

Further, lets analyze rationally as to why we need a date system or calendar, we will find it out that there are three basic requirements a calendar system should and must provide. We should be able: 1. To maintain and compile our history chronologically. 2. To observer the sanctity of the days of remembrance, and 3. To schedule our future events and programs. The lunar date system appears completely unsuccessful to meet any of the above requirements. Neither we can say for sure about our past events nor can we certainly predict our tomorrow. On so many times we even remain doubtful about our current date, and it has been established on various occasions that we have mistaken in determining the current date. So what purpose lunar calendar is serving except making people confused?

I think the example you have given has no relevance to the subject matter as from creation of Hazrat Adam A.S. we have not been instructed to start any calculation whereas the calendar has to be started from the date of creation of heaven and earth. and this system of calculation has eternal application because it has been declared as ‘deen-e-qayyam’ which term can be translated as ‘everlasting constitution’ and in Urdu it means ‘daimi qanoon’.

Iltemase Dua

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Re: Which calender system is Islamic?

I guess you missed that part, calculating a month is so simple by viewing crescent you can determine the first day of a month and when you see full moon its the mid of the month and when you see another new moon thats the beginning of new month.

9:36 "Lo! the **number of the months with Allah is twelve months* by Allah's ordinance in the day that He created the heavens and the earth. Four of them are sacred: that is the right religion."*

When you finish calculating 12 months in the way explained above you can calculate a full year.


Yes I told you before and am telling you again.

♥ Get Well Soon VirgoGirl ♥
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Re: Which calender system is Islamic?

I am sure you really don’t mean “calculating”, because at the most you can do is to start the month by viewing crescent. There is no calculation involved in this process. By default it is a flawed statement.

Further, read it very carefully, you must not be aware of the fact that there is another crescent which appears on 27th or 28th of lunar month just before dawn. So why don’t you start the new month from that crescent? Logically you should start new month on viewing pre-dawn crescent and end the month on viewing evening crescent. But in this case your month shall only be of two and half days. But if you are adamant to start your new month from evening crescent then you should end it on viewing pre-dawn crescent. In this case your month will be of 27 or 28 days. And you know why? It is because of the fact that moon move completely around the celestial sphere of earth once in about 27.3 days. And resultantly, in fact, the moon completes its orbital journey** around the earth*, in 355 days, *13 times . And this is what a great scientific proof that lunar calendar system is fictitious.

*** If it is so simple then:***

*** Why*** people of the world may not have the same date ever?

*** Why*** Muslims of any country quarrel every next month on the subject of ‘ruyate hilal’?

*** Why*** can you not say for sure what day was on 30 Ramadan 1248 AH?

And, by the way, can you certainly say whether there was a day which had dated 30 Ramadan 1248, in Karachi, in Saudi Arabia, In Toronto and in Madrid?

*** Why*** can you not say for sure what date will be exactly after 30 days?

*** What*** a Muslim departing from Jeddah on the morning of 1st Shawwal after offering Eid prayer will do on arriving at Karachi on 28th or 29th of Ramadan?

A Contract is going to be signed between a Saudi and a Pakistani company on 27th June 2007. **What **date this document will bear if both plan to use Islamic lunar date?

Do you need some more** why's** and whats on this subjec?

Now read this ayat again and your explaination in the light of scientific fact I have mentioned above.

WiseGuy, be a wise-guy and do not post just for the sake of posting more.

Iltemase dua