Re: When kids turning Teens, should we go back to Pakistan?
i get where you are coming from Razia, i do think that one should plan ahead and move when kids are young, maybe 5-6 yrs old. at age 12/13 a lot of the demage has been done already.
I know Pakistan has advanced a lot in the past few years but it still is not as advanced as US/UK etc. If you make the right move at the right time things can turn out okay, but if you make the right move at the wrong time it wont do you or kids any good. WE dont have any kids yet but we plan on moving back either to home land or middle east once the oldest kid hits 5th bday. sure life will be tough there or at least not like here but in the long run if your kids turn out to be good humans and mulims that will make up for everything else.
You can raise pretty paindu kids in Amreeka etc as well. Have enough of the desi community around you and the kids might speak urdu muun mor mor kay, but their views will still be very desified.
Re: When kids turning Teens, should we go back to Pakistan?
^ what damage man. I know few girls in USA that really I want them to be the role models for my daughters. Nice, shareef, educated, obedient, religious; there parents have done one phenomenal job on them, and that also without depriving them from any worldly luxuries.
I used damage for lack of better words. Point being that if you need to make an impact on a child being with them being Nice, shareef, educated, obedient, religious- *The parenting and disciplining has to start very earlyon. It's a little late in the game to start at teenage years.
*
Re: When kids turning Teens, should we go back to Pakistan?
As Nikki said....you have to reflect upon your goals and reasons for moving there. If it's financial....then I imagine with economy being strained the world over....it would be especially worse in countries like Pakistan. If it's because you think that teenagers would be more "respectful" and "less out of hand" if they move to Pakistan.......then maybe some reflection over parenting needs to take place....as there are negative influences everywhere.
sometimes it's cheaper to send your kids to school there. I know many parents have moved back so their kids can go to medical school there which are 1. cheaper 2. take less time to graduate. That was there only consideration and then they'll move back.
Re: When kids turning Teens, should we go back to Pakistan?
Jafri - there is nothing wrong with that. If you parents intention is that it will shave 2-3 years off your studies, you settle down in your career sooner - then why not.
My phoopho took her kids to syria for a year when they were teenagers. Both of my cousins lost 1/2 a year of school but gained so much from a culture and Islamic studies perspective it was well worth it for them.
Mind you it didn't keep them from rebelling as teenagers - but as adults the experience was defining for them.
Re: When kids turning Teens, should we go back to Pakistan?
Here in US/ Canada I feel a point comes up when you loose your rights on kids turning 18. The independent life here I see kids want to go through....though right now I am far from such a situation but planning ahead why going back home.
Western culture is dominating in Pakistn too but still there are values we have.
Re: When kids turning Teens, should we go back to Pakistan?
You can be a good parent to your child in the West and a bad parent to your child in Pakistan. It's about how YOU as a parent nurture, raise and instill values in your child. Yes, I know, some kids do misbehave regardless of their parents best efforts - and we cannot always blame parenting. But, that (a misbehaving, *bay-*raah child) could happen regardless of where you live.
So like someone above said, you need to figure out why you want to move back.
Re: When kids turning Teens, should we go back to Pakistan?
Here in US/ Canada I feel a point comes up when you loose your rights on kids turning 18. The independent life here I see kids want to go through....though right now I am far from such a situation but planning ahead why going back home.
Western culture is dominating in Pakistn too but still there are values we have.
I have seen families here in US where kids are still living in a joint family system, taking care of parents and all. So I think not all cultural values are lost.
I have also seen some kids who have lost all of the islamic values so we do have a mix of all kinds of people.
And as someone else pointed out, there is all sort of stuff that happens in big cities. I just want to add that small cities/towns are also not free of it. I have heard of premarital pregnancies, girls running away and all kind of stuff (which I for sure know is not gossip). You can google and see what happens in colleges in Karachi/Islamabad. (Not that I am googling such stuff up but I got a forwarded email once of a youtube video so am just referring)
When I was visiting Pakistan, I could not watch TV (Pakistani dramas) with my brother, or BIL so TV is as bad as it is here. You have to control what your kids watch even if you are in Pakistan. Kids learn a lot from media and their peers.
Have lived in Middle East as well and atleast Dubai is as westernized as it can get.
All of this does not mean that all the kids growing up in Pakistan or Middle East are going to be bad or without any morals just like all desi/muslim kids growing up in west are not going to lose their morals.
I do understand that it may be a little difficult here or to put it another way you have to make bit more effort when living in West but in the end it depends on so many other things as well and not just the country you are living in.
Talk to other members of your family living in Pakistan and talk to muslim families you know here.
Ofcourse the decision should be yours and you do not want to feel later in life that you should have moved back to Pakistan when you still had a chance.
Re: When kids turning Teens, should we go back to Pakistan?
You can be a good parent to your child in the West and a bad parent to your child in Pakistan. It's about how YOU as a parent nurture, raise and instill values in your child. Yes, I know, some kids do misbehave regardless of their parents best efforts - and we cannot always blame parenting. But, that (a misbehaving, *bay-*raah child) could happen regardless of where you live.
So like someone above said, you need to figure out why you want to move back.
Exactly!!! I know of many people who when they're in pakistan moan about how kids in the west are so bad blah blah, seriously, its not the country that raises the kids, its the parents and with a bit of effort they can instill good values and morals in their kids, regardless of where they live.
Re: When kids turning Teens, should we go back to Pakistan?
also, pakistan isn't the safest place in the world these days, and they haven't even figured out their basic amenities like clean running water and electricity yet. i would NOT put my children in an environment like that voluntarily. i want my kids to have access to at least the basics in life including being able to walk down the street without being afraid for their lives. maybe it sounds a bit dramatic but everytime i go to karachi, i'm always stressed out - there's hungamay and its not safe to go out at night even if you're staying in the defence area, and truthfully, i've been away from it for too long to dismiss these things and just continue on as if its not a big deal. i get why people living there are so complacent about these things- after all, if you live there, what choice do you have, right? but AH i do have a choice and i'd rather raise my children in the west in the middle of a healthy living environment, clean air, opportunities to progress in life, and primarily, surrounded by family and friends. you have to trust that iA, as a parent, you'll be successful in raising good people. and then, too, there are no guarantees your kids wlll be a particular way where ever they're raised- they could be just as far from religion despite your best efforts in the middle of pakistan as they might be great muslims in the mid-west in the US. as others have stated, its more up to you as a parent than the country you are in.
also, hubby ain't desi and i think he'd rather eat his right hand than move to pakistan lol :p but to be fair, i'd probably do the same rather than move to his corner of eastern europe!
Re: When kids turning Teens, should we go back to Pakistan?
also, pakistan isn't the safest place in the world these days, and they haven't even figured out their basic amenities like clean running water and electricity yet. i would NOT put my children in an environment like that voluntarily. i want my kids to have access to at least the basics in life including being able to walk down the street without being afraid for their lives. maybe it sounds a bit dramatic but everytime i go to karachi, i'm always stressed out - there's hungamay and its not safe to go out at night even if you're staying in the defence area, and truthfully, i've been away from it for too long to dismiss these things and just continue on as if its not a big deal. i get why people living there are so complacent about these things- after all, if you live there, what choice do you have, right? but AH i do have a choice and i'd rather raise my children in the west in the middle of a healthy living environment, clean air, opportunities to progress in life, and primarily, surrounded by family and friends. you have to trust that iA, as a parent, you'll be successful in raising good people. and then, too, there are no guarantees your kids wlll be a particular way where ever they're raised- they could be just as far from religion despite your best efforts in the middle of pakistan as they might be great muslims in the mid-west in the US. as others have stated, its more up to you as a parent than the country you are in.
also, hubby ain't desi and i think he'd rather eat his right hand than move to pakistan lol :p but to be fair, i'd probably do the same rather than move to his corner of eastern europe!
this is so right. my In Laws live in Rawalpindi and their area is hotspot for suicide bombings. in fact nearly ever street in their area has been targeted. when we go for a visit, we are not allowed to go out; have to think 1000 times before stepping out.......too much restrictions on going out; can not go for shopping etc......plus in-laws are extra careful about it.
we rarely enjoy when visiting. i feel like trapped in the house. and my father in law doesnt want us to move back to pakistan even though hubby talks about it.
Re: When kids turning Teens, should we go back to Pakistan?
What are people going on and on about the Middle East for? Absolutely zero integration of any kind, separation between locals versus foreigners is ingrained in every aspect of life from renting a house, to sending kids to school. No future growth opportunities for children beyond primary schooling, only Qatar and Dubai have limited number of universities for foreigners which cost as much as sending children to college in the West. Constant threat of losing job especially given the current economic and social situation, which means having to move back any time. Not to mention, you are teaching your children that it is OK to be paid less and have fewer benefits because your passport is green.
And when are schools for foreigners (those expensive good ones, not Embassy school) in the Middle East Islamic oriented?
Also, those days of 80s and 90s when employers were paying for everything are long gone. They have wised up, and now put the burden of finding and paying for housing on the employees. They could not keep up with the the fast rising rent.
Re: When kids turning Teens, should we go back to Pakistan?
**Probably, it was a good idea, i think, a quarter of a century ago, but now, its isn't such a great idea because its NOT gonna make a very big big difference. Pakistan/India has 'advanced' a great deal because we ran after the "western" life-style and adopted it with a smiling face. i would think there isn't much of a difference between the west and the sub-continent when it comes to raising children. there is equal chance that the kid might go astray.
we, as a parent, still can raise kids in the west just as good if we invest our time and effort. :)**
I agree with this.
I haven't read what the rest of the posts say, but these days many people back home do as much and perhaps more when it is hidden (which it often is).
Re: When kids turning Teens, should we go back to Pakistan?
if you want to do it to keep them safe ,your’e living in a dream world…
from personal experience when i first came to pakistan as a teenager kids here were doing things we would not even dream of doing…!!!
they had more freedom and more boy cousins were smoking then I thought possible …
the girls fully covered in shalwar kamise were more transparent than us in our humble jean n long top…boy did I feel paindu…
education wise people go to west for the next level and you want to send them here…D’uh!
If you feel they will benefit religiously…maybe a little bit …
general rule of thumb..ghar ki tarbiyaat counts for alot in any society..
plz take the time to teach your children moral values and trust in them to do well,they live in a socety that will help them stand up for themselves…
teach them right from wrong and instil in them Allah kay values…leave the rest as they will do what they will do by Allah’s will…
Re: When kids turning Teens, should we go back to Pakistan?
But if it's in their best interest, parents have the right to make that decision for them. Exposure to a different culture can really open up a world of experience for kids especially during teenage years. They won't like it now but they might thank their parents for giving them that experience in the long run.
best to take them to the different culture on a 3 month holiday.....
a friend went to pakistan for summer holidays every year...knew the reality of life here,and refused every rishta from pakistan and is now happily married to a muslim guy from england..
dont make pakistan sound like a bed of roses every country has its up and downs
always state the facts kids will adapt better...
Re: When kids turning Teens, should we go back to Pakistan?
and what if you want your children to learn Pakistani culture and islamic value.
well one of my brother want to shift to Pakistan for this reason and plus life is more fun in pak.
does your brother not have any desi family or friends in the US? islamic values don't just come from living in Pakistan either, btw. they start, and are learnt, at home first. this kind of assumption is a little bit insulting to those who've been raised in the west and are fully aware of their cultural and religious identities. how do you think their parents did it?
Re: When kids turning Teens, should we go back to Pakistan?
Here in US/ Canada I feel a point comes up when you loose your rights on kids turning 18. The independent life here I see kids want to go through....though right now I am far from such a situation but planning ahead why going back home.
Western culture is dominating in Pakistn too but still there are values we have.
You know guys, everyone is saying, well if you want to raise them with Pakistani values and Islamic values in the West, you can. And sure that's true. But there is no doubt about the fact that as they reach their late teens and early twenties, no matter what you have taught them, it is much more likely that they wills tart living life on their own terms, and with a greater degree of freedom in the US/Canada than in Pakistan. There isn't the same time of societal pressure/support that encourages Pakistani values or religious ones (I'm not even talking specifically Islamic values; I think our American culture has a hard time understanding and conveying a truly religious mindset).
You can say, well if you teach them right they will follow-through on these teachings, and I agree with that. But they will falter. And the power will be in their hands. It will be their choice.
The question is whether or not you are okay with that.
