When Did Sunniisim Sect Start?

Society Religion & Philosophy
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When did the Sunni Sects Exist?

It is certain that there was nothing called “Sunni sects” in the
lifetime ofthe Holy Prophet (s.w.), not even after his demise. The
Sunni sects have emerged in the 3rd and 4th centuries (Hijri) as a
result of political and dogmatic differences. Some of those sects
have been abrogated andother were authorized.
We have here some questions in regard to this subject:
1- Why were some of those sects authroized and other were
rejected?Are there any Quranic evidences and demonstrations, or
prophetic traditions that urge us to follow, for example, the Hanafi
or Maaliki sect?Weren’t the founders of the rejected sects
mujtahids? If so, hasn’t any mujtahis the right to disclose his own
opinion, like Abu Hanifa who practised ijtihad - which he remained
doing so till the end of his life?

2- Were the four famous sects existing in the time of the caliphs?
Were the caliphs performing their duties and judging people
according to their own opinions?
We can notice the great difference between the Sunnis in the time
of the Umayyad, Abbasid, and the Ottoman dynasties, and
between the Sunnis in present time, especially in regard to issues
of fiqh and beliefs.

3- Can we trust those traditions fabricated by the oppressive
Umayyad,Abbasid and Ottoman caliphs; traditions which were
fabricated in their own benefit and to keep them in power -
traditions which were cosider to be the exact words of the Holy
Prophet (s.w.)?

4- Can we regard all the savage behaviours of the partisans called
“the Army of Sahabah” or the Wahhabites as Islamic propagation,
and that they are guiding people to the true rules of Islam? Are the
Sunnis propagating the true sunnah of the Holy Prophet (s.w.), or in
fact, theyare propagating the sunnah of the Umayyads and the
Abbasids?

5- Were there any sects in the lifetime of the Holy Prophet (s.w.)?
Allhistorical records confirm that there were not any sects in that
time.Moreover, the term “Sunni” had generated in the time of
Mu`awiyah and later on.

6- Wasn’t the belief of the determinists declaring that man must
obey hisruler, no matter whether he (i.e. the ruler) was just or
oppressor? Wasn’t the opinion that “all the companions are just”
derived from the false traditions which Mu`awiyah and the
Umayyads had generated?

7- Is it correct to return to the old texts of a person who died
centuries ago, to derive new issues?

8- Why do the Sunnis return to persons who died 13 centuries ago
while they can consult contemporary scholars (faqihs) and eminent
ulamawho have obtained high ranks not less than those who have pasted? Why isn't there any scholar (mujtahid) among the Sunnis who can save them from disputes and answer their religious questions of the day, while the Shiites have many scholars in every time and
place?
Is the present knowledge and science the same as the knowledge
and science of past times? Are the needs of our communities
today the sameas those which were existing 1,300 years ago?

9- Why don’t the Sunnis follow the fatwa of the shaykh
Mahmoud Shaltoot, the dean al-Azhar who considered Shiism as an authorized sect, as he says it depends on the intellectual and fiqh bases? Isn't thata clear religious prejudice? Is not Shiism the
right sect which is basedon that which the Holy Prophet (s.w.) had
recommended? Wasn’t the famous tradition (i.e., “I am leaving with
you two weighty things(Thaqalayn); if you adhered to them, you
won’t be misguided at all. Theyare the Book of Allah and my
family”) sufficient to follow the Shia sect?Have you any other evidences to prove the correctness of the famous four sects? Surely the answer will be "NO"! If you study the Shia books without
partisanship or prejudice, you will certainly not find any kind
of contradictions and you will notice that they are not forging lies
against anyone. However, we may find some Sunnis when they
want to investigate other sects and their beliefs, they depend only
on their own scholars’ (shaykhs’) speeches and opinions without
paying any attention to the ideas of the `ulama of the other sects. Is
it correct to follow such methodology to investigate another sects’
teachings?

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Is watcher, Zalim ect. around or are they just to wrong to face right? Or maybe Chonnkee Daari (which means watch guard) should reply?

3

when did the shia sect first start?

allah hafiz

4

so you mean shia is the only sect existing since the rise of Islam.

Mind you one thing, this is the prophecy of Holy Prophet(sa) that there will be time when His ummah will be splited into several different sects. Today only a blind cannot see the ripping of islam into these existing sect like bralwis, wahabis, deobandis and so on.

Be it Sunnis -the main stream of Islam, the Shias -the second in majority, or any other minority sect, all claims equally and with great enthusiasm that they are the perfect followers of Islam.

Yet all forget one important aspect of the later part of prophecy, it goes like “all will be thrown into hell except one” .. so my dear, will this decision be made by particular Humans that they will go to Haven and the rest to Hell?

  • If YES then no problem, continue your practice.

  • If NO then consider the existence of Living Allah and ask his guidance to help you choose the right path. Think for a sec, you might be wrong. Instead of considering yourself as perfect one, ask Allah for the true path, surely He will not misguide you.

[This message has been edited by Zalim (edited November 06, 2000).]

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Hey Admin, where are you now? I guess when we say something TRUE about shiaism, you get mad. And when they make up false stuff you respect that? :hoohn:

Shah, Do you know what sunni means? I don’t think you do, let me tell you. It means follower of prophets SUNNAH. Companions of prophet followed the sunnah of prophet. At the time the prophet was alive and after he died. They kept following him. Even when prophet Mohammad was alive, sahahab followed the sunnah of Prophet.

So turns out, people were “sunni” or followers of prophets way of life(sunnah) at the time when Prophet was alive and continue to do so up til today. On ther other hand shiaism is a “bid’ah” in religion of you look at it with “following the sunnah” of prophet.

Zalim,

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V~V~VHe came, He saw, He conqueredV~V~V**

[This message has been edited by The Watcher (edited November 04, 2000).]

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There is no sect called Sunnism, it is all muslims which follow true to the way of Allah (SWT) and Sunn'a (Hadeeth & Tridition) of the Holy Prophet. This is the way a vast majority of muslims had taken.

[This message has been edited by Musalman (edited November 04, 2000).]

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who said shia dont follow the sunnah of Prophet? shia only means the follower of Imam Ali..these khalifa became muslims for their political reasons..Prophet said many times it will be Ali

The Prophet of Allah (saw) said, indicating Ali. This is my brother, my trustee and my deputy [caliph] after me, so listen to him and obey him." [94]

[94]
Tarikh, al Tabari, vol 2 p319
al Sirah al Halabiyah, vol 1 p 311
Shawahid al Tanzil, vol 1 p 371
Kanz al Ummal, vol 15 p 15
Tarikh, Ibn Asakir, vol 1 p 85
Tafsir, Ala al Din al Shafi'i, vol 3 p 371
The Life of Muhammad by Hasanyn Haykal, First Edition (Section on: And admonish your nearest, your kinsmen)

. The Prophetic tradition: "I am the city of Knowledge and Ali is its gate."

This tradition [88] alone should be sufficient to indicate the example that has to he followed after the Messenger of Allah (saw) because the educated man ought to be followed.

[88]
Mustadrak, al Hakim, vol 3 p 127
Tarikh, Ibn Kathir, vol 7 p 358

"Is He then Who guides to the truth more worthy to be followed, or he who himself does not go aright unless he is guided? What then is the matter with you; how do you judge?" [Holy Quran 10:35]

History has recorded many facts telling us that Ali was the most knowledgeable man among all the Companions and they used to consult him on every important matter, and we do not know of any event in which he declined to give his advice.

Abu Bakr said, "May Allah never put me in a predicament that Abu al-Hasan cannot solve. " And Umar said, "If it was not for Ali, Umar would have perished." [89]

[89]
al Isti'ab, vol 3 p 39
Manaqib al Khawarizmi, p 48
al Riyadh al Nadirah, vol 2 p 194

u decide who should have been followed..we shia(follower) believe Imam Ali..

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Yeah yeah, whatever man. Another episode of distored facts. Come on already.

Watcher pushes the ~IGNORE~ button. BYE BYE babye.

http://www3.pak.org/gupshup/smilies/smile.gif

Take it like it is.

http://www3.pak.org/gupshup/smilies/biggrin.gif

QURAN AND SUNNAH

V~V~VHe came, He saw, He conqueredV~V~V**

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Hazrat Ali (RA) Lion of Allah (SWT) was no doubt one of the greatest Momin. He did in-fact became the leader of the faithful (Khalifa). So I do not know what is the problem. Muslim of that era did not rejected his Khilafat, but on the same token there was no need to make a separate party of Ali (Shia tul Ali) among the main stream Muslims. If Shia thought there was some thing wrong then the need was to correct it and not make a separate sect in Islam.

Consider the following Ayat’s of Quran:

A-li Imran:103 " And hold fast, All TOGETHER, by the rope which Allah (stretches out for you), and be NOT DIVIDED AMONG YOURSELVES; … "

A-li Imran:105 "Be NOT like those WHO ARE DIVIDED AMONGST THEMSELVES and fall into disputations … "

Al An’am:159 "AS for those who DIVIDE their religion and break up into sects, you have no part in them in the least: Their affair is with Allah: He will in the end tell them the truth of all that they did.

Al Mu’minun :53: But people have cut off their affair (of unity), between them, into sects: Each party rejoices in that which is with itself"

Al Rum:32 “Those who SPLIT up their religion, and become mere sects each party rejoicing in that which is with itself!”

Al Shura:13: "…that ye should remain steadfast in religion and make no DIVISIONS therein… "

Islam during the time of Holy Prophet (PBUH) was never called Shia, then why called it now, why deviate from the vast majority of Muslims and be called Shia.

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Watch they will bring counter arguments and argue with the quranic verses. They will put forth their own version of unity. May Allah guide them in the light of QURAN and SUNNAH. AMeen.

*V~V~V*He came, He saw, He conquered*V~V~V*

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to be honest with u 99% of my friends are sunni..the only difference we have is the khalifas
and if u take a look at facts, history and ur own books u will notice it as well..i feel really strong about that

whatever the differences are i say we should still be united..but people like watcher comes, misinterperate things..make others hate each other..after all this they say

take it easy sir

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*who said shia dont follow the sunnah of Prophet? shia only means the follower of Imam Ali..these khalifa became muslims for their political reasons..Prophet said many times it will be Ali *

i didn't now ppl can be that stupid sheraz
we respect Hazrat Ali n there is no doubt he was close to Hazrat Muhammad PBUH but how can u support ur above statement.

Wasn't it was Hazrat Abu bakr who accompanied Hazrat Muhammad PBUH when HE pbuh was comin from mecca to madina.
this means Hazrat Muhammad pbuh trusted him with his.

i have only one questions for all my shia brothers/sis how come u guys always try to disrespect the khalifas before Hazrat Ali
in my opinion u should respect them for only beign the companions of Hazrat Muhammad.

i have never heard a sunni disrespectinh Hazrat Ali coz Hazrat Ali is as respectful as all other Khulifas are

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[quote]
Originally posted by Zalim:
**so you mean shia is the only sect existing since the rise of Islam. All others are . - indeed they are.

**
[/quote]

WHAT IS THIS SUPPOSED TO MEAN???
Yoohoo?? Admin?? u watching the use of derogatory language here??

[This message has been edited by Girl from Quraysh (edited November 05, 2000).]

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zabardast yaar. You good a valid point about “ijtehad” there. Nobody is able to answer it yet.

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Maybe because nobody is able to answer it

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Are you an alim by the way?

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Cool guy is praising his other nick name here "shah Jahan" What a rip off!!!

Oey jaa apney imaam ko worship kar...he is caling you jaa jaah!

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Wondering if the other side has a “valid” answer for the facts unwrapped by you brother shah jahan. Looks like you have quite good knowledge about Islamic history and events.

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chonkee dar, tameez sey, apna shajra aur apney khoon kee nijasat na kholo mian. Mon tore donga samjhey agar merey imam key barey mein eik lafz bhee mon sey nikala, clear?

shah jahan is another brother. Wonder when you weirdos dont have answer to questions asked, why do you start yelling instead of answering? Why so quick to lose temper? Is that what your man baap taught you? Good, giving very good name to your parents. Its not you, your filthy blood's nijasat (filth) talking!

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Good question brother and no ** valid** answer yet.

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tum esa karoo..mera mu na toro…tumain tumara apna kala muun nazarr aah raha hai naa monitor main? haan us par thookk(spit) doo. bass. Tum ye kaam kar do…tumareyy dads jo bhi hain..wo sub tum se buhat khush hoon gay lol

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http://www3.pak.org/gupshup/smilies/hehe.gif

laterzzz..

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