What Really Happens In The Church of Scientology

[ajazali]

Re: What Really Happens In The Church of Scientology

with these comments, I guess you are telling us you are superior intellectually because you are open to changing beliefs. lolz.

@Theorist

..So are many other “facts” in most religions. You are I are in agreement. At the end of the day, we subconsciously accept ideas and facts that reinforce our predisposed beliefs. We readily believe those who reassure that our beliefs are correct instead of out right denying something no matter how much we want to believe it. That is true for all of us. It’s human nature.

@Theorist

My beliefs are not set in stone and they will never be, PCG. I don’t hate Islam or or any religion. I used to. I don’t anyway. We believe what we want to.

[psyah]

Re: What Really Happens In The Church of Scientology

@Theorist

..So are many other “facts” in most religions. You are I are in agreement. At the end of the day, we subconsciously accept ideas and facts that reinforce our predisposed beliefs. We readily believe those who reassure that our beliefs are correct instead of out right denying something no matter how much we want to believe it. That is true for all of us. It’s human nature.

Peace Theorist

Well yes and no … some things appear in some beliefs without substantiation … the idea of virgin birth is substantiated. I mean that it has a context.

Taking for example the myth of Ganesh and the replacement of a boy’s head with that of an elephant and that deserving worship. This is nothing like virgin birth even though to careless minds it may seem to be so. Admittedly, both are unlikely to happen in our lives as empirically measurable events.

However, the context of virgin birth is neither to worship Mary (AS) nor worship Isa (AS). It is based on a “sign” of the coming of the Messiah. It is also to show that God can Create without the need of normal “means” the asbab … That Adam (AS) was created without there being a male and a female “cause” and Eve (AS) was created without there being a female “cause” … likewise Jesus (AS) was created without a male “cause” or agent. Everything here points to God in His Glory to Create. It fits a bigger picture of belief and set of beliefs that are calibrated with each other.

[lethal_kamikaze]

Re: What Really Happens In The Church of Scientology

:lkk:

[queer]

Re: What Really Happens In The Church of Scientology

@psyah

Peace Theorist

Well yes and no … some things appear in some beliefs without substantiation … the idea of virgin birth is substantiated. I mean that it has a context.

Taking for example the myth of Ganesh and the replacement of a boy’s head with that of an elephant and that deserving worship. This is nothing like virgin birth even though to careless minds it may seem to be so. Admittedly, both are unlikely to happen in our lives as empirically measurable events.

However, the context of virgin birth is neither to worship Mary (AS) nor worship Isa (AS). It is based on a “sign” of the coming of the Messiah. It is also to show that God can Create without the need of normal “means” the asbab … That Adam (AS) was created without there being a male and a female “cause” and Eve (AS) was created without there being a female “cause” … likewise Jesus (AS) was created without a male “cause” or agent. Everything here points to God in His Glory to Create. It fits a bigger picture of belief and set of beliefs that are calibrated with each other.

i’m sorry but if god creates jesus without a dad, that is his glory, but somehow some threshold in glory turns to absurdity if god can glue on an elephant head on a boy’s body? biased much?

[Theorist]

Re: What Really Happens In The Church of Scientology

@queer

i’m sorry but if god creates jesus without a dad, that is his glory, but somehow some threshold in glory turns to absurdity if god can glue on an elephant head on a boy’s body? biased much?

Exactly my point!

[aqua70]

Re: What Really Happens In The Church of Scientology

@queer

i’m sorry but if god creates jesus without a dad, that is his glory, but somehow some threshold in glory turns to absurdity if god can glue on an elephant head on a boy’s body? biased much?

Ok I was going to check out but I gotta respond to this. Obviously you don’t know anything about monotheist religion yet you bash them. If you knew a thing or two about ALL the religions then you would’ve never brought this up. I don’t even know why I am bothering to explain but here it goes, the core belief systems are very different between these religions! In our religion, humans are perceived as ashraful-mahlook (you can look that up on your own) but in the latter religion, animals are perceived to be at a higher level.

P.S. Not saying one belief is better than the other, my point is stop comparing things which have absolutely no comparison. Two different beliefs, two different ideologies, Period.

[redvelvet]

Re: What Really Happens In The Church of Scientology

Before the birth of Jesus…there was the birth of John the Baptist. The latter’s birth is also considered miraculous because his parents were old and beyond the age of reproducing. So, it is strange that the Christians should use the “miraculous birth” of Jesus as a base for divinity when they could have done so for John the Baptist who was born earlier. And if they were to go further back, then Adam had no human parents…so why is divinity not attributed to him? Islam has been consistent in that despite the extraordinary abilities given to the prophets…they were not divine…they were human and not to be worshipped..their miraculous births and feats are attributed to Allah’s power. And that’s the diff between them and boy with elephant head…the latter is worshipped as deity whereas the former aren’t. Also, surah Ikhlas states that Allah neither begets nor is He begotten and there is none like unto Him …and this means that nothing from among the creation…no human…no animal…no half human-half animal can be compared to Allah or be used to represent Him.

Theorist…if you don’t want to believe in Islam or any religion for that matter, that’s fine. But I find your “it’s not set in stone” comment confusing. You see…even if you don’t hate any religion…you should be able to discern which practices among which religions are either more sound…more ethical…more dignified…more hygienic…more sanitary…etc etc. And if you have found the practices of Islam to often come out faring “less” sound in your comparisons …then fine.

But the point that I’m trying to make is that when you deem all the practices of all the religions to be crazy…then that doesn’t sound open-minded…and it negates the “my beliefs are not set in stone.”

[Monk]

Re: What Really Happens In The Church of Scientology

@queer

i’m sorry but if god creates jesus without a dad, that is his glory, but somehow some threshold in glory turns to absurdity if god can glue on an elephant head on a boy’s body? biased much?

I trust all the educated indians I ever knew.
none of them trusted the elephant head god tale, no one presented it to me to consider.

Do you present it to us to consider ???
If you can not, then how could you complain for us being biased ?

[Theorist]

Re: What Really Happens In The Church of Scientology

@aqua70

Ok I was going to check out but I gotta respond to this. Obviously you don’t know anything about monotheist religion yet you bash them. If you knew a thing or two about ALL the religions then you would’ve never brought this up. I don’t even know why I am bothering to explain but here it goes, the core belief systems are very different between these religions! In our religion, humans are perceived as ashraful-mahlook (you can look that up on your own) but in the latter religion, animals are perceived to be at a higher level.

P.S. Not saying one belief is better than the other, my point is stop comparing things which have absolutely no comparison. Two different beliefs, two different ideologies, Period.

But Queer didn’t come up with that analogy to begin with. -___-

[psyah]

Re: What Really Happens In The Church of Scientology

@queer

i’m sorry but if god creates jesus without a dad, that is his glory, but somehow some threshold in glory turns to absurdity if god can glue on an elephant head on a boy’s body? biased much?

Peace queer

It is interesting how you protect the story of Ganesh … The boy whose head was exchanged with an elephant’s head is in fact a degraded state of his original human state … It was not an enhancement. Yet, people saw it fit to arrive at that story and then worship the boy … Ganesh. The way you have phrased it above is that God put the head of an elephant on the boy’s shoulders and gave him life. If so then surely God should be worshipped and not Ganesh.

As I said careless minds make it seem these are equal events. However, they are not …

[lethal_kamikaze]

Re: What Really Happens In The Church of Scientology

Peace,

On the other hand, what kind of is this god (shiva) who being a god doesn’t have any idea that Ganesha is his son from her wife Parvati the goddess who made him out of her clay.

And when god Ganesha was beheaded by him (by god Shiva), then where the head disappeared? Why god (Shiva) unable to find his original head? Why god Shiva chosen elephant head?

Now that is really absurd myth.

[queer]

Re: What Really Happens In The Church of Scientology

@Monk

I trust all the educated indians I ever knew.
none of them trusted the elephant head god tale, no one presented it to me to consider.

Do you present it to us to consider ???
If you can not, then how could you complain for us being biased ?

Monk pai, what do you mean present it to us to consider?

[queer]

Re: What Really Happens In The Church of Scientology

@psyah

Peace queer

It is interesting how you protect the story of Ganesh … The boy whose head was exchanged with an elephant’s head is in fact a degraded state of his original human state … It was not an enhancement. Yet, people saw it fit to arrive at that story and then worship the boy … Ganesh. The way you have phrased it above is that God put the head of an elephant on the boy’s shoulders and gave him life. If so then surely God should be worshipped and not Ganesh.

As I said careless minds make it seem these are equal events. However, they are not …

i am not protecting any story. i am saying jesus or ganesh - the stories are all bs. you pretend to not see the bs in jesus’s story because it is from your religion.

[queer]

Re: What Really Happens In The Church of Scientology

@aqua70

Ok I was going to check out but I gotta respond to this. Obviously you don’t know anything about monotheist religion yet you bash them. If you knew a thing or two about ALL the religions then you would’ve never brought this up. I don’t even know why I am bothering to explain but here it goes, the core belief systems are very different between these religions! In our religion, humans are perceived as ashraful-mahlook (you can look that up on your own) but in the latter religion, animals are perceived to be at a higher level.

P.S. Not saying one belief is better than the other, my point is stop comparing things which have absolutely no comparison. Two different beliefs, two different ideologies, Period.

i dont see the relevance of anything in your post to what i asked - why is one miracle performed by god a miracle while the other absurd?

[queer]

Re: What Really Happens In The Church of Scientology

@lethal_kamikaze

Peace,

On the other hand, what kind of is this god (shiva) who being a god doesn’t have any idea that Ganesha is his son from her wife Parvati the goddess who made him out of her clay.

And when god Ganesha was beheaded by him (by god Shiva), then where the head disappeared? Why god (Shiva) unable to find his original head? Why god Shiva chosen elephant head?

Now that is really absurd myth.

pal, the same kind of god who creates the biggest evil satan and then can’t stop it. absurd myth? or the same kind of absurdity you endorse daily?

[redvelvet]

Re: What Really Happens In The Church of Scientology

Asexual reproduction takes place among some animal species…so as an idea in and of itself …it’s not as far-fetched as boy with elephant head.

A key difference between the two faiths is that in one God grants miracles and extraordinary abilities to his prophets, but does not grant divinity or godhead to them. And why should He…when He is god? In the other faith God grants godhead to his own creation…elephant boy. You learn from the Roman and Greek mythologies that multiple gods results in chaos…with deities stepping on each others toes and possessing human flaws like lust and envy which defeats the notion of “God” who is supposed to be a perfect being above these things.

Also, the evil satan that features in the 3 monotheistic religions is totally stoppable by God. In Islam…it was Shaitaan who asked God for extended time. Why did he ask Allah this? It’s because even shaitan knows that Allah is the one who has ultimate control of time and his life…and so he had to beseech that very same Supreme Being to spare him for a while. This is rather humiliating for an opponent. So the notion that Allah “cannot” stop a creation is thus refuted and it only reflects lack of basic/fundamental knowledge of Islam from our resident atheist/s.

[lethal_kamikaze]

Re: What Really Happens In The Church of Scientology

@queer

pal, the same kind of god who creates the biggest evil satan and then can’t stop it. absurd myth? or the same kind of absurdity you endorse daily?

Peace queer,

You don’t have explanation and now you’re trying to divert our attention by submitting a counter-question

[aqua70]

Re: What Really Happens In The Church of Scientology

@queer

i dont see the relevance of anything in your post to what i asked - why is one miracle performed by god a miracle while the other absurd?

If you had core knowledge of the two religions then it would’ve made sense but since you don’t, I am not wasting any more of my time. And if you truly wanted the answers to your questions, you would study every religion in great detail. Your intentions are loud and clear queer ji, peace out!

[queer]

Re: What Really Happens In The Church of Scientology

@aqua70

If you had core knowledge of the two religions then it would’ve made sense but since you don’t, I am not wasting any more of my time. And if you truly wanted the answers to your questions, you would study every religion in great detail. Your intentions are loud and clear queer ji, peace out!

pal, it is a simple question. but if you have to have core knowledge etc., then fine. we’ll wait for psyah je to come start the scripture quoted to justify scripture circular logic.

[queer]

Re: What Really Happens In The Church of Scientology

@lethal_kamikaze

Peace queer,

You don’t have explanation and now you’re trying to divert our attention by submitting a counter-question

my explanation is it is absurd. but if you are someone who believes in equally absurd stuff like satan and hell, i don’t see how you could suddenly want other religion to be all logical. please feel free to explain.