Assala mu alaikum,
dear muslims
is there any islamic state now,
and how do we recognise or what are the principles to say right that is an islamic state
can anyone answer me?
Re: what is an islamic state
[QUOTE]
*Originally posted by koyes: *
Assala mu alaikum,
dear muslims
is there any islamic state now,
and how do we recognise or what are the principles to say right that is an islamic state
can anyone answer me?
[/QUOTE]
Walaikum assalam,
No. There is not Islamic state right now, I beleive. I'm not too familiar with Indonesia and Malaysia, but other than those two I don't find any Islamic state. An Islamic state means state observing Islam as its guiding principles in financial, justice and all other aspects. We can very easily see how "justice" system works in most of so-called Islamic states, how Ministers, Princes and all the "elite" classes do not get any punishment, they get away with their crimes.
^:k:
A paradox
Re: Re: what is an islamic state
[QUOTE]
*Originally posted by Changez_like: *
Walaikum assalam,
No. There is not Islamic state right now, I beleive. I'm not too familiar with Indonesia and Malaysia, but other than those two I don't find any Islamic state. An Islamic state means state observing Islam as its guiding principles in financial, justice and all other aspects. We can very easily see how "justice" system works in most of so-called Islamic states, how Ministers, Princes and all the "elite" classes do not get any punishment, they get away with their crimes.
[/QUOTE]
do you agree there are many non-isllamic states acheived this
Re: Re: Re: what is an islamic state
[QUOTE]
*Originally posted by rvikz: *
do you agree there are many non-isllamic states acheived this
[/QUOTE]
No! There is no ideal justice anywhere in the world.
Ch even an existing democracy can be paradoxical.
The most important aspect of an Islamic state is the provision of justice based on Quran and Sunnah, once that’s established it would be considered an Islamic state.
And Yes there are countries which have established states based on their own Justice system, which should be recognized as being milestones in the ultimate goal of providing justice to the mankind.
Re: Re: what is an islamic state
my fellow muslims
im a bit puzzled about saudi arabia, that was the birth of the islamic state, what was so special back then that we dont see in Saudi Arabia now
plz do answer
[QUOTE]
*Originally posted by Changez_like: *
Walaikum assalam,
No. There is not Islamic state right now, I beleive. I'm not too familiar with Indonesia and Malaysia, but other than those two I don't find any Islamic state. An Islamic state means state observing Islam as its guiding principles in financial, justice and all other aspects. We can very easily see how "justice" system works in most of so-called Islamic states, how Ministers, Princes and all the "elite" classes do not get any punishment, they get away with their crimes.
[/QUOTE]
Minime bhaijaan, I do think that some of the concepts in governance are nobel within the Islamic system. However, when you look at it from the economic perspective, such governments will end up being exclusionary and cannot keep up with the much advanced and flexible systems of trade and finance that we have currently around the world. Economically, the islamic system fails from day one becuase the means and costs of production are anachronistic. I have read upon this many times, even from the HT supporters cut and pastes and I just don;t see how an Islamic country can compete in the global mandate.
paradoxical
sorry i dont undestand the word paradoxical
what about Saudia they implement most of the Quran and Sunnah
[QUOTE]
*Originally posted by MiniMe: *
Ch even an existing democracy can be paradoxical.
The most important aspect of an Islamic state is the provision of justice based on Quran and Sunnah, once that’s established it would be considered an Islamic state.
And Yes there are countries which have established states based on their own Justice system, which should be recognized as being milestones in the ultimate goal of providing justice to the mankind.
[/QUOTE]
salam bro
have you identfied an islamic state if so plz tell me,
what is an islamic state
the principles to show ahh that is an islamic state
plz i will like to know
[QUOTE]
*Originally posted by Matsui: *
Minime bhaijaan, I do think that some of the concepts in governance are nobel within the Islamic system. However, when you look at it from the economic perspective, such governments will end up being exclusionary and cannot keep up with the much advanced and flexible systems of trade and finance that we have currently around the world. Economically, the islamic system fails from day one becuase the means and costs of production are anachronistic. I have read upon this many times, even from the HT supporters cut and pastes and I just don;t see how an Islamic country can compete in the global mandate.
[/QUOTE]
[QUOTE]
*Originally posted by Matsui: *
Minime bhaijaan, I do think that some of the concepts in governance are nobel within the Islamic system. However, when you look at it from the economic perspective, such governments will end up being exclusionary and cannot keep up with the much advanced and flexible systems of trade and finance that we have currently around the world. Economically, the islamic system fails from day one becuase the means and costs of production are anachronistic. I have read upon this many times, even from the HT supporters cut and pastes and I just don;t see how an Islamic country can compete in the global mandate.
[/QUOTE]
.
Better read the history of the Muslim world before colonialism. You will find out the splendours of an islamic system of justice, trade, economics....
A system lacking these things could not have spread and so deeply influenced 3 continents withing 50 years.
you can only compare the regions since they have the similar
cultural patterns
In South Asia, Sri Lanka tops the HDI scale ranking 84th, followed by the Maldives (89th), India (128th), Pakistan (135th) and Bhutan (142nd). Bangladesh, however, ranks lower (146th) than Nepal on the HDI scale.
Re: paradoxical
[QUOTE]
*Originally posted by koyes: *
sorry i dont undestand the word paradoxical
what about Saudia they implement most of the Quran and Sunnah
[/QUOTE]
They implemented "most" of Quran and Sunnah which applies to "individual" levels. They didn't do it for Businesses or Govts and Royals.
I agree, the way the world has been run "economically" for the last 100 or some years is in direct collision with what the islamic thought and principles are. But, just imagine before 100 years, things were different, for example as I have said in one of my old posts as well that the modern banking system took the concept of Check from an Islamic financial system. Even though modern economy plays a big role in today’s world, but the sense of injustice is even greater.
Koyes, Saudi Arabia is a majority muslim state where the ruling elite is beyond the reach of justice.
Minime, we can argue whether the modern economic system's sense of injustice or justice. Global GDP per capita is higher now than it has ever been. Access to capital, resources, goods and services is better now than it has ever been. the direct impact can be measured in terms of HDI as mentioned by rvkiz.
I do agree that there is much to learn from all systems. The concept of s check is indeed a valuable input into the modern banking system but restrictions on swaps under islamic system would not be. Do you see where I am going with this?
what is HDI scale
salam bro can ypou tell me what is HDI
[QUOTE]
*Originally posted by rvikz: *
you can only compare the regions since they have the similar
cultural patterns
In South Asia, Sri Lanka tops the HDI scale ranking 84th, followed by the Maldives (89th), India (128th), Pakistan (135th) and Bhutan (142nd). Bangladesh, however, ranks lower (146th) than Nepal on the HDI scale.
[/QUOTE]
my understanding of the replies
to all my muslims
so what i have understood from the replies that the principal
of an islamic state is justice, then if thats true
what about UK it provides welfare i.e. justice for the people does that mean it is an islamic state.
if this is incorrect then plz correct me?
[QUOTE]
*Originally posted by Matsui: *
but restrictions on swaps under islamic system would not be. Do you see where I am going with this?
[/QUOTE]
Can u explain this please? I think its an interesting topic :)
Swaps are interest rate arbitrage based trading instruments in fixed income dealings. Under islamic law such instruments would be banned. removing billions in market liquidity. this is simply one example.
I had a question actully. How is the concept of "profit motive" looked upon in Islam?