"We are tired of military rule" - A statement by some concerned Pakistani citizens

What to do of this internal betrayal?

Why does our ‘citizenry’ ANNOUNCES to the WHOLE WIDE WORLD

that we are NOT UNITED, and that COME beat US??

Dushi

Subject “We are tired of military rule” - A statement by some concerned Pakistani citizens

Wow.

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“We are tired of military rule”
A statement by some concerned Pakistani citizens

Greatly alarmed at the current state of affairs in the country, we,
the undersigned, members of civil society, are addressing the people
of Pakistan.

It is sad that even after 48 years after the first military coup, we
are back to square one. Civil society lies at the feet of the army. At
a time when leadership is desperately needed to cope with matters of
vital importance and put the country back on the democratic path,
Pakistan is ruled by a General in uniform who lacks both legitimacy
and credibility.

Seven years after General Musharraf toppled an elected government and
captured political power, the nightmare is not over yet. The result is
the mess we are in today. A sense of defeat hangs over Pakistan. Today
Pakistan has a disjointed, lopsided, topsy-turvy, hybrid political
system - a non-sovereign rubber stamp parliament, a General in uniform
as “President”, and a figurehead Prime Minister - General Musharraf’s
calls “pure democracy”. The people of Pakistan did not deserve this
government because they had no choice in the matter.

The bottom line is becoming inescapable: thanks to corrupt,
unprincipled politicians, ever ready to do business with the military
ruler, General Musharraf will continue to rule 160 million people of
Pakistan as a dictator with a democratic fatade.

The foundations of the 1973 Constitution have been shaken by a
power-hungry General with the help of corrupt politicians and a pliant
judiciary. He has turned the parliament and the judiciary into a
fig-leaf for unconstitutional and illegal practices.

In an effort to acquire political support, General Musharraf, has
openly identified himself and the Pakistan army with one political
party. The Pakistan army is a people’s army. It is not so much an arm
of the Executive branch as it is an arm of the people of Pakistan. It
is the only shield we have against foreign aggression. It is the only
glue that is keeping our fragile federation together. Why politicise
it? Why expose it to the rough and tumble of politics? Why use it as
an instrument for grabbing and retaining political power Today the
biggest single burning issue before the country is how to reclaim the
army from its abuse by a power-hungry junta who want to use it as an
instrument for retaining political power.

Instead of extricating the army from the Waziristan quagmire where the
American-led war against “terrorists” has resulted in the killing of
innocent men, women and children, including security personnel, and
the permanent alienation of Wazir and Mahsud tribesmen, General
Musharraf jumped into the Baluch quicksand and opened a second “Front”
against his own people in Baluchistan resulting in the tragic death of
Nawab Akbar Khan Bugti, Similarly the much trumpeted accountability is
a farce. Today, known corrupt holders of public office are General
Musharraf’s political allies and members of his cabinet. Even the
economy shows little perceptible sign of recovery. Poverty has
deepened. Educated unemployment is on the rise. Investors’ confidence
has not been restored, partly because the law and order situation
shows no sign of improvement and nobody knows what the future shape of
things will look like.

It is now abundantly clear that free, fair and impartial elections
cannot be held in this country, if General Musharraf remains in power.
We believe that Pakistan cannot survive except as a democratic state
based on the principle of sovereignty of the people. Pakistan cannot
survive except under a constitution which reflects t he sovereign will
of the people, not the whims of one individual person. Pakistan cannot
survive except under a system based on the supremacy of civilian rule.

Pakistan cannot survive except as a federation based on the willing
consent of all the federating units. Pakistan cannot survive if the
rule of law gives way to the rule of man. Pakistan cannot survive
under military rule, with or without a civilian fatade, because
military rule lacks legitimacy and is an anachronism in the 21st
century. There are times in the life of a people or a nation - when
the political climate demands that we overtly take sides. We believe
that such times are upon us. A time bomb is ticking in Pakistan. The
country is in deep, deep trouble. General Musharraf is not in tune
with the zeitgeist of Pakistan. There comes a time when people get
tired. We say today to those, who have ruled us so long without our
consent, that freedom from army rule is not negotiable; that their
interest and the interest of Pakistan do not coincide, that we are
tired of military rule, tired of tyranny, tired of being humiliated,
tired of being deprived of our right to elect our rulers. We say to
them: enough! enough!

We have no alternative but to stand up and fight. for a new Pakistan -
free, open, democratic, and a dynamic, developed, and steady country,
standing on its own feet, in control of its destiny, genuinely
respected by its neighbours and the democratic world. A country with a
future. We can wake up today or we can have a rude awakening sooner
than we think.

  1. Sher Baz Mazari
  2. Justice (Retd.) M. A. Samdani
  3. Justice (Retd.) Tariq Mahmood
  4. Hamid Khan, Former President Supreme Court Bar Association
  5. Dr.Pervez A. Hoodbhoy
  6. Dr. Kaiser Bengali
  7. Ahmad Faraz
  8. Mairaj Muhammad Khan
  9. Masood Mufti, Civil Servant (Retd.), Author
  10. Barrister Baachaa
  11. Ambassador Amir Usman
  12. Ambassador Mansoor Alam
  13. Safdar Siddiqui, Author
  14. Roedad Khan, Civil Servant (Retd.), Columnist, Environmentalist

Re: "We are tired of military rule" - A statement by some concerned Pakistani citizens

People positioning themselves to be in favorable light when Musharraf's era ends. Tons of things seem to be in motion right now anyways.

I personally do not want military govt in place. I am for a real working democracy. Our intelelctuals and civic leaders need to come up with more concerete stuff. Not just whine about it.

Re: "We are tired of military rule" - A statement by some concerned Pakistani citizens

Some of these people may have agendas but not all, some are beyond repproach..these are people who appreciated Musharraf when he was doing the right thing and are now distancing themselves from the unfolding disaster.

Re: "We are tired of military rule" - A statement by some concerned Pakistani citizens

Greatly alarmed at the current state of affairs in the country, we,
the undersigned, members of civil society, are addressing the people
of Pakistan.

okay, all people or some people?

*It is sad that even after 48 years after the first military coup, we
are back to square one. Civil society lies at the feet of the army. At
a time when leadership is desperately needed to cope with matters of
vital importance and put the country back on the democratic path,
Pakistan is ruled by a General in uniform who lacks both legitimacy
and credibility. *

it is indeed sad, it is also sad that gvt after civilian govt as rife with corruption, and was only focused on its own agenda rather than serve as elected representatives of people. These ppl are the ones who refer to themselves as the 'ruling class' these ppl and their cronies in the bureaucracy, the Civil 'servants' who are more like civil 'lords' now.

*Seven years after General Musharraf toppled an elected government and
captured political power, the nightmare is not over yet. *

did he create a nightmare or is this the nightmare that has been going on for ages when it comes to the government of this country?

*The result is
the mess we are in today. A sense of defeat hangs over Pakistan. Today
Pakistan has a disjointed, lopsided, topsy-turvy, hybrid political
system - a non-sovereign rubber stamp parliament, a General in uniform
as "President", and a figurehead Prime Minister - General Musharraf's
calls "pure democracy". *

Indeed the system is hybrid and can not last forever and we need to move towards a real democracy soon.

The people of Pakistan did not deserve this
government because they had no choice in the matter.

well, people of pakistan did not deserve some civilian govts either, because of the widespread vote fraud, god knows how ppl got into poer. And once those ppl go tinto power, did the common person have much say in how their elected representatives were working or what they were doing? The writers of this letter must be grazing on grass if they think that people of Pakistan were being served by our last two jokers.

*The bottom line is becoming inescapable: thanks to corrupt,
unprincipled politicians, ever ready to do business with the military
ruler, General Musharraf will continue to rule 160 million people of
Pakistan as a dictator with a democratic fatade. *

ahhhhhh corrupt, unprincipled politicians... so it does come up. What makes these gusy think that once the military rule is over all will be hunky dory?

The foundations of the 1973 Constitution have been shaken by a
power-hungry General with the help of corrupt politicians and a pliant
judiciary. He has turned the parliament and the judiciary into a
fig-leaf for unconstitutional and illegal practices.

The foundation of that constitution were also shaken by previous civilian govts when they failed to abide by the basic essence of the constitution and made thegovt a game, with the type of ghunda gardee by their jiyalaas that we all saw.

Today the
biggest single burning issue before the country is how to reclaim the
army from its abuse by a power-hungry junta who want to use it as an
instrument for retaining political power.

how is another burning issue, what will happen once military rule ends, would our corrupt politicians be held accountable or will they be free to loot the country again.

*Instead of extricating the army from the Waziristan quagmire where the
American-led war against "terrorists" has resulted in the killing of
innocent men, women and children, including security personnel, and
the permanent alienation of Wazir and Mahsud tribesmen, General
Musharraf jumped into the Baluch quicksand and opened a second "Front"
against his own people in Baluchistan resulting in the tragic death of
Nawab Akbar Khan Bugti, *

what do you people suggest, waziristan goes unchecked? and yes innocents died there which is indeed a shame, but would you prefer that waziristan and other areas are left to run rampant, and as a result the country gets bombed, what about the innocents then?

what solution did anyone have for the sampant power ppl like bugti had (of course sher baz mazari does not have the balls to tackle this issue)... what was ever done to halt the supression that these baluch warlords have on their ppl..oh lemme think somthing else did happen but it was under a civilian regime.

what about traitors like bugti blowing up infrastructure as a form of blackmail, how were they acting in national interest, how was that restoring investor confidence? huh huh huh?

*Similarly the much trumpeted accountability is
a farce. Today, known corrupt holders of public office are General
Musharraf's political allies and members of his cabinet. *

well, international sources have said accountability is much better. yes it is not perfect but is improving.

**
Even the
economy shows little perceptible sign of recovery. **

huh?

*Poverty has
deepened. *

really?

*Educated unemployment is on the rise. *

proof

*Investors' confidence
has not been restored, *

well the taking over dollar accts move of our former PM did wonders for the trust expats have in our govt.

partly because the law and order situation
shows no sign of improvement and nobody knows what the future shape of
things will look like.

need crime stats here.

It is now abundantly clear that free, fair and impartial elections
cannot be held in this country, if General Musharraf remains in power.

we did nt have free, fair and impartial elections even when civilian govts ruled. that was the exact finding of indpendent observers..so what has changed now?

*We believe that Pakistan cannot survive except as a democratic state
based on the principle of sovereignty of the people. *

correct, under a real democracy

*Pakistan cannot
survive except under a constitution which reflects t he sovereign will
of the people, not the whims of one individual person. *

well former govts, civilian ones were whims of one person either either BB or Nawaz, when did they do what was in line with national consensus?

and frankly, national consensus can be wrong too cant it?

Pakistan cannot
survive except under a system based on the supremacy of civilian rule.

agreed, but lets add supermacy of a honest, fair, and accountable civilan rule.

*Pakistan cannot survive except as a federation based on the willing
consent of all the federating units. *

agreed, proovided that the federating units realize that there is give and take when it comes to shared issues.

*Pakistan cannot survive if the
rule of law gives way to the rule of man. *

yup...

*Pakistan cannot survive
under military rule, with or without a civilian fatade, because
military rule lacks legitimacy and is an anachronism in the 21st
century. *

pakistan can also not survive under corrupt civilian rule which may have the the facade of a democracy but is a civilian dictatorship nor answerable to anyone, which used votes..real and rigged..to get in power, and once it got in power it acted no differently than a dictatorship.

*There are times in the life of a people or a nation - when
the political climate demands that we overtly take sides. We believe
that such times are upon us. *

okay

*A time bomb is ticking in Pakistan. The
country is in deep, deep trouble. *

and which superhero from your ranks or those of our political 'leaders' would you suggest had the brains and sincerity to take the country out of this deep deep trouble.

*General Musharraf is not in tune
with the zeitgeist of Pakistan. *

might i be so forard to declare that the zeitgist of Pakistan is part of the problem as well :)

*There comes a time when people get
tired. We say today to those, who have ruled us so long without our
consent, that freedom from army rule is not negotiable; that their
interest and the interest of Pakistan do not coincide, that we are
tired of military rule, *

Indeed, I do not want military rule. Although I am not sure that their interest coincide any less than the interests of our civilian regimes of recent era.

tired of tyranny, tired of being humiliated,

agreed, and also of the tyranny and humiliation of the era of BB and Nawaz, that sham democracy.

*We have no alternative but to stand up and fight. for a new Pakistan -
free, open, democratic, and a dynamic, developed, and steady country,
standing on its own feet, in control of its destiny, genuinely
respected by its neighbours and the democratic world. A country with a
future. *

and I ask again, please provide the list of your superheros who will do all this, or will you just back off and let any civilian ruler live like a lord over the country?

We can wake up today or we can have a rude awakening sooner
than we think.

wbay what do we do after we wake up. I mean for a nuch of supposed intellectuals this is really pathetic. i expect to see more than this, come up with a plan, show it to people, show how it will improve things? I mean these ppl chicken out when asked qustions on simple intermal and external issues like hadoos ordinance, status of ahmedis, kashmir LOC, shariah law, etc etc.

is writing long winded letters all that our nations intellectuals can do? if so, I will use one oftheir own sentences "we are in deep deep trouble"

Re: “We are tired of military rule” - A statement by some concerned Pakistani citizens

as i said, positioning themselves..
hey any list about democracy or national intsrest that has sher baz mazari as the first person signing it is a little “interesting”

Re: “We are tired of military rule” - A statement by some concerned Pakistani citizens

How so, he’s been retired from politics for the last 18 years? And while there is a thin line between principle and opportunism if one is blindly pro some group or the other, they will always see opportunists everywhere.

Re: "We are tired of military rule" - A statement by some concerned Pakistani citizen

And letsee...these people were tired of BB, they were tired of Nawaz Sharif, they were tired of Bhutto, Zia.....makes you wonder what exactly are they aiming for? Anarchy? Musharraf is the best bet currently for Pak, the politicians will just come over and start looting all over again. And then more people will get tired... :)

Re: “We are tired of military rule” - A statement by some concerned Pakistani citizens

while he is retired from politics he has political interests, and the mazaris like the bugtis and all have some skeletons in their closets. they are sardars also, same sardars who have been in power but have intentionally kept their people backwards, not unlike vaderas of sindh..

I am not blindly pro or against anyone, but surely you cant say Mazaris as a whole do not have interests, after all wasn’t it his close relative balakh sher mazari that was part of a caretaker govt himself?

and just because he is not directly active in politics does not mean he does not have close relatives that are not. I can provide you with a list of current and former players if you like, which also means there are future interests thorugh direct or indirect involvement in govt.

He also has direct links with bugti clan, after all his son Sher Ali Mazari is a nephew of Nawab Akar Bugti, so there is a personal axe to grind also.

Re: “We are tired of military rule” - A statement by some concerned Pakistani citizen

They are just tired and need some sunlight, fresh air and goof coffee.

Re: “We are tired of military rule” - A statement by some concerned Pakistani citizens

When the people of Pakistan speak up against their corrupt rulers, because they want to see the country progress…don’t even think of accusing them of being against their country, no matter what personal connection you have to this govt :rolleyes:

Re: "We are tired of military rule" - A statement by some concerned Pakistani citizen

Go live in Pakistan, you will see the looting continuing unabated :(

Re: "We are tired of military rule" - A statement by some concerned Pakistani citizens

mr. fraudia is right on many accounts as he parsed the naivety or the deliberate mold in which the appeal has been written.

indeed, something is very wrong in the country's peoples' minds, especially the aristocracy and bureaucracy.

but, in the same token, where can u find that there is no corruption??
what is of concern is that the internal disharmony will allow the outsiders to pounce at the country and that is so bad. unless everybody is not caring about the country, on the same lines, no one will be able to abate that corruption at all levels, which the real deal alluded to.

hopefully, younger generation, people our age, can go back home, and do something good, to change the system, and make that lasting.

dushi

Re: “We are tired of military rule” - A statement by some concerned Pakistani citizens

I have no personal connection to this regime period.

These are not the ‘people’ of pakistan but a collection of has beens with almost everyone having skeletons in their own closets.

as far as what i wrote about the mazari oppression of their ppl, mazari involvement in previous care taker govts, mazari links to previous govts, and mazari links to bugtis, they are all facts and not a figment of my imagination.

lastly, its indeed a shame when such supposed experienced civil servants and leaders can only come up with a letter that college students visiting this site can come up with as well.

pakistan needs solutions, and not just complaints and whining. Seems like no one has any, including our political parties that have zero in terms of workable plans.

Re: “We are tired of military rule” - A statement by some concerned Pakistani citizens

By stating this yo are suggesting that the people in pakistan needs saviors from outside to come save them from themselves?

ppl in pakistan dont need expats or even people of Pakistani descent to go back. people of pakistan need to wake up and take charge of their own destiny.

sadly the nation as a whole is very happy taking short cuts where it helps em. bay imani and 2 number kaam is common place because it is socially acceptable and a norm.

Re: "We are tired of military rule" - A statement by some concerned Pakistani citizens

True, musharraf is a dictator. But would i rather have the bhuttos, the sharifs, the altaf hussains in his place? NO.

Hmm maybe Imran Khan.. otherwise musharraf will do just fine.

Re: "We are tired of military rule" - A statement by some concerned Pakistani citizens

Fraudz PWNED this thread! Yes, we are tired of the military, we want BB! BB tey Gunju (and choti tind) binna dil nahee lagda saada! Whoever wrote this article should be exiled, he prolly thinks all those jhaks before in power were masoom billaz.

Re: "We are tired of military rule" - A statement by some concerned Pakistani citizens

In India the BJP too thought it was indespensible and best for the country. Remember 'India Shining"!! The poor were sick & tired of their constant self praise.

In a Democracy people at least have a choice - but in a Dictatorship there's nothing. Let the majority decide what they want. Pakistan needs this Democracy to remain united & strong.

Re: "We are tired of military rule" - A statement by some concerned Pakistani citizen

you got me wrong.
i clearly meant that we, as Pakistani people, who adapted another country/ies, can and ought to help... as we know from onlookers' perspective, since we are not inside the country at the moment and we know how our country is taken here, for instance in North American and in the rest of the world.
it is true that the common lot, the public, the middle class in Pakistan, is becoming a victim of the corrupt rich and is the most vulnerable right now.
the most poor --> farmers, and factory workers, or people who sold their souls to the devil from the poor generations and areas, know of no other alternative than to place their trust on whomever can buy it - from within the many greedy politicians within Pakistan.
& the most heart rending source of grief is that in order to survive, all are cursing the current govt for their plight.
no one is able to clearly see that they themselves are the part to the wrong direction in which the country is being pulled, by some insiders who are wishing that a civil war should take place & all these people on this list, are party to it.
what we need to do is that all conscientious historians, writers, academicians, honest politicians, professionals, people from the military, people from various sectors of the economics of the country, & students must all get together to make sure that at provincial level, the central govt is given a chance to do what is best for the country, rather than creating these sub parties, and gangs, who want to full fill their own short term agendas.
sadly, once the freedom is gone, then they will know, what is democracy that they are twisting themselves over, the demon democracy of the West.
we will be giving on a silver plate what they gruesomely need, the West and Israel, and India; all these contemptuous govts, our land and our future, if we did not stop in its tracks the civil internal distrust.
so i am against these idiot old men who are mean and ignorant enough of rock-heads to make this condition come about.
at this point, benazir, sharif, hussain & others like them in all parts of the country can do all they like, but the distrust placed in the current president, by the nation, is what will be the last nail in the coffin, and it will be a mistake, we will all regret.

does that sound better?

dushi

Re: "We are tired of military rule" - A statement by some concerned Pakistani citizens

Sorry to say, none of my mum/dad/siblings/khalas/phuppaz in Pak have any issues with the current government. We're all patriotic and very glad that the politicians have left, I just hope that they don't return, ever.

Re: "We are tired of military rule" - A statement by some concerned Pakistani citizens

**The real big difference between a democracy and dictatorship is when things go wrong in a dictatorship you can always blame the dictator, **
but in a democracy there is no one to blame but the Voting Public, the elected Polititions have a mandate and they can do no wrong. So if the voting public is illiterate and easily hoodwinked by crooked politicions then a benevolant dictator is better of the two evils..