Should Muslims who support Wahabbism/Salafi mentalities be rounded up at this point? Those who live in western countries?
I think it’s time we Muslims start handing over names of people who are acting stupid in the mosques and we all know who those are. The dudes who want to force things on people, are anti-US etc, anti-female, etc. We all know a Wahabbi when we see one and talk to one.
I think there needs to be some concerted effort by ISNA and other organizations to clean up the masjids. Each masjid should have cameras and be monitored in terms of traffic and where funds are going and if any weapons are being stored there. Would be great if the military did this in Pakistan. You can’t become an Imam or sit on the board of a mosque unless you go through serious background checks. That sort of thing. Sermons being monitored for hate language.
And round up the Wahabbis and deport them to Saudi.
I was listening to NPR and the guest was NY times buereu chief in Paris and she said the biggest problem is that there is nothing like one muslim or single muslim so there is a huge division in muslims itself which originates the problem and then it subdivides into many branches. If you think about it, its so true.
I really dont want to label anyone as wahabi or salafi as the worst people on the earth. Cuz its exactly the same argument that we've with most people from far-right who stereotype muslims and ask govt to punish them all. We cant ask for the same thing. However yes, we have to totally say if anyone shows hatred against others on the name of religion, they must be confronted. And I agree with OP that ICNA/ISNA or local masjid authorities should be the first layer to filter out people and inform the govt if they see the signs of bad guyz.
But anything can be done to a certain extent only. And everyone has to contribute towards the peaceful solution. The moderate muslims have to come in front and take the lead against extremism. Easier said than done though.
I'm more interested in comments by US guppies about half of US states banning Syrian refugees. Not too long ago how everyone was up in arms against Saudi for not lptaking Syrian refugees which was a false news anyway.
Yeah give away the muslims in the mosques and that may guarantee you not beng kicked out of America.
Its not that easy to weed out the corrupt ones. Many mosques in US and UK are run by wahabi administration, even the sunni mosques. In wahabism, according to ibn e taymia, being curious about religion and asking questions is haram.
I for one would like to know who the people are and have proof that it is them. For example Jihadi John who is now dead they say. He was supposedly a guy from the UK with an Arab background. And they have put pictures of him in his ISIS gear (covered face) how convenient eh? and put this London dude next to him and said that they are the same person. Is that enough for us? The two may well be the same person - but the level of proof we are getting and believing in - i.e. from the media (news) to be honest is not enough to be taking such heavy handed action against members of our community. Regardless of the fact that the Salafis/Wahabis share a different ideology from my own - I am not however prepared to alienate them or second guess them without court case style solid evidence.
I am not prepared to distrust any person who claims to be a Muslim unless I see the signs of hypocrisy in him - they are:
1) When he speaks he lies 2) When he makes a promise he breaks it 3) When bestowed with a trust he will betray that trust.
Regarding the anti-Islamic elements - and there are elements that want Islam to be destroyed - we need to be wise - anything that we can do in reaction to show Muslims are not only not a threat but rather will put ourselves in harms way before allowing our countrymen to be harmed is a good starting point. In order to achieve this end we can no longer be afraid ... We can no longer be afraid of others pointing fingers at us calling us terrorists (no matter how horrible that makes us feel) and we can not be afraid of being harmed. We need to start protecting each other and protect the non-Muslims from any dangerous elements within the society - regardless of where they profess to come from. This way we can ensure that the terrorists however they identify themselves or don't will be stopped by us.
They could be extreme Muslims, they could be brainwashed people, they could be agents in disguise pretending to be Muslims - it does not matter - the Muslim community needs to stop running away from media driven blame and start forming a front line to protect themselves and the rest of the society from such evil. When we become the shield that humanity needs without fear of our own lives then that message will be the greatest dawah and greatest defense we can ever muster to exonerate the name of Islam.
Psyah bhai you have soft corner for wahabies. I have lost 12+ members of my close family circle in target killings. All innocent people, some were doctors,some were businessmen in Quetta. Okay leave that aside, how quickly and conveniently you forgot the Peshawar school attack that al-qaeda took the responsibility of.
Psyah bhai you have soft corner for wahabies. I have lost 12+ members of my close family circle in target killings. All innocent people, some were doctors,some were businessmen in Quetta. Okay leave that aside, how quickly and conveniently you forgot the Peshawar school attack that al-qaeda took the responsibility of.
BabaJi ... peace on you and your close family members who are alive and on those who have passed away as martyrs.
My post is basically saying that those actual individuals who attack innocents should be stopped. But that does not mean all Wahabis are doing the attacks and it certainly could also mean that those attacks could be happening by agents posing as Wahabis. My message is about protecting all innocent people and not let these attacks create further suspicion between Muslim groups or between us and other humans. We need only be concerned with evil people and stop them attacking innocent people.
Do I have a soft corner for Wahabies? The question is does your condemnation extend to people who belong to a group regardless of whether they themselves have done anything wrong or not, just because some members of their group may have done something wrong? We should not blanket blame a whole denomination ... that will make us people of injustice ... And certainly we should not accept face value information coming from the media outlets that dictate to us who we should like or dislike.
I'm more interested in comments by US guppies about half of US states banning Syrian refugees. Not too long ago how everyone was up in arms against Saudi for not lptaking Syrian refugees which was a false news anyway.
Yeah give away the muslims in the mosques and that may guarantee you not beng kicked out of America.
So please help me out and clear yours and my confusion here:
Are you equating US and Saudi governments or policies towards Syria as same here? If yes then there shouldnt be any debate and together we both will announce how these two countries are identical.
If your answer is No, then that validates the stand of many as to why Saudi should hv taken most of the syrian refugees right when they were looking towards the west. I hope you get my point otherwise i can explain further.
Now as far as the US states is concerned, Any terrorist act that happens on the name of Islam makes the stand of conservatives/republicans further strong that its not safe to bring on refugees. Europe allowed so many but in the end they had to close the borders as well. There is only upto a certain level any country will accept foreign people but as soon as it brings a chance of danger, they'll stop. And I absolutely dont think they are wrong. Its very unfortunate but this is how it is.
Now lets talk about the last point. My question to you is, if someone shows the intentions of hatred or killing or violence or by any means danger to the society, why shouldnt he be handed over? Unless you are in a denial that there arent any bad guyz at all among muslims. Becuz if you are then its a more serious problem my friend.
Still doesn't absolve the saudis aka the neighbors from taking syrians in. Isn't it islamic to help your relatives and neighbors and they actually deserve your help more than a stranger?
As far as the US, 2,000 have come in and a court has said that states can't legally block the refugees. I guess that they can deny them state benefits. Whether we like it or not or whether iraq shouldn't have been invaded in the past, the situation now is that ISIS is smuggling itself within the refugees and they have vowed to attack the US.
What does the hareem think that america should do?
Should Muslims who support Wahabbism/Salafi mentalities be rounded up at this point? Those who live in western countries?
I think it's time we Muslims start handing over names of people who are acting stupid in the mosques and we all know who those are. The dudes who want to force things on people, are anti-US etc, anti-female, etc. We all know a Wahabbi when we see one and talk to one.
I think there needs to be some concerted effort by ISNA and other organizations to clean up the masjids. Each masjid should have cameras and be monitored in terms of traffic and where funds are going and if any weapons are being stored there. Would be great if the military did this in Pakistan. You can't become an Imam or sit on the board of a mosque unless you go through serious background checks. That sort of thing. Sermons being monitored for hate language.
And round up the Wahabbis and deport them to Saudi.
Should Muslims who support Wahabbism/Salafi mentalities be rounded up at this point? Those who live in western countries?
How will you decide who is or is not a salafi? Can a person be salafi one day, and non-salafi the next depending on the issue at-hand and their opinion?
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I think it's time we Muslims start handing over names of people who are acting stupid in the mosques and we all know who those are. The dudes who want to force things on people, are anti-US etc, anti-female, etc. We all know a Wahabbi when we see one and talk to one.
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Again, please provide an outline for things that must match up for a person to be labeled as such, keeping in mind teaching of Quran and Sunnah in regards to judging another muslim.
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I think there needs to be some concerted effort by ISNA and other organizations to clean up the masjids. Each masjid should have cameras and be monitored in terms of traffic and where funds are going and if any weapons are being stored there. Would be great if the military did this in Pakistan. You can't become an Imam or sit on the board of a mosque unless you go through serious background checks. That sort of thing. Sermons being monitored for hate language.
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Yes. Those are all good suggestions. Who will watch the watchers when if they start to use it to enforce their own agenda, i.e. politics?
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And round up the Wahabbis and deport them to Saudi.
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People have little fault lines between them, little cracks that demarcate the differences. These are lines of exploitation used by existing powers. We are being controlled and we cannot allow that. No let’s leave the divisive rhetoric and start a new narrative. A new narrative to defend all people from harm and avoiding suspicion of anyone until they specifically start to display signs of worry.
@SID_NY and @Doppleganger
Saudi have already taken in more Syrians than other places - that is what hareem01 is saying. They simply do not call them refugees.
Psyah bhai you have soft corner for wahabies. I have lost 12+ members of my close family circle in target killings. All innocent people, some were doctors,some were businessmen in Quetta. Okay leave that aside, how quickly and conveniently you forgot the Peshawar school attack that al-qaeda took the responsibility of.
You're doing the same thing to wahabis what non-muslims are doing to muslims. As much as I'm against wahabism, I can say this with surity that not all wahabis are extreme jihadis. Enough with the hatred!!!
America doesn't believe in Muslim Ummah or the Arab pride - it is the Saudis. What support and help are they offering to a tiny country like Jordan to deal with massive influx of refugees? Even yet the all NGOs and individuals from Western countries are going there to help Jordan deal with refugees crises.
Most refugees would rather embark a dangerous journey to Europe and US than go to ultra racist Gulf states.
What Western countries need to realise is that they need to stop selling arms to this monster state Saudi Arabia and close down mosques that receive extended state funding from Saudi Arabia that ultimately promotes their menacing ideology.
How will you decide who is or is not a salafi? Can a person be salafi one day, and non-salafi the next depending on the issue at-hand and their opinion?
Again, please provide an outline for things that must match up for a person to be labeled as such, keeping in mind teaching of Quran and Sunnah in regards to judging another muslim.
Yes. Those are all good suggestions. Who will watch the watchers when if they start to use it to enforce their own agenda, i.e. politics?
What if they're not Saudi citizens?
Can't believe some people would think of going to such limits just to stay in good books of white people.
I look at our state as humans and muslims and then realize perhaps we actually deserve all this humiliation.
Yes Gulf states are racist. The so many Indians, Pakistanis and Bengalis you are talking about are poor and poorly treated labourers helping Arabs to build tacky soulless concrete jungles there. No socio-economic mobility is allowed there unless your passport colour is red or you have truck load of black money to enjoy luxuries.
Refugees are coming to Europe/US because they know even if they start off as labourers in those lands, their children will become doctors and engineers and home owners. These racist Gulf don't issue such freedoms and equality.
Hareem when did I say all wahabis. I was talking about the majority, there are always exceptions to every rule. Muslims fighting each other is not something new. It has been happening since the time of Prophet Mohammad (saw).
When it became a matter of life amd death, mecca was conquered. Then abu sufyan accepted islam. When Abu sufyan went to prophet for allegiance, Prophet turned away his face from him. Abu sufyan and the likes accepted islam but there hearts were full of hatred and jealousy. Which is still evident. Then in the next generation, yazid fought with Imam Hussain, that was the war between the good and the evil, the virtue and the vice, the truth and falsehood. Wahabies are notorious to no end. Its time for sunnis to wake up.
