Had I used the word multitude, are you suggesting your arguments would evaporate? Or are you taking liberties with an already imprecise figure, LOL?
Yeah the obsession over numbers is bleh.
The point is, it's not supported, and I don't see anyone clamouring for the UN to push such an agenda, wrt polygamous marriages. A bit forced, when it's said to make a point.
yes - there should be people clamoring in the UN about polygamy - while they're at it - they should argue for multiple husbands for the same woman as well.
I think homosexuality is a complex phenomena not to be compared with skin colour or hair...but it boils down to human sexuality, and therefore sex. My primary point, lost in this rather silly number game playing, was that this is viewed as nothing more than fornication. The retort that the government should keep out of the business of people's sex lives is not a universally held one. This leads us down the slippery slope of denying (a universally held) right of a people to govern themselves for the sake of justifying peoples choice in sexual partners.
Yes homosexuality/heterosexuality does boil down to sex. And yes currently in the Muslim world it is seen as nothing more than fornication. Yes people do have a right to govern themselves. But people - homosexuals - also have the right to live their life according to their own beliefs - as long as they are not harming anyone else by the way they conduct their lives.
Mukobhai - you are stating the obvious - we all know that its a crime.
The discussion is whether homosexuality - is a choice or not. Related to this is the question - at which age does a child choose to be attracted to men/women (if indeed it is a choice and not genetic).
The other discussion is whether irregardless of it being a choice or not - should homosexuals have the same right to life as heterosexuals.
Another part of the thread dealt with polygamy and polyandry.
Feel free to discuss any of those - and contribute to the discussion.
Mukobhai - you are stating the obvious - we all know that its a crime.
The discussion is whether homosexuality - is a choice or not. Related to this is the question - at which age does a child choose to be attracted to men/women (if indeed it is a choice and not genetic).
The other discussion is whether irregardless of it being a choice or not - should homosexuals have the same right to life as heterosexuals.
Another part of the thread dealt with polygamy and polyandry.
Feel free to discuss any of those - and contribute to the discussion.
I am just saying what is against Islam can't be discussed in a Muslim country nor it can be allowed at any cost
Mukobhai - you are stating the obvious - we all know that its a crime.
The discussion is whether homosexuality - is a choice or not. Related to this is the question - at which age does a child choose to be attracted to men/women (if indeed it is a choice and not genetic).
The other discussion is whether irregardless of it being a choice or not - should homosexuals have the same right to life as heterosexuals.
Another part of the thread dealt with polygamy and polyandry.
Feel free to discuss any of those - and contribute to the discussion.
the context of the original discussion began with UN and muslim countries being outraged.
with this in mind we discussing on pak forum mainly a pakistan focused forum, as you know pakistan is 97% muslim so no surprise with reaction.
If a society allows homosexuality you will get individuals experiment with it and say ok this my lifstyle of choice, it is like drugs people make the choice to try or not you don't blame genetics for that, it is not scientificlly proven a child chooses homosexuality unless you brainwash a child that this is acceptable or not.
Under secualrism, homosexality is promoted as something normal and people should do it no problem.
Under islam it is forbidden as you know and not promoted or accepted, however a homosexual person has the right to work, get education, do business etc same rights as normal person but if they caught committing homsexal act i.e fornication and it is proven in a court. Then the punishment from the judicial system of islam comes into effect.
the context of the original discussion began with UN and muslim countries being outraged.
with this in mind we discussing on pak forum mainly a pakistan focused forum, as you know pakistan is 97% muslim so no surprise with reaction.
If a society allows homosexuality you will get individuals experiment with it and say ok this my lifstyle of choice, it is like drugs people make the choice to try or not you don't blame genetics for that, it is not scientificlly proven a child chooses homosexuality unless you brainwash a child that this is acceptable or not.
Under secualrism, homosexality is promoted as something normal and people should do it no problem.
Under islam it is forbidden as you know and not promoted or accepted, however a homosexual person has the right to work, get education, do business etc same rights as normal person but if they caught committing homsexal act i.e fornication and it is proven in a court. Then the punishment from the judicial system of islam comes into effect.
Obviously he is punished if he is got caught doing that disgusting act
the context of the original discussion began with UN and muslim countries being outraged.
with this in mind we discussing on pak forum mainly a pakistan focused forum, as you know pakistan is 97% muslim so no surprise with reaction.
If a society allows homosexuality you will get individuals experiment with it and say ok this my lifstyle of choice, it is like drugs people make the choice to try or not you don't blame genetics for that, it is not scientificlly proven a child chooses homosexuality unless you brainwash a child that this is acceptable or not.
Under secualrism, homosexality is promoted as something normal and people should do it no problem.
Under islam it is forbidden as you know and not promoted or accepted, however a homosexual person has the right to work, get education, do business etc same rights as normal person but if they caught committing homsexal act i.e fornication and it is proven in a court. Then the punishment from the judicial system of islam comes into effect.
Javedbhai - your profile says you're from France, homosexuality is allowed there - have you experimented because homosexuality is allowed?
Is the punishment according to Islam coming from the Quran or from the Hadees?
Mukobhai - same question to you - if you were in France/US/UK where homosexuality is allowed would you experiment? Also mukobhai - on the previous page you said that you remember being asexual as a child - and I asked you at what point did you go from asexual to heterosexual - was it a choice - did you compare a man and a woman a decide women are for you - or was in inborn natural reaction?
Javedbhai - your profile says you're from France, homosexuality is allowed there - have you experimented because homosexuality is allowed?
Is the punishment according to Islam coming from the Quran or from the Hadees?
Mukobhai - same question to you - if you were in France/US/UK where homosexuality is allowed would you experiment? Also mukobhai - on the previous page you said that you remember being asexual as a child - and I asked you at what point did you go from asexual to heterosexual - was it a choice - did you compare a man and a woman a decide women are for you - or was in inborn natural reaction?
Thanks
Red
what my profile says has no bearing on the discussion if the debate is too big for you maybe you should stick to the joke forum maybe that is more your level.
So according to some people, homosexuality is the biggest sin in Islam? Not murder, not theft, not rape, not physical assault, not bullying, not corruption, but homosexuality? LOL.
A law based on Islamic principals does not tolerate sexuality outside of wedlock. Hence, anything deviating from this norm is considered harmful.
So homosexuality within wedlock is permissible? Well thats why we should give them marriage rights...
The retort that the government should keep out of the business of people's sex lives is not a universally held one. This leads us down the slippery slope of denying (a universally held) right of a people to govern themselves for the sake of justifying peoples choice in sexual partners.
Govt staying out of the business of peoples sex lives is a slippery slope? Are you sure you even know what the term slippery slope means?
A slippery slope would be the govt starting with Homosexuals, then continuing to regulate what some two bit mullah deems to be improper sexual relations between a man and a woman, then even a married man and woman. Where does it end?
Are you comfortable with the Govt spying on you in your bedroom? If you are, then Homosexuals are the least of your problem.
Govt staying out of the business of peoples sex lives is a slippery slope? Are you sure you even know what the term slippery slope means?
A slippery slope would be the govt starting with Homosexuals, then continuing to regulate what some two bit mullah deems to be improper sexual relations between a man and a woman, then even a married man and woman. Where does it end?
Are you comfortable with the Govt spying on you in your bedroom? If you are, then Homosexuals are the least of your problem.
Sir Homosexuality is the biggest crime it can't be tolerated in A Muslim Society
what my profile says has no bearing on the discussion if the debate is too big for you maybe you should stick to the joke forum maybe that is more your level.
Javed, you're right your location really shouldn't be relevant to the discussion.
The questions I asked you though - are relevant to the discussion. Please do answer the following questions:
1 - At what point did you CHOOSE to be attracted to women - you're implying sexual attraction is a choice - in which case you surely must remember when you made this life altering decision.
2 - You mention and I quote you "If a society allows homosexuality you will get individuals experiment with it and say ok this my lifstyle of choice, it is like drugs people make the choice to try or not you don't blame genetics for that", please do cite any study you can find where people who did not have sexual freedom and then an approval of homosexual rights led to more people experimenting with homosexuality.
3 - If homosexuality is legal wherever you live - did it lead to you experimenting with homosexuality? If homosexuality is illegal where you live - do you think that if it were made legal you would experiment with homosexuality?
Javed, lets not resort to personal attacks of who is big enough for this discussion.
If you actually believe that Islam undoubtedly claims that homosexuality is a bigger crime than murder, how can you follow Islam as a religion?
Sir Islam is the fastest growing Religion in the world their are some major sin in Islam first one is shirk than is murder of innocent person not every one is innocent than is Zina and Zina has some categories out which homosexuality is the biggest one sir
You mean that I could go out right now and rape some 12 year old girls and that would be all fine and dandy but as soon as I put my pee-pee inside of a guy’s brown eye consensually than I am destined to go to hell?
Also, you should know that in America, Islam is the fastest spreading religion in the prison. And you do know what happens in prisons, right?
Punishment of Rape is death Sir Islam is growing everywhere check it for yourself out of Prison to Islam is the fastest growing Religion and most who have converted in Prison are not criminals anymore they have become the best citizens of their country most Americans and Europeans are coming to Islam
Whats wrong with homosexuality doe? It is fun and perfectly enjoyable. Like everything in life, you won't know what you're missing out on until you give it a try.
Javedbhai - your profile says you're from France, homosexuality is allowed there - have you experimented because homosexuality is allowed?
Is the punishment according to Islam coming from the Quran or from the Hadees?
Mukobhai - same question to you - if you were in France/US/UK where homosexuality is allowed would you experiment? Also mukobhai - on the previous page you said that you remember being asexual as a child - and I asked you at what point did you go from asexual to heterosexual - was it a choice - did you compare a man and a woman a decide women are for you - or was in inborn natural reaction?
Thanks
javed does everything he suggests others not to do. he calls "them" (west) evil but yet serves them to earn his bread, he thinks secularism and democracy are evil but yet avails benefits of them, he calls homo stuff biggest sin but still lives among them.
Heck he hates american army but has an american soldier as his avatar :D
it is not the first time he has shown double standards, and i am sure it wont be the last.
Do what he says, dont do what he does.
Whats wrong with homosexuality doe? It is fun and perfectly enjoyable. Like everything in life, you won't know what you're missing out on until you give it a try.
Sir it is not fun it is one of the biggest sin ALLAH destroyed a whole nation for this and this can't be tolerated
