Two thirds in Kashmir want independence: poll

I think India being biggest democracy in the world will consider the demand of Kashmiri people, stop un-necessary bloodshed and let them free from bondage to form their own sovreign independent state.

http://www.dawn.com/wps/wcm/connect/dawn-content-library/dawn/news/world/04-kashmir-independence-poll-qs-06

Two thirds in Kashmir want independence: poll

NEW DELHI: About two thirds of residents in Indian-administered Kashmir want independence for their region, with less than one in ten seeking a merger with Pakistan, a survey showed Sunday.

The Kashmir region is administered separately by India and Pakistan, with the Indian part subject to an insurgency and violent separatist movement for the last 20 years that has claimed an estimated 47,000 lives.

The poll, conducted for the Sunday Hindustan Times newspaper, showed that 66 per cent of respondents in the Kashmir valley wanted “complete freedom to entire Jammu and Kashmir as a new country”.

Re: Two thirds in Kashmir want independence: poll

Maybe Pakistan should stop interfering in Kashmir. That will not only end the bloodshed, it will also save money spent on Kashmir. Money that we desperately need.

Re: Two thirds in Kashmir want independence: poll

Pakistan isn't interfering in Kashmir.

It used to actively support the Kashmiri mujahideen in the 90's, but Musharraf completely rolled back any material support for the freedom struggle. To be honest, Pakistan is too tied down in its own crises to give anything other than moral support.

What is happening in the Valley today is completely indignous. This has been widely aknowledged by the Indians themselves also I think.

Re: Two thirds in Kashmir want independence: poll

Yes. And we are all made of foam!

Re: Two thirds in Kashmir want independence: poll

wallah !! mashallah... i wish they should get their freedom !! but before this freedom to those who are kashmirs we should first get all kashmirs spread across the country studying, working and happily married in different states !!

If possible we must poll after that and then grant them what they want !!

matter of fact !! Middle Class And Upper Class Kashmirs Not at all in Kashmir !! they all spread across the nation... with different lame reasons !!

Let all be in kashmir then ask for wht ever they want !!

Even we Indians fed up with this issue of kashmir !!

Re: Two thirds in Kashmir want independence: poll

You have a huge misconception if you think Pakistan is presently supporting the Kashmiri freedom fighters. Even India’s military admits that cross-border infiltration has significantly decreased over the last decade, mostly due to the increases in Indian security measures along the LOC.

You should see some of the pictures coming out of Kashmir, especially after the Eid prayers yesterday. Thousands of people on the streets (Facebook)

The current unrest is indigenous. Mocking me doesn’t take away from the truth. I have friends from Occupied Kashmir who say the current uprising may be the beginning of the Kashmiri intifada.

Re: Two thirds in Kashmir want independence: poll

I never said Pakistan was actively supporting them. Just casue a rally here, or a rally there. You know, that sort of thing.

Sorry, but my knowledge is based on having relatives in Azad Kashmir (who incidentally take a very dim view of Pakistan) who actually know what's going on. My father's cousin was a Major General. My grandfather was in the army, so my father grew up among soldiers, many of whom are still his friends.

It's a matter of ego for Pakistan. That, and a convenient way to get huge funding.

Re: Two thirds in Kashmir want independence: poll

I have a Kashmiri friend who's a leading member of the World Kashmir Freedom Movement as well as the Jammu and Kashmir Freedom Movement; he regularly gives interviews on TV. He's shown me scars on his wrist where Indian security forces have tortured him. Says azaadi is in the blood of most Kashmiris.

Pakistan used to have tons of on-the-ground assets in Occupied Kashmir. Unfortunately (in my opinion!) that is no longer the case. Pakistan may have the capability of casuing a couple of protests here and there, but you need to realise that when tens of thousands of people are marching at the street level, the situation is beyond the control of any one power. It's a genuine indiginous rebellion against Indian occupation.

As for anti-Pakistan Azad Kashmiris, my only message to them is to to take a hike over the LOC and see how the Indians treat the half of Kashmir under *their *control...

Re: Two thirds in Kashmir want independence: poll

Mr Geelani and Masrat Alam should be taken to task now .. it is high time ... who will donate money when there is no earning ...
Some one please put some sense in these senseless creatures . they only know how to fill in their coffers . Let people die who cares . They are like farooq abdullah , the only difference is he publicly acknowledged " kashmir ko goli maro " and these are pursuing the same agenda but in a hidden manner .

Ask masrat alam hw he used his influence to get his brothers son admission in speciality stream ( MS ) .. that guy was a worthless piece of crap but just because his uncle is so influential he got a berth in this stream ..

Ask geelani how much money he takes to send people for MBBS to Pakistan and bangladesh . In the past he sent people even from sheikh dynasty ...

So why then should our children be left out without education . Children / youth are the backbone of any state's economy and if there is no education what will the youth do , just die for geelani and co so that he can amass more wealth .

We are not against protests but everyday protest is bull**** . Better way of doing it is to first stop paying those paid agents ( stone pelters ) and then having complete strikes for a day or so per week ..

If the current situation continues then no one from kashmir will be able to obtain good education and when officers from outside will be posted in administrative positions -- then geelani will again start barking that no one from state is being given such posts . India is biased and all that bull**** ..

But does he realize that by depriving children / youth of education he is actually harming the interests of kashmir .

Guys we need to act and act fast .. If he takes out another such calendar people should ignore him completely and start thrashing those *******s who damage people's property in the name of stone pelting aka Freedom ...

i can post more abt Kashmir leaders !!! by the way where did u met your frnd i wonder !!! if he is a freedom fighter he should be in kashmir fighting for the cause !!

Re: Two thirds in Kashmir want independence: poll

freedom from freedom !

Re: Two thirds in Kashmir want independence: poll

Here’s the original Poll :

Interestingly,

  1. two thirds in Kashmiri want independence, and *also *autonomy. Clearly people from Valley are themselves confused.
  2. the polarization between the opinions of Jammu/Laddakh and Valley is curious but not surprising.
  3. How practical and viable is independent Kashmir Valley, is a debatable issue.

Re: Two thirds in Kashmir want independence: poll

I hope things settled down in Kashmir soon and the separatist nuts are eradicated.

Re: Two thirds in Kashmir want independence: poll

Manmohan Singh ‘shocked’ by Kashmir protests, urges dialogue

NEW DELHI: Indian Prime Minister Manmohan Singh said on Wednesday he was “shocked and distressed” by deadly protests in Indian-administered Kashmir and called for calm to enable talks on the crisis to take place.

“I was shocked and distressed to see young men and women — even children —joining the protests on the streets,” Singh said at the opening of a meeting of political parties called to debate ways of easing tensions in the region.

Leaders of India’s main political parties debated Wednesday whether to ease harsh security laws in Indian-administered Kashmir as the government searched for a strategy to end months of increasingly violent protests in the region.

Under the laws, army officers in the region can search homes and make arrests without warrants, can shoot at anyone suspected of being a separatist and can blow up a building or a home on suspicion insurgents are using it.

The fate of Kashmir is one of the most volatile issues facing India. Control of the territory is divided between India and Pakistan, which both lay claim to the whole region and have fought two wars over it.

With no resolution in sight to the six decade dispute, thousands of protesters have taken to the streets over the past three summers, stoning troops and demanding independence from India or a merger with Pakistan.

In the worst violence so far this year, 18 protesters were killed in street battles on Monday, exacerbated by reports of Quran desecration in the United States. In response, authorities slapped a round-the-clock curfew across the territory and threatened to shoot violators on sight.

Prime Minister Manmohan Singh met with top politicians in New Delhi and appealed for ideas to end the violence.

‘‘I have said this earlier and I say it again: The only path for lasting peace and prosperity in Jammu and Kashmir is that of dialogue and discussion,’’ he said.

Singh accused separatist groups of orchestrating some of the violent protests, appealed for calm in the region and said the government was willing to talk to any group that did not espouse violence.

The chances of reaching a consensus over Kashmir is extremely unlikely, with political leaders deeply divided over how to proceed. Kashmiri politicians, hoping to regain some credibility with their people, have pressed for the lifting of the Armed Forces Special Powers Act in the region.

But some Cabinet ministers and the opposition Bharatiya Janata Party oppose even a partial lifting of the law, which they say would lead to even more violence.

‘‘We want peace to return to Kashmir. But it cannot return if separatists have a free hand and the army’s hands are tied,’’ BJP leader Arun Jaitley said Wednesday.

Even if the government agreed to lift the restrictions on Kashmir it would not necessarily appease separatist leaders.

Syed Ali Shah Geelani, a leader of the umbrella grouping All Parties Hurriyat Conference, has demanded India declare Kashmir an international dispute, withdraw hundreds of thousands of troops from the region and release all political prisoners as a precondition for talks.

‘‘It would mean total rejection if India rejects even one of our conditions for talks and reviewing the ongoing demonstrations,’’ Geelani told The Associated Press.

Since 1989, a violent, separatist insurgency and the ensuing crackdown by Indian forces have killed an estimated 68,000 people. Although the armed insurgency is largely suppressed, the region remains heavily militarised, with checkpoints along main roads, hundreds of thousands of troops stationed here and harsh emergency laws still in force, creating further friction with the restive population.

The violence this summer has claimed nearly 90 lives in the Himalayan region.

DAWN

Re: Two thirds in Kashmir want independence: poll

here we go again...they should just bring Kashmir into mainstream India, remove all the special clauses and if the separatists try any more violence then just do what Pakistan did in SWAT and Balochistan

Re: Two thirds in Kashmir want independence: poll

Isn't India is doing the same thing? Military action is not working in Kashmir. How many people do you think Indian Military will kill? 70% of the population wants freedom. Read my first post again.

Re: Two thirds in Kashmir want independence: poll

^ so Pakistan is hardly in a position to criticize India's handling of Kashmir then, right?

Next point - the 70% is of a section of J&K. Polling of only the dissenting area is invalid to derive any conclusions from.

Re: Two thirds in Kashmir want independence: poll

Folks just because two thirds of residents in Kashmir want independence it does not mean that is what should happen. Suppose 99% of the city, town or village where you want to live wish to become independent or wish to join Germany should that be granted to that town or whatever? The other thing is that very few people in Azad Kashmir are "Kashmiris". Most of the population in AK is Punjabi settlers and other Pahari people. You hardly ever hear anyone in AK speaking Kashmiri. Suppose 2/3rds of Americans wish to bomb Pakistan? Would it make it right?

Re: Two thirds in Kashmir want independence: poll

Swat was a domestic terrorism issue - we fulfilled the demands of the tehree-e-nafiz-e-shariat-e-Muhammadi (TNSF) but they reneged on their conditions and sought to establish their own laws. Balochistan is an internal issue, similar to the issue of your Maoist Rebels.

Whilst the Indian Constitution may call J&K an integral part of the Indian Union, India is a member of that comity which regards Kashmir as an internationally recognised disputed territory, and hence for it to do what you are suggesting would be illegal.

Re: Two thirds in Kashmir want independence: poll

No, because as I said, Balochistan and Swat are internal matters. And whilst India would like to call Kashmir its internal matter, that is simply not the case.

Your analogy would be correct if applied to the Naxalites. In that scenario, Pakistan would have no locus standi on the issue.

The majority of people in the area that you in India call 'the State of Jummu and Kashmir' wants independence from Indian rule. That is how democracy works. Seperatist sentiments are not as high in Jummu and Laddakh as they are in the Valley, but democracy is about what the majority wants.

Similarly, if we ever did get around to holding a plebiscite in Occupied Kashmir, Azad Kashmir, Gilgit-Baltistan, and the Trans-Karakoram tract (i.e. those areas comprising the former Princely state of Jammu and Kashmir), and the majority of individuals wanted independence, we in Pakistan would have to accept that (even though we know that the majority of Azad Kashmiris, specifically, do not want to seperate from Pakistan).

That is how democracy works; correct me if I am wrong.

Re: Two thirds in Kashmir want independence: poll

I think in the context of the Kashmir dispute, if two third of residents in Occupied Kashmir want independence that is exactly what should happen. As for the example you give, you’re confusing internal issues with internationally recognised disputes. But actually, strictly speaking, international law is so amibigious when it comes to this, that legally, any group can declare themselves an independent country (as in the case of Kosovo and the Conch Republic). Whether anyone recognises them or not is different.

But I think you need to be sensible; what happens if someone in India stands up and says: ‘I do not accept that the Congress Party should form the government just because it won the largest number of seats in the Lok Sabha because we wouldn’t accept it if the majority of people in Karnataka wanted to ban women from the state, and so we shouldn’t accept the results of 09 General Elections… etc

Point is, you could apply your analogy against any example of democracy.

This is often something a lot of Indians cite, but it is a claim based on ignorance.

You are correct in saying that a lot of those in Azad Kashmir are ethnically similar to Northern Punjabis and that Pahari is the main language spoken, but this has always been the case; it’s not due to settlers; obviously adjacent areas influence each other. It’s similar to how Laddakh and Jammu are not Kashmiri-speaking areas.