a good point sir jee…but let me elaborate more with your permission
Yes 70K Pakistanis are killed in war on terrorism but they have been killed by Pakistan Taliban and since those Pakistani taliban do nothing against USA/Nato in Afghanistan, USA/Nato as such do not see much staregic value in our war against Taliban Pakistan. USA/Nato want Afghan taliban and haqqani leadership which is hiding in quetta and peshawar. Pak supports them for its own strategic reasons. So now USA strategy is that we will protect Pak Taliban since you are protecting afghan/haqqani Taliban for last 15 years. I am not defending any side but stating facts
plus who created Pakistan taliban at first place? what Pak Army and establishment never tells Pakistanis is that those Pakistani Taliban were created by Pak army to fight proxy wars in kashmir in 90s but once musharaff asked them to stop their activities, they stated to fight against pak army and pakistani people. so we are just cleaning our own mess
Bottom line, we Pakistanis need to understand that we have suffered enormously because of our government’s longstanding ties with and tolerance for Jihadist outfits. I mean who conducted APS attack in Peshawar. Tehraki Taliban Pakistan. This is our war not US war. we have been forced to pay a heavy price for our army’s insane ambition to control and influence Afghanistan, and also contain India’s influence inside in afghanistan and to teach india a lesson in kashmir. why dont we talk about these facts as well? why do we keep on repeating same narrative that we lost 70K people and that we have nothing to do with afghan leadership ( doesn’t matter that we keep on finding afghan leaders on our soil…)
let me elaborate as well. Just like TTP has nothing to do with Nato as they dont attack them similarly haqqani group has nothing to do with us they dont attack us. so your point is moot. They protect our enemies and than cry we dont do more, pathetic argument but than they are loud mouth Americans. This general will do something useful like for once win a war for America.
As for creating Paksitan Taliban lets go one step back and who created this mess in first place, who sent arms to “Mujahdeen” to fight the soviets and how many attacks were there before 2002. Think about it.
One and only one, General Mohammad Zia-ul-Haq the former CAOS. After toppling the legally elected government and then killing ZAB he needed money. $billions were pumped during his tenure in the jehadi program orchestrated and designed by him and his cronies. Had Quaid-e-Azam known that military would fuk the country like that he would definitely stayed away from creation of such cursed country.
sir jee I am with you and i have said that (i can show you some posts of mine) that we are following our strategic objectives by protecting afghan taliban just like Americans are following their objectives in Afghanistan…i do not agree anymore with our objectives in today’s world but I understand these are our objectives. No issue there
but my issue is the blatant fabricated narrative by Pakistani establishment which it uses to fool Pakistanis. when USA says DO MORE against afghan/haqqni leadership, we say that we have lost 70K people, that this is US war we are fighting and that we are already conducting war on terrorism…blah blah. and that pisses me off as this is a lie. we have lost 70K people by fighting against Taliban Pakistan which WE created in 90s for proxy wars in kashmir. Ilyas kashmiri type commando led these terrorists outfits. we did not lose 70K people fighting against afghan taliban. So this is our war. this is our mess. this is not US war. why do we confuse our people by saying this is US war? this is the point I am raising from day one. Lets be open.
Let me ask this..did even one pakistani kill in any suicide attack conducted by afghan taliban? the answer is NO. did afghan taliban ever attack pak army HQ or our schools? the answer is NO. so how come US war in Afghanistan against afghan Taliban (who supported Al Qaeda) killed 70K Pakistanis in Pakistan? our 70K were killed by our own mess called Pak taliban created to do jihad in India.
obama jee, none of these attacks were were conducted by afghan taliban. what are you alking about? Afghan taliban have never conducted any attack on Pakistani soil. afghan taliban are taliban which were under the control of mullah omar, then mullah mansoor and now mullah haibatullah. additionally haqqani network is also considered to be part of afghan taliban but they are not under the direct leadership of mullah haibtaullah.
Pak army supports these afghan taliban for its strategic objectives and most of afghan taliban leadership is hidden in quetta and peshawar. Both mullah omar and mullah mansoor died on Pakistan soil.
all of the attacks referenced above by you were conducted by tahrik Taliban Pakistan TTP either alone or in some cases it was TTP+Al qaeda as told by pakistan army spokesman ISPR. I can give you one by one reference.
anyway, it is becoming clear that most folks in Pakistan do not even understand the difference between Pakistani Taliban (TTP) and Afghan Taliban. They Pak army is fighting against Pakistani Taliban called TTP and is supporting afghan taliban, whereas US/Nato is fighting against afghan taliban and is supporting Pakistan taliban TTP.
Thank you that is my point that general should not be a hypocrite and acknowledge what his country is doing. Before asking pak to get rid of afghan Taliban he should look into his own gerebaan.
As Imran said US has over thousands of soldiers armed to the teeth with most advanced weapon and they are afraid of haqqani groups 1500/2000 men. Doesnt say much about this general and his “brave” men.
theek hai janab … US army is hiding its flaws but so does pak army. why dont you come to that point sir jee? while we are lecturing US, why cant Pak army tell everyone including USA/Nato that “we DO NOT NEED your freaking aid. GO away, take your money. and listen, Afghan taliban are strategically important for us for XYZ reasons and we need to support them”.
but NO. we have been doing the exact opposite. we will take the money, then support Afghan taliban leadership in quetta/peshawar and then keep on denying it… and hell we are not even good at it and keep on getting busted. Osama bin laden (afghan taliban guest) was found on our soil, mullah omar was found on our soil and then mullah mansoor was found on our soil with Pakistani passport.
you know what…here is why we cant announce our association with Afghan Taliban? because we are on the wrong side of history and we are ashamed to announce that afghan taliban are our partner. Psk establishment shd understand that Afghan taliban are the past, will never fit in with 21st century and sooner or later will turn against us and will bite us…just like Pakistani taliban whom we created and today they are biting us.
That is exactly what bajwa told the visiting American the other day that we dont need your aid, just your acknowledgement of our efforts, And now this:
They want Pakistan to fight their war and consider 70,000 pakistanis killed as collateral damage, but do not consider Pakistan as their ally.
The declare all Taliban are bad and should be eliminated but negotiate with them in Qatar because some of them are good taliban.
They want passage through Pakistan for which they pay and think it is aid.
They support TTP to create trouble in pakistan and turn a blind eye towards RAW operating from under their noses but want Pakistan to do more.
They can find afghan Taliban guys in pakistan and drone them yet the TTP sitting under their noses cant be found.
With all their might they are unable to finish off Taliban, Isis operating from Afghanistan and are afraid of Haqqani group which numbers no more than a few thousand. Doesnt say much for their military might.
some points are debatable but getting ready for a long week… but hey nonetheless a good case especially point no 2 … you are getting better at debate sir jee
if Pak really wants to counter USA narrative , it shd heavily focus on point no 2. actually point no 2 will become even more stronger if we also point out that freaking Americans want Pakistan to broker negotiations with afghan taliban. so on one end they want Pak to fight and finish save havens for afghan taliban leadership but on the other end, they want Pak to help USA negotiate with afghan taliabn…
point 4 will also become more powerful if we also add that USA wants Pakistan to stop afghan Taliban penetrating into and from Afghanistan and for that wants more pak soliders on its western border but for that it shd force india and pak to have peaceful relationship so that pak can move its forces from Indian border to Afghanistan border…but instead, trump is specifically favoring india and urging him to get more involved on afghanistan. this will encourage india to become more aggressive against pakistan and as a result Pak army and will continue to divide its forces on both borders
Pakistan can and should tell Uncle J Trump your first priority is to protect the next generation of US young adults who are Overdosing on Drugs instead of deploying Hi Tech Armies against People who are riding motorcycles and horses who have no resources what so ever even to board a commercial flight into a neighboring country let alone go as far away as USA.
There was not a single Afghan on those planes that hit the towers on 9/11. all from Arab countries right?
The Afghans got played big time by Uncle Sam demanding they give up a Guest knowing all along that Pathan’s Ghairat does not allow them
to give up a guest in their home no matter what!
The real war and big time casualties is going on inside the US that You Donald J Trump have done nothing about except talk!
It is a shame that a Super Power has to play dirty games to keep it’s population Employed because all it knows is how to build weapons of mass destruction! while its children are overdosing on drugs.
**
