Triple Talaq valid?

[Pakilarka]

Re: Triple Talaq valid?

for that we have to know the ilm of Fiqh. *Sunnat of prophet takes over the words of Quran with the assumption that if Prophet was doing it, knowingly that Quran *

I cant believe u r saying this. If you ever get into such issue it simply means The book where u read about such sunnat is wrong. Prophet's s.a.w Sunnat and Quran go side by side. Only thing ALLAH has promised to us is that Quran wont change, Ahadeeth and Sunnat we get to read or hear about wont always be true. If a hadith or sunnat contradicts with Quran then it is wrong.

[TLK]

Re: Triple Talaq valid?

I cant believe u r saying this. If you ever get into such issue it simply means The book where u read about such sunnat is wrong. Prophet's Sunnat and Quran go side by side. Only thing ALLAH has promised to us is that Quran wont change, Ahadeeth and Sunnat we get to read or hear about wont always be true. If a hadith or sunnat contradicts with Quran then it is wrong.

do you know that there are Ayat/Ehkaam of Quran that contradict each other? How do you figure that out.

Just because Quran and Sunnat are contrdicting, does not make Quran un-true (naoozobillah). The ruling will not apply, that is it. The words remain true.

[canadiandesigirl]

Re: Triple Talaq valid?

From what I have heard/read is that YES, the Quran says divorce should be given in three parts and this is the preferred method. Although it doesn't say it CANT be done all in one go; therefore it is still a valid divorce. Please correct me if I'm wrong.

[JeevayPakistan]

Re: Triple Talaq valid?

do you know that there are Ayat/Ehkaam of Quran that contradict each other? How do you figure that out.

Just because Quran and Sunnat are contrdicting, does not make Quran un-true (naoozobillah). The ruling will not apply, that is it. The words remain true.

This is ridiculous and totally rubbish. Can you please quote from Quran where you find contradiction? On contrary, in the very beginning Quran puts a categorical claim that you won't find any contradiction in Quran.

[2:3] This is a perfect Book; there is no doubt in it; it is a guidance for the righteous,

So tell me, how can it be a perfect book and without doubt if there's contradiction in it?

[TLK]

Re: Triple Talaq valid?

Abu Sahbaa said to Hazrath Ibn Abbas: Enlighten us with your information whether the three divorces (pronounced at one and the same time) were treated as one during the lifetime of Allah's Messenger (sallallahu alayhi wasallam), and that of Abu Bakr (RA), and during three years of the Caliphate of Umar (RA)? Ibn Abbas(RA) said: “Yes”. (MUSLIM : Kitab-al-Talaaq : 3492).

The following report of Abdullah ibn Abbas (RA) is contained in the Muwatta of Imam Malik (RA): "It reached Maalik that a person told Abdullah ibn Abbas (RA): 'I gave my wife 100 divorces in one sitting. What is your opinion about me?' Abdullah ibn Abbas (RA) said: 'Three divorces made her absolutely BAA'IN to you, and by the remaining 97 divorces you have made fun of the verses of Allah.'." (MUWATTA : Kitab-al-Talaaq :111 9)

It seems that Imam Muslim and Imam Malik did not know about the rulings of Quran, what Muftiyaan-e-Google of GS know about it now.

[JeevayPakistan]

Re: Triple Talaq valid?

@TLK

It seems that Imam Muslim and Imam Malik did not know about the rulings of Quran, what Muftiyaan-e-Google of GS know about it now.

I am sorry - but I give precedence to first Quran and then Sunnah and then Ahadith (in the same order) over any other thing. But that’s just me

[TLK]

Re: Triple Talaq valid?

Jeeavay, I believe from the bottom of my heart that I will become a kaafir if (astaghfarullah) i think that Quran ayat has any doubts. That is all I can say.

[KaafHaaYaaAynSaad]

Re: Triple Talaq valid?

Brother, we can't sit here and quote Quran in English and say we know more than the scholars who've spent their lives for this deen. I mean, do you really think that you have found a meaning in the Quran that these scholars couldn't find?

Also, there are two kinds of rulings in the Quran. One, that's explicit, for example, alcohol is haram or eating pork is haram. Then, there are rulings which need interpretation, for example, the number of days for a woman who is divorced. The qord used in the Quran is "quroo," which can be interpreted in more than one ways.

[Pakilarka]

Re: Triple Talaq valid?

do you know that there are Ayat/Ehkaam of Quran that contradict each other? How do you figure that out.

Just because Quran and Sunnat are contrdicting, does not make Quran un-true (naoozobillah). The ruling will not apply, that is it. The words remain true.

There are ahkaam in Quran that changed. The new one takes over as a rule. However saying that Prophet s.a.w sunnat can go against Quran is not accpetable as a muslim.

Brother, we can't sit here and quote Quran in English and say we know more than the scholars who've spent their lives for this deen. I mean, do you really think that you have found a meaning in the Quran that these scholars couldn't find?

Also, there are two kinds of rulings in the Quran. One, that's explicit, for example, alcohol is haram or eating pork is haram. Then, there are rulings which need interpretation, for example, the number of days for a woman who is divorced. The qord used in the Quran is "quroo," which can be interpreted in more than one ways.

Bro am sure Mirza Ghulam Ahmed Qadyaani was more learnt than most of scholars of his time. If all the other scholars r rite doing there interpretation of Quran than why is Mirza Ghulam Ahmed wrong ? why can't his theory of Khatmin Nabiyeen be valid just like other scholars have there own interpretition.

giving someone an edge on being more learnt is acceptable but we as ignorant public have right to ask questions and answer cant be that scholar knows more than us so he is rite. Thats what a hindu wud say that their padri at mandir is more learnt than u hence he shld follow the padri and not listen to u.

[system]

Re: Triple Talaq valid?

with all due respect..

How many of you quoting Quran actually consult Quran in your EVERYDAY life to see if what you are doing is correct or if Quran says I should do it or not...

The issue here is not whether giving 3 talaqs is a proper practice..the issue is whether 3 talaq means the husband and wife are haram for each other wether given in one go or in proper manner of breaking it up...

This is NOT the forum to discuss this...if you have any questions or concerns you should be contacting your local Mufti as they have gone through school just for this...

May Allah guide us all to do the right thing...And may Allah forgives us all if we have unintentionally disrespected his word or actions of Prophet Sullaho Alaihi Wasalm.

[diwana]

Re: Triple Talaq valid?

There are hadiths which support three talaqs at one time considered as three. Not one.

There are hadiths where the prophet SAW got angry on someone uttering this word three times, and did not say this should be considered as only one.

*There is nothing in Quran which says three at once are invalid.
*
If there is something not mentioned in Quran then islamic rulings or fiqah is drawn out of hadiths and sunnah.

@Pakilarka

I don't think you are wrong in your position is that Quran supersedes hadiths. Absolutely! **

ANY word of Quran supersedes ANY hadith.**

If any so called hadith directly contrdicts Quran then hadith will be considered invalid and false.

**Here the discussion is that thee is nothing in Quran which shows three talaqs at once invalid but hadiths do mention it.

Sometimes one can draw the general consensus from overall Quranic teachings and say something is not valid or some acts are wrong.

But, when none of the verse in Quran says three in one setting is invalid. And hadith say it is valid.** The it can be considered valid.

Please prove it wrong.

[KaafHaaYaaAynSaad]

Re: Triple Talaq valid?

Bro am sure Mirza Ghulam Ahmed Qadyaani was more learnt than most of scholars of his time. If all the other scholars r rite doing there interpretation of Quran than why is Mirza Ghulam Ahmed wrong ? why can't his theory of Khatmin Nabiyeen be valid just like other scholars have there own interpretition.

giving someone an edge on being more learnt is acceptable but we as ignorant public have right to ask questions and answer cant be that scholar knows more than us so he is rite. Thats what a hindu wud say that their padri at mandir is more learnt than u hence he shld follow the padri and not listen to u.

You cannot have a "different opinion" that goes against the fundamentals of Islam. You can have difference in regards to jurisprudence, not Aqeedah as a whole.

Qadiyannis are not Muslims if they hold these beliefs. In fact, any one who says there is another prophet after the Prophet SAW has deviated from the Straight Path.

[NomiCA]

Re: Triple Talaq valid?

@diwana

There are hadiths which support three talaqs at one time considered as three. Not one.

There are hadiths where the prophet SAW got angry on someone uttering this word three times, and did not say this should be considered as only one.

*There is nothing in Quran which says three at once are invalid. * If there is something not mentioned in Quran then islamic rulings or fiqah is drawn out of hadiths and sunnah.

@Pakilarka

I don't think you are wrong in your position is that Quran supersedes hadiths. Absolutely! **

ANY word of Quran supersedes ANY hadith.**

If any so called hadith directly contrdicts Quran then hadith will be considered invalid and false.

**Here the discussion is that thee is nothing in Quran which shows three talaqs at once invalid but hadiths do mention it.

Sometimes one can draw the general consensus from overall Quranic teachings and say something is not valid or some acts are wrong.

But, when none of the verse in Quran says three in one setting is invalid. And hadith say it is valid.** The it can be considered valid.

Please prove it wrong.

Please tell one thing.......regardless of validity..

Does the Quran prescribe 3 separate time separated talaqs or not??

[Pakilarka]

Re: Triple Talaq valid?

@KaafHaaYaaAynSaad

You cannot have a "different opinion" that goes against the fundamentals of Islam. You can have difference in regards to jurisprudence, not Aqeedah as a whole.

Qadiyannis are not Muslims if they hold these beliefs. In fact, any one who says there is another prophet after the Prophet SAW has deviated from the Straight Path.

I understand that issue of 3 divorces isnt as critical as not believing that Prophet s.a.w is last Prophet. I also understand the differences between different sects of Muslims. However i dunt think there shld be any differences for something like 3 divorces when Quran is clearly explaining the order.

When ALLAH has clearly said dont expel woman out of ur houses after talaq and nither should woman leave until her idat is complete unless its case of open morality. Then how can we just do 3 talaqs in one go and show them the way out ?

Lets not pinpoint Hanafis..... I have never heared of a divorce where woman stayed in the house for prescribed time after divorce.This is our muslim culutre now, Even if three divorces r done the last two are done through post mail when woman is back to her parents.

[diwana]

Re: Triple Talaq valid?

There are three salat mentioned in Quran, so five time salat invalid?

@NomiCA

Please tell one thing.......regardless of validity..

Does the Quran prescribe 3 separate time separated talaqs or not??

I know what you are getting at.

That is why I asked above a question about three salat times mentioned in Quran. (Some even argue that there are only two salat times mentioned in Quran)

Does Quran prescribe five salat? How many rakaats in one salat? etc. etc.

The answer to your question is yes.

[Pakilarka]

Re: Triple Talaq valid?

@diwana

There are hadiths which support three talaqs at one time considered as three. Not one.

There are hadiths where the prophet SAW got angry on someone uttering this word three times, and did not say this should be considered as only one.

*There is nothing in Quran which says three at once are invalid. * If there is something not mentioned in Quran then islamic rulings or fiqah is drawn out of hadiths and sunnah.

@Pakilarka

I don't think you are wrong in your position is that Quran supersedes hadiths. Absolutely! **

ANY word of Quran supersedes ANY hadith.**

If any so called hadith directly contrdicts Quran then hadith will be considered invalid and false.

**Here the discussion is that thee is nothing in Quran which shows three talaqs at once invalid but hadiths do mention it.

Sometimes one can draw the general consensus from overall Quranic teachings and say something is not valid or some acts are wrong.

But, when none of the verse in Quran says three in one setting is invalid. And hadith say it is valid.** The it can be considered valid.

Please prove it wrong.

Hey Bro, Here is what i quoted earlier:

Chapter 65 : Divorce, First two Ayats trasnlation by Abdul Daryabadi.
Verse 1
O Prophet! when ye divorce women, divorce them before their waitrng-period; and count the waiting period; and fear Allah, your Lord. Drive them not out of their houses, nor should they go forth, unless they commit a manifest indecency. These are the bounds of Allah; and whosoever trespasseth the bounds of Allah, hath surely wronged himself. Thou knowest not, that haply Allah may hereafter bring something new to pass.
Verse 2
Then when they have attained their term, either retain them reputably, or part from them reputably, and take as witnesses two just men from among you, and set up your testimony for Ailah. Thus is exhorted he who believeth in Allah and the Last Day. And whosoever feareth Allah He maketh for him an outlet.

Now if Quran says dont drink Alcohal.
Quran doesnt say anything about combining milk with vine, does that mean i can add little milk in alcohal and then drink it ?

[canadiandesigirl]

Re: Triple Talaq valid?

@Pakilarka

Hey Bro, Here is what i quoted earlier:

Chapter 65 : Divorce, First two Ayats trasnlation by Abdul Daryabadi. Verse 1 O Prophet! when ye divorce women, divorce them before their waitrng-period; and count the waiting period; and fear Allah, your Lord. Drive them not out of their houses, nor should they go forth, unless they commit a manifest indecency. These are the bounds of Allah; and whosoever trespasseth the bounds of Allah, hath surely wronged himself. Thou knowest not, that haply Allah may hereafter bring something new to pass. Verse 2 Then when they have attained their term, either retain them reputably, or part from them reputably, and take as witnesses two just men from among you, and set up your testimony for Ailah. Thus is exhorted he who believeth in Allah and the Last Day. And whosoever feareth Allah He maketh for him an outlet.

Now if Quran says dont drink Alcohal. Quran doesnt say anything about combining milk with vine, does that mean i can add little milk in alcohal and then drink it ?

You know, after reading that verse. It leaves no doubt that this is the way divorce should be given. Thanks for posting this.

[Pakilarka]

Re: Triple Talaq valid?

From what I have heard/read is that YES, the Quran says divorce should be given in three parts and this is the preferred method. Although it doesn't say it CANT be done all in one go; therefore it is still a valid divorce. Please correct me if I'm wrong.

@canadiandesigirl

You know, after reading that verse. It leaves no doubt that this is the way divorce should be given. Thanks for posting this.

I am glad that my posts was able to change view of atleast one person. :) May ALLAH guide us all.

[diwana]

Re: Triple Talaq valid?

@Pakilarka

Hey Bro, Here is what i quoted earlier:

Chapter 65 : Divorce, First two Ayats trasnlation by Abdul Daryabadi. Verse 1 O Prophet! when ye divorce women, divorce them before their waitrng-period; and count the waiting period; and fear Allah, your Lord. Drive them not out of their houses, nor should they go forth, unless they commit a manifest indecency. These are the bounds of Allah; and whosoever trespasseth the bounds of Allah, hath surely wronged himself. Thou knowest not, that haply Allah may hereafter bring something new to pass. Verse 2 Then when they have attained their term, either retain them reputably, or part from them reputably, and take as witnesses two just men from among you, and set up your testimony for Ailah. Thus is exhorted he who believeth in Allah and the Last Day. And whosoever feareth Allah He maketh for him an outlet.

Now if Quran says dont drink Alcohal. Quran doesnt say anything about combining milk with vine, does that mean i can add little milk in alcohal and then drink it ?

Bhai mere!
The issue is not **just **what is prescribed in Quran. This is a better method. Acceptable and halal method. A good method where there is a chance of reconciliation between husband and wife. All agreed.

But if you read above posts, there is no hadith which says three in one is not valid rather it says three in one setting CAN lead to divorce without reconcilliation. "Halala" was prescribed to the woman who was given three in one setting talaq by the Prophet SAW.

Read Bukhari and Muslim and other books on hadiths.

Now if it were to be one hadith, one could say maybe three in one setting is not 'valid'. But there are several examples.

Three in one is not a good practice (haram) but still can lead to full talaq.

**
Why not just be on safer side and never utter this word one time let alone thrice?**

---

Now regarding your question of vine and milk. That is not related to discussion at all since as far as I know there is no hadith which says alcoho/vinel and milk in any amount can be mixed.

---

I would say you believe in what you consider right. But you or anyone cannot just disregard hadiths especially if there are so many and not 'weak'.

If we take hadiths out of Islam and merely try to follow Quran, then even bigger issues can develop. :)

[KaafHaaYaaAynSaad]

Re: Triple Talaq valid?

@Pakilarka

I understand that issue of 3 divorces isnt as critical as not believing that Prophet s.a.w is last Prophet. I also understand the differences between different sects of Muslims. However i dunt think there shld be any differences for something like 3 divorces when Quran is clearly explaining the order.

When ALLAH has clearly said dont expel woman out of ur houses after talaq and nither should woman leave until her idat is complete unless its case of open morality. Then how can we just do 3 talaqs in one go and show them the way out ?

Lets not pinpoint Hanafis… I have never heared of a divorce where woman stayed in the house for prescribed time after divorce.This is our muslim culutre now, Even if three divorces r done the last two are done through post mail when woman is back to her parents.

Bro, have a read of this: The Issue of Three Divorces

The matter is not just about reading a verse from the Quran in English and getting a ruling out of it. Yes, there are scholars who say 3 divorce is still one divorce. And, then there is the other opinion. So, it’s matter of difference of opinion. Insha’Allah.