Torture at Abu Ghraib (MERGED)

The Indian’s have spoken…

http://www.indianexpress.com/full_story.php?content_id=46764

George speaks out against Iraq abuse

Defence Minister George Fernandes has expressed his ‘‘outrage’’ at the abuse of Iraqi prisoners by US occupation troops and appealed to political parties to condemn the incident. In an official statement, Fernandes today asked political parties to speak as one voice and demand that international laws are observed and respected.

Fernandes is the first NDA minister to have commented on the ill-treatment of prisoners at Abu Ghraib prison in Iraq. Deputy Prime Minister L.K. Advani called the Abu Ghraib episode ‘‘disgusting”. Fernandes said : ‘‘We call upon the world community to insist upon the implementation of international laws governing the treatment of prisoners of war, beginning from Saddam Hussein right down to the ordinary man and woman on the streets of Iraq.’’ Terming the abuse as a ‘‘breakdown of ethical norms in the chain of command of the US army’’ Fernandes said this was an indication of the US Army’s disregard for international laws. Such behaviour, he said, also exposed the lack of ‘‘humanitarian conduct.’’ He added that the US had much to explain and owed an apology for the incidents.

Experts: 9/11 vengeance fed Iraq abuse](http://www.boston.com/news/nation/articles/2004/05/11/experts_911_vengeance_fed_iraq_abuse?pg=2)

As U.S. forces surged through the desert to topple Saddam Hussein, slogans and symbols referring to the attacks of Sept. 11, 2001, made clear that a spirit of anti-terrorism vengeance infused the ranks. “Let’s Roll” was a common battle cry, evoking the defiant passengers aboard one of the planes hijacked in those attacks. Soldiers displayed flags from Ground Zero and images of the World Center’s twin towers. More than a year after Saddam’s ouster, no proof of his ties to Al Qaida or Sept. 11 has materialized. Some skeptics suggest that the avenging rhetoric and imagery instead may have fostered an atmosphere conducive to the maltreatment of Iraqis who had no connection whatever to international terrorism. Curt Goering, deputy executive director of Amnesty International-USA, said the Bush administration bears some responsibility for blurring the lines between Sept. 11 and the Iraq war. “The tone that was set, all the way to the top, and the climate in which these soldiers operated was an invitation to this kind of abuse,” Goering said. “Governments have the obligation to take appropriate steps to protect their citizens, but they have to take these in a manner consistent with respect for fundamental human rights.”

The Army’s own investigative report, by Maj. Gen. Antonio Taguba, suggested that interrogation techniques used against suspected terrorists detained at Guantanamo Bay were applied inappropriately in Iraq. Taguba concluded that there were many common criminals at Baghdad’s Abu Ghraib prison, but probably no detainees linked to Al Qaida or other international terrorist groups. In a separate report, the International Committee of the Red Cross suggested that most Abu Ghraib prisoners were detained by mistake. However, Army Lt. Col. Joe Yoswa, a Pentagon spokesman, said Tuesday it was wrong to suggest that the prison abuse was symptomatic of broader problems of attitude. As for the Sept. 11 imagery, Yoswa said it was hard to gauge what impact such rallying cries had on individual soldiers. “Does a rallying cry motivate troops to go out and do things? Yes,” he said. “It motivates people to stand up and volunteer and help try to get Iraq on its feet as a country.” Some American Islamic leaders contend the maltreatment at Abu Ghraib is part of a wider animosity toward Muslims that was stirred up by Sept. 11.

The prisoner abuse “represents a growing trend in our culture that demonizes and dehumanizes Arabs and Muslims,” the Arab American Anti-Discrimination Committee and the Muslim Public Affairs Council said in a joint statement. “It conflates innocents with criminals.” U.S. officials have consistently depicted the Iraq conflict as part of the war on terrorism, and many soldiers said their decision to serve was prompted by Sept. 11. Among them was Pfc. Lynndie England, one of the soldiers charged with abuse; her lawyer says she joined the Army Reserves to help prevent future terrorist attacks. Capt. Adrian Wheeler, commander of a Kentucky Army National Guard military police company, said the Sept. 11 attacks – rather than contributing to any excesses – provided an incentive to perform better. “At no point have we loosened up on professionalism or the values that we hold true,” said Wheeler, a Louisville police officer whose troops transported Iraqi POWs from battlefields to temporary holding facilities.

“After 9-11, if anything, soldiers, citizens I think really wanted to prove themselves as professionals,” Wheeler said. “That was the time when people really stepped up.” Leonard Wong, a professor of military strategy at the U.S. Army War College in Carlisle, Pa., has visited Iraq twice to assess the motivations of U.S. soldiers. While some cited Sept. 11, more expressed a desire to liberate Iraq or help it achieve stability, Wong said. However, Sept. 11 imagery provided a backdrop for many troops during the early phases of the war. The Navy Seabees, for example, called their Kuwaiti base “Camp 93” in honor of the passengers who fought hijackers aboard United Airlines Flight 93 before it crashed in Pennsylvania. One of the units at Abu Ghraib was named after Peter Ganci, a fire chief killed at the World Trade Center. “Soldiers were encouraged to make the incorrect links,” said Jimmy Massey, a former Marine sergeant from Waynesboro, N.C., who served in Iraq, then quit the force and has affiliated with an anti-war group called Veterans for Peace.

Massey said “a bunch of innocent civilians” were killed by his platoon and he attributed these deaths in part to military intelligence reports warning of potential terrorist attacks by non-uniformed Iraqis. “You put a bunch of Army or Marines out in the desert and tell them to guard these supposed terrorists, and they’re going to start inventing ways to keep themselves busy,” Massey said. Nancy Lessin of Boston, who co-founded a group called Military Families Speak Out, said her stepson’s Marine unit took along a flag from Ground Zero when it headed to Iraq. “That whole 9-11 connection paved the way for certain things to happen in certain ways,” she said. “It’s revenge and vengeance, based on a lie.” Curt Goering, the Amnesty International official, said at least some of the soldiers who committed abuses likely believed their actions were patriotic. “Carrying out these despicable acts doesn’t just happen,” he said. “In every war, part of the process of transforming a person into a soldier involves a certain dehumanizing of the enemy. … They often believe they’re acting for the greater good.”

Another reason why Rumsfeld should be sacked.. even if Boykin was not involved, his continued presence is a stain on our notion of liberty and further evidence that Rumsfeld and his boss, Bush, are not serious about actually solving issues…

General Who Made Anti-Islam Remark Tied to POW Case](Yahoo News: Latest and Breaking News, Headlines, Live Updates, and More)

A Senate hearing into the abuse of Iraqi prisoners was told on Tuesday that Lt. Gen. William Boykin, an evangelical Christian *under review *for saying his God was superior to that of the Muslims, briefed a top Pentagon civilian official last summer on recommendations on ways military interrogators could gain more intelligence from Iraqi prisoners.

Critics have suggested those recommendations amounted to a senior-level go-ahead for the sexual and physical abuse of prisoners, possibly to “soften up” detainees before interrogation – a charge the Pentagon denies.

… and how damn long does it take to review whether or not someone said something when that something has been recorded??

What a surprise…

Damn right!

No pun intended:disgust:

nice signature there BTW Malik, it sounds familiar for some reason.

Re: Who ordered 'shock and awe'? - The source of debauchery

[QUOTE]
Originally posted by Malik73: *
*...the moral debauchery came down the chain of command from Washington

Young military reservists from small American towns do not spontaneously torture, humiliate, sexually abuse and obscenely mock powerless prisoners unless people in authority over them have ordered or encouraged them to do so. An American friend who works in Saudi Arabia recently e-mailed me to say "it's all over with those pro-American Arabs who until now have credited Washington with good intentions in Iraq. Photographs of American women soldiers sexually taunting and abusing naked and bound Arab men says to them that the United States is a totally depraved society." But who debauched these young American men and women soldiers? I would argue that the moral debauchery came down the chain of command from Washington.
[/QUOTE]

Exactly these hooligan american army and its routine abuse and torture is a product of there society.

*When these GI Joes take these sick pictures it is like some kind of sick holiday snaps, they abuse, urinate and molest iraqis then take pictures as if they in Disneyland taking pictures with mickey and minnie mouse!
*

Total madness!

When the Bush regime stated that the Geneva convention was not applicable to Guantanamo bay, it gave the message to all it's soldiers that any prisoner could be maltreated, and they could get away with it.

In all this, we seem to have forgotten Afghanistan and Guantanamo Bay, where all the American torture of prisoners began, and which the American regime always dismissed. No doubt if CBS or others start airing graphic torture pictures from those places the US regime will admit it, after years of denials?

Nadia, i was reading up on an article about teh female detainees as well, its so upsetting..

all ican say is that they (the soldiers) are forcing their filth on innocent people, its so upsetting just to think what they did to the women.

recently some pictures of an Iraqi woman being raped in the desert have come up, lowlife b********s

it seems as though Muslims dont really count in the world anymore, they are no longer even seen as humans, but numbers on the death charts

[QUOTE]
*Originally posted by Stu: *
nice signature there BTW Malik, it sounds familiar for some reason.
[/QUOTE]
What exactly is that supposed to mean??

Y'know.. maybe it's a good thing that the US doesn't ever intervene militarily in African affairs.. if they can dehumanize Iraqi and Arabs in general, imagine their mindset with black Africans who they have a history of hate with.

[QUOTE]
*Originally posted by Xara: *

it seems as though Muslims dont really count in the world anymore, they are no longer even seen as humans, but numbers on the death charts
[/QUOTE]

That's true, but even after these horrendous revelations the demonisation of Arabs/Iraqi's/Muslims is continuing.

Let's Gather the Reasons

The sample of despicable pictures taken in the infamous Abu Gareeb prison clearly showed that the Iraqi prisoners were tortured, humiliated and subjected to the types of sexual perversions that are widespread within the American society. This has clearly angered the Islamic world, but it has surprised no one! Amnesty International and other Human rights groups also voiced this opinion and they have received many similar complaints in the past.

The British cousins have also been engaging in such practices, which is expected as they both share the same heritage and values.

President George Bush responded by stating that:"Their treatment does not reflect the nature of the American people." Let's see now, America is the highest producer and consumer of Porn. The gamut of sexual perversion including the sexual practice of bondage is widespread and licensed under the notion of 'freedom'. Bondage involves torture, humiliation and other sorts of bizarre perversion. Homosexuality has become a norm.

An average American soldier is usually raised in such an environment, subjected to a range of Porn, early sexual abuse and gratuitous violence. Their own statistics reveal that 33% are born out of wedlock and many of them do not know the identity of their father, hence often subjected to sexual abuse and neglect. This is why one individual pointed out to an American when he called Usamah Bin Laden a 'bas****', that Usamah and every Al-Qaeeda member clearly knows the identity of their father, hence the title is more suitable for those Americans citizens! Those pictures along with the numerous independent reports only confirm the American identity of their soldiers. Add this to their racist outlook towards non-Europeans and Muslims/Arabs in particular, demonised by the powerful mass media (that dwarfs the lone channel of Al-Jazeerah) that constantly promotes a culture of hate and intolerance.

Mr. George Bush went on to state that: "That's not the way we do tthings in America." Yes, most will agree, in America such practices are usually kept hidden, especially for those in influential positions like the government. This is why the likes of Bill Clinton was engaging in his seedy activities with his secretary Monika Lewinsky in private, another liberated and a free woman. So the shame is not in committing the actual action but being exposed to the public. This is simply because the USA leadership has to pretend to be a leading moral 'Christian' nation, even though it's masses do not observe the same moral code. Like the way they scorn Islamic polygamy but it would be difficult to find honest monogamous individuals in a sea of sexual perversion.

Therefore, George Bush is embarrassed as his 'Christian' soldiers (Let's hope General William Boykin is taking note) has been caught and exposed by the mass media. Had this been originally broadcast by Al-Jazeerah, it would have been charged with incitement to sexual perversion! If President Bush was informed of this matter quietly rather than through the media, it might have caused some level of discomfort (or comfort) but most certainly he would not have been embarrassed. As such activities are very common within USA society and much worse things are occurring daily. Jerry Springer can confirm this as he displays these moronic, perverted and degenerated USA citizens on his TV shows daily.

These are acts of perverted soldiers; hence it is highly unlikely that such incidences are exceptions rather than the norm. So, just think what has not been reported and how long have these activities have been taking place! The pictures caught, only reveal the tip of the iceberg. The various reports indicate this has been occurring since the fall of Baghdad, under operation Iraqi 'freedom', but freedom for whom?

Apart from sexual perversion, the pictures also reveal torture of prisoners. The gratuitous violence is also widespread within the USA and rooted in it's history, the nation was born in the blood of the millions of Native Americans. Likewise it's British cousins did the same to the Irish and the Australians did to its Aboriginal population. This same instinctive violence of the Wild West was displayed in Fallujah, where the USA army massacred hundreds.

Only recently, the CNN TV showed a clip of a USA marine killing a wounded Iraqi, who later gave an interview and spoke proudly of his 'achievement'. It seems, that no accountability, no war crimes, no Geneva conventions and no UN resolutions are applicable to the Americans! Who can forget when Donald Rumsfeld was referring to the Geneva convention at the beginning of the conflict when some USA POWs were shown on TV whilst they were breaking every rule in Guantanamo Bay, even that was mild compared to what CBS broadcasted recently. The USA administration has simply become immune to the notion of hypocrisy.

In defence the offending soldiers are claiming ignorance of Geneva Convention and lack of training. That only proves the above points, that by their very nature these people are thugs, criminals and perverted. Common sense dictates that maltreating prisoners is wrong, and is understood by all societies and civilisations, except 'civilised' America. Then the USA has the gall of wrapping its conduct with their usual ranting about democracy, freedom and human rights.

Now guess what that woman US soldier is saying:-

England: Superiors Gave Iraq Abuse Orders

The Army private facing a court-martial for being photographed with naked Iraqi prisoners says she was following orders to create psychological pressure on them. Pfc. Lynndie England told KCNC-TV in Denver on Tuesday that her superiors gave her specific instructions on how to pose for the photos. **Asked who gave the orders, she would say only, “Persons in my chain of command.” ** In photographs that have been shown worldwide, England, 21, is seen smiling, cigarette in her mouth, as she leans forward and points at the genitals of a naked, hooded Iraqi. Another photo taken at Baghdad’s Abu Ghraib prison shows her holding a leash that encircles the neck of a naked Iraqi man lying on his side. “I was instructed by persons in higher rank to `stand there, hold this leash, look at the camera,’ and they took picture for PsyOps (psychological operations),” she told the station. “I didn’t really, I mean, want to be in any pictures,” she said. She also said she thought “it was kind of weird.” The interview with England, a military reservist from West Virginia, was taped Tuesday in North Carolina. England, who is now at Fort Bragg, also met Tuesday with one of a team of Denver lawyers who have volunteered to take her case. Asked whether worse things happened than those already seen on the photos, she said yes but declined to elaborate. She said her superiors praised the photos and “just told us, ‘Hey, you’re doing great, keep it up.’” England faces a military court-martial that includes charges such as conspiracy to maltreat prisoners and assault consummated by battery, and could face punishment ranging from a reprimand to more than 15 years in prison. No date has been set for a hearing in the case.

Six other soldiers from the 372nd Military Police Company are also charged. One, Spc. Jeremy C. Sivits of Hyndman, Pa., will face a court-martial in Baghdad next week. “We don’t feel like we were doing things that we weren’t supposed to because we were told to do them,” England said. “We think everything was justified because we were instructed to do this and to do that.” After meeting with England, attorney Giorgio Ra’Shadd said she shouldn’t be used as a scapegoat by the military. “You don’t see my client doing anything abusive at all,” Ra’Shadd said in an interview. “I think she was ordered to smile.” Ra’Shadd said England was pulled into the situations by intelligence agents who subverted the military chain of command. He said they used England to humiliate the men being photographed so they could show the pictures to more important prisoners and threaten them with the same treatment. “The spooks took over the jail,” said Ra’Shadd. Now in private practice, he was formerly an Army lawyer assigned to the civil affairs and psychological operations command at Fort Bragg. Also Tuesday, Pentagon officials told a Senate committee that the prison conditions shown in the pictures were confined to a few low-level soldiers and intelligence officers. But Ra’Shadd contended that the blame for the scandal lies high up in the chain of command, arguing that only the highest-ranking officials could have allowed civilian intelligence to override military command structure.

^ Soldiers are criminally liable for following unlawful orders. Whether or not someone told her to do it doesn't make a difference. She did it and did it with a smile.

It sure is nice that she's able to talk to her lawyers though, huh?

She sure sounds as intelligent as she looks!

Or should I say she's as thick as she looks!

Or thicker than she looks!

Or not as thick as she looks!

[QUOTE]
*Originally posted by spoon: *
^ Soldiers are criminally liable for following unlawful orders. Whether or not someone told her to do it doesn't make a difference. She did it and did it with a smile.

It sure is nice that she's able to talk to her lawyers though, huh?
[/QUOTE]

Yes, but one thing to note is that American commentators are now trying to identify the "root causes" of why US soldiers tortured and killed Iraqi's.

spoon that makes 150 000 criminally liable people, the lawyers will have a field day.

The invasion was/is illegal.

More pictures and videos due out, that will shake the criminal Bush regime further…

Lawmakers: New Abuse Photos Show Torture](Yahoo News: Latest and Breaking News, Headlines, Live Updates, and More)

***Lawmakers said they saw disturbing images that included military dogs snarling at cowering prisoners, Iraqi women commanded to expose their breasts and photos of sex acts, including forced homosexual sex. In addition, lawmakers said there were images of hooded Iraqi prisoners being forced to masturbate while cameras captured the scene.

In addition, lawmakers said there were images of hooded Iraqi prisoners being forced to masturbate while cameras captured the scene. Rep. Jane Harman, D-Calif., said she saw a clothed man hurling himself against a wall as though trying to knock himself unconscious. “It was yet another series of pictures depicting horrific acts, examples of torture and sexual abuse,” said Senate Democratic leader Tom Daschle of South Dakota.***