Re: Top 10 excuses by women who don’t wear the Hijab
read my posts i think u'll agree
i think ppl have really forgotten the real meaning of Islam. GUYS Islam is so pure and beautiful. Allah (swt) has made it as simple as he can, yet we still cannot even do the basics? that's just sad. What I mean to say is stop arguing over these petty issues, focus on urknowledge of Islam and the way u practice it. leave the technicalities for ppl to deal with themselves, stop trying to dictate to ppl how to live their lives. All u can do is better urself first, then spread the word of Islam.
Re: Top 10 excuses by women who don’t wear the Hijab
The collector is pretty important in this.
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This one was classified as authentic:
Narrated Umm Salamah, Ummul Mu'minin: When the verse "That they should cast their outer garments over their persons" was revealed, the women of Ansar came out as if they had crows over their heads by wearing outer garments
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This is Sahih according to the Mu'hadith. Where does it say about covering the hair only? Head is not hair - this would be support for Niqab perhaps. But if it is so important than why are elderly women allowed to discard it?
Such elderly women as are past the prospect of marriage,- there is no blame on them if they lay aside their (outer) garments, provided they make not a wanton display of their beauty: but it is best for them to be modest: and Allah is One Who sees and knows all things. 24:60
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It certainly is a valid tradition to cover the head...and has been since we started to Westernize. If anything, it's Fard due to our obligation not to immitate Kufar.
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So don't imitate the Kuffar in the way you act. Why work since that could also be imitating the Kuffar? Why drive a car and not ride a camel as you're again imitating the Kuffar? Actions speak louder than anything else.
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Do it, or don't....I'm not the type to beat anyone over the head...but just food for thought...why is this an issue? What compels us from abandoning this tradition? That's all...
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The tradition had a time and a place. Don't you think that there were reasons for wearing a Niqab or a Hijab in the 7th century? And do you think the same environment exists in the UK today as in 7th century Arabia?
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Oh, I'm guilty too...I dress in complete Western gear...I'm struggling with the same question.
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Re: Top 10 excuses by women who don’t wear the Hijab
i think ppl have really forgotten the real meaning of Islam. GUYS Islam is so pure and beautiful. Allah (swt) has made it as simple as he can, yet we still cannot even do the basics? that's just sad. What I mean to say is stop arguing over these petty issues, focus on urknowledge of Islam and the way u practice it. leave the technicalities for ppl to deal with themselves, stop trying to dictate to ppl how to live their lives. All u can do is better urself first, then spread the word of Islam.
I agree to all you say except the underlined portion.
Re: Top 10 excuses by women who don’t wear the Hijab
Wow, I am just amazed at the fact that such incorrect information is coming from amongst the Muslims, SubhanAllah. I would suggest that you read the Quran carefully.
Firstly, our source for Islam is the Quran, Sunnah, Sahaba, Scholars. We cannot just decide for ourselves what is or isn't Islam.
This is clearly stated in the Quran, and it was understood by the Sahaba that the commands of the Prophet salAllahualaihiwasallam must be followed (they are not optional). This is apparent in Surah Najm Ayaat 3 and 4, that he does not speak of his desires and even his speech is Wahee. And Surah Nur Ayah 56 and in many other places, we are told to obey the Messenger. When the Prophet commands something then we have to obey unconditionally because this is what it says in the Quran. Sunnah by definition is something optional that the Prophet used to do regularly. The only school of fiqh which I know of that differentiates between nafil and sunnah is Hanafi, the others consider sunnah and nafil to be the same.
And please do not prioritize the obligatory actions, the Fard. All of the obligatory stuff has to be done and leaving any of it is a sin. If you want to still prioritize Islam for yourself then at least do not propagate this view.
So prayer, zakaat, siyaam, and even practising hijab (whatever your understanding of hijab is), etc. is all fard, and leaving any of it is a sin.
Also, Islam is Perfect as it says in Surah Maidah. If Islam requires changes to be made to make it "up to date", then this contradicts the definition of perfect.
The other thing is that Islam is not simple and easy. Surah Ankabut, Ayah 2 says do people think that they will be left alone because they say "we believe" and will not be tested?
All of the true believers, the mu'mineen went through harsh tests. This is evident from the stories in Quran and in the Ahadith.
Re: Top 10 excuses by women who don’t wear the Hijab
The practise of Hijab was not something cultural.
This is evident from so many Ahadith, in particular in the story of Ifk Ayesha radiAllahuanha says that the Sahabi was able to recognize her because he had seen her before the Ayaat of Hijab were revealed.
Also, the women used to conceal themselves as well. Again from the story of Ifk, we know that Ayesha radiAllahuanha used to travel in a Haudaj. http://www.usc.edu/dept/MSA/fundamentals/hadithsunnah/bukhari/059.sbt.html#005.059.462
Re: Top 10 excuses by women who don’t wear the Hijab
Islam has no clergy "Sher"
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This is clearly stated in the Quran, and it was understood by the Sahaba that the commands of the Prophet salAllahualaihiwasallam must be followed (they are not optional). This is apparent in Surah Najm Ayaat 3 and 4, that he does not speak of his desires and even his speech is Wahee. And Surah Nur Ayah 56 and in many other places, we are told to obey the Messenger. When the Prophet commands something then we have to obey unconditionally because this is what it says in the Quran. Sunnah by definition is something optional that the Prophet used to do regularly. The only school of fiqh which I know of that differentiates between nafil and sunnah is Hanafi, the others consider sunnah and nafil to be the same.
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We've asked where it was commanded. So far nothing. One hadith that has different interpretations, but nothing from the Qu'ran or from Hadith that's without doubt. Unless you know more, "Sher".
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And please do not prioritize the obligatory actions, the Fard. All of the obligatory stuff has to be done and leaving any of it is a sin. If you want to still prioritize Islam for yourself then at least do not propagate this view.
So prayer, zakaat, siyaam, and even practising hijab (whatever your understanding of hijab is), etc. is all fard, and leaving any of it is a sin.
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Then prove it's Fard.
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Also, Islam is Perfect as it says in Surah Maidah. If Islam requires changes to be made to make it "up to date", then this contradicts the definition of perfect.
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This is ridiculous. You should learn some Islam before opening your mouth.
"He who introduced some good practice in Islam which was followed after him he would be assured of reward like one who followed it, without their rewards being diminished in any respect."
*Sahih Muslim, Book 034, Number 6466 *
Re: Top 10 excuses by women who don’t wear the Hijab
Its funny how the guy who started the post hasnt contributed to the debate.
On the off chance that he is still keeping up to date with this thread, would he mind pointing us in the direction of the "research" that was apparently carried out on this topic.
Further more i would like to make a few comments on the individual points raised:
At which "college.uni" (sic) do i find "dirty dancing", and what does this involve.
Where can i find a job where the boring office party takes place in "the pub and nightclubs" instead of AT THE OFFICE.
I wish that instead of weddings taking place at the local muslim centre i get to attend one of these magical events "where all the women dress in sarees and other revealing clothes and at our weddings we have a DJ playing bhangra music and we all dance to bollywood tunes, even my grandmother does a few funky moves on the dance floor."
"I’m checking out 3 guys at the moment. Ones my age, ones older and one is older and married. I guess we all need a toy boy as well as a father figure /sugar daddy. I’ll choose one of them, although I’ve got a few my age from uni as back up."
Who said women are hard to please!
Seriously, what part of the world is this where the man to woman ratio is so bad that 3 GUYS HAVE TO SHARE ONE GIRL! Not to mention backups waiting in the wings.
Re: Top 10 excuses by women who don’t wear the Hijab
We've asked where it was commanded. So far nothing. One hadith that has different interpretations, but nothing from the Qu'ran or from Hadith that's without doubt. Unless you know more, "Sher".
Then prove it's Fard.
This is ridiculous. You should learn some Islam before opening your mouth.
"He who introduced some good practice in Islam which was followed after him he would be assured of reward like one who followed it, without their rewards being diminished in any respect."
*Sahih Muslim, Book 034, Number 6466 *
I am guessing that you are implying that there is no need for scholars.
The Quran tells us to refer to scholars if we don't know. The Quran also tells the Prophet to recite the verses and teach the Book. There were many incidents in Ahadith when the Sahaba did not understand a verse and went to the Prophet for clarification, even though they spoke the language.
Similarly there are other incidents where the people went to the Sahaba for clarification of certain issues.
The Hijab part is commanded in the Quran that's why it is fard, and I did say whatever your understanding of Hijab is, maybe you missed that part.
And the hadith you've mentioned does not refer to changing Islam, it says to bring something good. Islam cannot be changed without authority from Allah, and the last person to have that authority was Muhammad salAllahualaihiwasallam.
Bringing something good in Islam, the most popular example of this is the use of loudspeakers in the masjid. This is not changing the religion in anyway, and obviously it helps bring more people to the masjid.
Re: Top 10 excuses by women who don’t wear the Hijab
Where did I say there's no need for scholars. Scholars have memorized the Qu'ran and done the science of Hadiths. What I'm saying is that after this, quoting some modern day scholar from sect X, does not mean everyone should follow them blindy. It is mentioned in the Qu'ran not to follow the scholars blindly, if you didnt know.
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The Hijab part is commanded in the Quran that's why it is fard, and I did say whatever your understanding of Hijab is, maybe you missed that part.
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Then show the verse where it is commanded. Hijab is Hijab. In the modern sense this is what covers the hair.
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And the hadith you've mentioned does not refer to changing Islam, it says to bring something good. Islam cannot be changed without authority from Allah, and the last person to have that authority was Muhammad salAllahualaihiwasallam.
Bringing something good in Islam, the most popular example of this is the use of loudspeakers in the masjid. This is not changing the religion in anyway, and obviously it helps bring more people to the masjid.
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"Bringing good practice into Islam". This means that Islam evolves with time. It is not static like you seem to think in the 7th century. In fact it would be unislamic to reject better practises that have come into Islam since the 7th century.
You know what practice means? It is how you perform or practice a religion. So alternative forms of prayer for example might be a chnage of practice in Islam. Doing more Rakah perhaps. Fitting better into society might be good practice in Islam. This is different from the Fard things, that can surely never be changed, like for example, eating pork. So show why wearing Hijab is Fard, and then you might have a point.
Re: Top 10 excuses by women who don’t wear the Hijab
And which scholar from sect X did I quote which prompted you to say that Islam has no clergy?
I know the word Hijab is not used in those particular Ayaat. Those Ayaat are referred to as the Hijab ayaat, if you want to call them by a different name then go ahead.
So, first you are saying that don't blindly follow a scholar and now you are saying not to reject better practises that have come into Islam.
The only one who defines good and bad is Allah. Even though something looks good may turn out to be bad and vice versa, Surah Baqarah Ayah 216. Only Allah knows these things and we don't.
Secondly, if something needs to be added to Islam then Islam is incomplete which is a contradiction of the Quran.
Thirdly, The Ahadith about innovation in the religion are clear.
And there's another hadith that with every innovation a sunnah is erased.
Re: Top 10 excuses by women who don’t wear the Hijab
I hope that you actually read the story. This is the evidence that women were recognizable before the Ayaat of Hijab were revealed.
Ayesha radiAllahuanha states that the only reason the Sahabi knew her was because he had seen her before the Ayaat of Hijab. This was one of the issues brought up by the munafiqeen, that since the Sahabi knew that she was Ayesha then they must have (Aouzobillah) committed zina.
So, the Hijab Ayaat were only for the Prophet's wives?
Then where would the rulings for women come from?
To my understanding the Ahadith related to women's rulings are narrated from the wives of the Prophet radiAllahuanhunna.
You can make that argument for everything, that the Prophet said everything to his wife and therefore it doesn't apply to all women.
It's Khamr, and your point is?
Actually, I don't speak arabic so I am not a reliable source for these type of arabic related issues.
Re: Top 10 excuses by women who don’t wear the Hijab
These are your words
"Firstly, our source for Islam is the Quran, Sunnah, Sahaba, Scholars. We cannot just decide for ourselves what is or isn't Islam."
We cannot decide what is or is not Islam is what you said. I'm saying Islam has no clergy. There is no central pope like figure in Islam whose word is final on what are the boundaries of religion.
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I know the word Hijab is not used in those particular Ayaat. Those Ayaat are referred to as the Hijab ayaat, if you want to call them by a different name then go ahead.
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There is nothing in also in those Ayats about covering the hair, unless you can prove differently.
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So, first you are saying that don't blindly follow a scholar and now you are saying not to reject better practises that have come into Islam.
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Yes. Exactly what is so difficult to understand about this? They do not contradict one another.
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The only one who defines good and bad is Allah. Even though something looks good may turn out to be bad and vice versa, Surah Baqarah Ayah 216. Only Allah knows these things and we don't.
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Exactly how does this contradict the Hadith that I mentioned? The Hadith talks about rewards given to those who introduce good practise in Islam. What do you think these rewards are? They are not money or rewards on earth. It is referring to rewards being given by God. You really do not understand Islam in the slightest.
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Secondly, if something needs to be added to Islam then Islam is incomplete which is a contradiction of the Quran.
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No it is not incomplete. But it is flexible, and not rigid like you seem to believe. And picking and selecting what is Fard is also not a good thing to do, without showing solid proof.
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Thirdly, The Ahadith about innovation in the religion are clear.
And there's another hadith that with every innovation a sunnah is erased.
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I quoted the Sahih Hadith that says good practices in Islam will be rewarded. You have quoted nothing.
Re: Top 10 excuses by women who don’t wear the Hijab
No one is able to provide full proof of some document that says something like "Covering your hair with cloth is absolutely mandatory, and if you don't do it, your punishment will be blah blah blah".
People are just conjecturing and making assumptions without knowing all the facts.
I don't think God is stupid. If God really wanted this to be mandatory, he would have made it highly clear in the Quran, like he has for everything else. There would be no ambiguity. And the ambiguity that does exist probably does so for a very good reason. Don't you think God realized there would be time periods and places in history where a hijab just wouldn't be needed for a woman's protection?
Hijab, for me, is a situational thing. If I'm in a butchering market in the heart of karachi's slums (been thru one, gotta say it wasn't a great experience), I will cover my head. In fact, I would walk thru it in a burqa. But put me out in my natural environment in the USA, and I wouldn't feel the need for anything like that. Modesty, sure. But there's a line that each person draws for themselves.
Just like I see so many people saying in the beard thread that its not important to focus on these little matters, likewise, the hijab is a minor matter. Important to some, means nothing to others. So, lets leave it at that, instead of judging women by their exterior. I thought people were supposed to be judged by their beliefs and deeds.
Re: Top 10 excuses by women who don’t wear the Hijab
The only one whose word is final is Allah. Allah says follow the Messenger and the sholars. The Mesesnger tells us to follow the Sahaba and the scholars.
So I don’t understand what you are referring to as the “pope”?
Obviously if someone claiming to be a scholar is making rulings out of thin air, then he is not a scholar by definition.
You will not find everything in the Quran, that’s why the Messenger was told to teach the Book. Just because the Quran doesn’t say anything about men and silk, that doesn’t mean that a man can go around wearing silk because there is a hadith about it.
Maybe you are not looking at it properly. Someone introducting something new into the religion, will not have proof for it from the Quran and Sunnah. Since there is no clergy in Islam then the only reference we have is Quran and Sunnah. So one cannot introduct something into the religion.
I just want to make this clear that innovations in religion are not allowed, but innovations in something else like technology is perfectly fine.
This does not contradict the hadith. But the hadith does not mean introducing new things in religion, ie. innovations.
Islam is not flexible at all. The only thing which is slightly flexible is certain rulings in fiqh.
You need to think about this a little bit, if any sort of flexibility was allowed then why did Muhammad salAllahualaihiwasallam migrate to Medina? He could have easily accepted one of the many offers of Quraish, and ended all the torture and bloodshed.
If there was flexibility then Abu Bakr would have accepted the offer from the Zakah rejectors as per the advice of Umar and other Sahaba.
Re: Top 10 excuses by women who don’t wear the Hijab
I dont have time for this. You’re obviously some backward fool who wont see reason. So I’ll answer this and do the rest at leisure.
It is written in the Qu’ran that
“We have revealed to you this book to provide explanations for everything, and guidance, and mercy, and good news for the submitters.” 16- 89
It is also written that the scholars will stray more and more from the truth as time goes on.
The authority of in Christianity is the Pope. Islam does not have such central figures that the followers of must follow. You are supposed to listen to the scholars, seek their advice, and then question them, rather than blindly follow them like you. This is all written in the Qu’ran and Hadith.
The Qu’ran is the first source of reference for Muslims, the Hadith is the second source. Any Hadith that contradicts the Qu’ran should be ignored. If there is a Sahih Hadith that mentions something in the Qu’ran then this would be Sunnah, but if it was meant to be Fard, then it would have been mentioned in the Qu’ran as the Qu’ran has everything we need to know.
Can you not read? Why do you deny Sahih Hadith and make up things that Hijab is Fard? I bet you act so pious too. WHERE does it say that innovations in religion is not allowed in that Hadith. It says, and I’ll quote it again,
“He who introduced some good practice in Islam which was followed after him he would be assured of reward like one who followed it, without their rewards being diminished in any respect.”
*Sahih Muslim, Book 034, Number 6466 *
Good practice in religion means good ways of performing (practicing) religion. This is innovation in religion. Why do you deny it says this? Does it not suit your beliefs, so you reject Sahih Hadith which are not appropriate for you?
Look up the definition of “practice”
Islam is very flexible. There are some things clearly forbidden, many things are down to interpretation. Fiqh is basically the Sharia and there are many interpretations of this.
What does this have to do with how you interpret the Shariah? War is war, you dont go wasy on your enemies.
Your first Hadith says this. Pay attention to the underlined part. This suggests some innovation can be good. There is no contradiction between this Hadith and the one I quoted from above.
"*Volume 3, Book 49, Number 861: *
*Narrated Aisha: **Allah’s Apostle said, “If somebody innovates something which is not in harmony with the principles of our religion, that thing is rejected.” *
Re: Top 10 excuses by women who don’t wear the Hijab
It's clear there are different views and opinions.
There are some who follow the Quran and don't take ahadith into account. Therefore, their views are different.
There are some who follow Quran and sahih ahadith. Again, they have different views.
There are some who follow Quran and selected ahadith. Again, they have different views.
Given that we all follow different interpretations. I don't think it would be all that bad if we sort of present our views and take others' and leave it at that. I don't think most of us here have what it takes to change the views and beliefs of others.
We always end up arguing over the same issues, while completely being aware of the fact that it will not achieve us much. It seems like a serious waste of time and energy.
Re: Top 10 excuses by women who don’t wear the Hijab
No, not really...my thoughts on this are a bit more left-field.
It's more along the lines that covering the head is an established tradition that has been continuously practiced since the advent of Islam.
Fast forward to the future, and all of a sudden it's an issue. Even within Muslim countries...in fact, perhaps within Muslim countries is where Hijab wearing women face most of their difficulties.
Why all of a sudden? Is it too much to suggest that if a headcovering was as much a part of modern Western culture (as it was in Victorian culture), that nobody here would be having this discussion?
Re: Top 10 excuses by women who don’t wear the Hijab
Decent 6Chora- just thought i'd clarify something. When women are menustrating (or '...in specific days..' as you put it) they do not have to offer Qaza salah. They do however have to make up missed fasts, etc...
Re: Top 10 excuses by women who don’t wear the Hijab
It is written in the Qu'ran that
"We have revealed to you this book to provide explanations for everything, and guidance, and mercy, and good news for the submitters." 16- 89
It is also written that the scholars will stray more and more from the truth as time goes on.
The authority of in Christianity is the Pope. Islam does not have such central figures that the followers of must follow. You are supposed to listen to the scholars, seek their advice, and then question them, rather than blindly follow them like you. This is all written in the Qu'ran and Hadith.
So who exactly did I say is the "pope" in Islam? I've been saying that there is no one who has any authority like that today. The last man to have that authority was the Prophet.
A Hadith cannot contradict the Quran, if it does then it's fabricated hence it's not a hadith. Ahkam are a very small part of the Quran. The Quran is mainly stories and description of Paradise and Hell and about Allah. Quran cannot be understood without Hadith.
For example, Zakat ul Fitr is not mentioned in the Quran so is that Sunnah (optional)?
Where are you getting your definition of Fard and Sunnah from?
The Quran says to cut the hand of a thief, but we know from a hadith this punishment is not carried out during a famine. And Umar radiAllahuanhu applied this during his caliphate, it's a popular story. So what happens, is this just a Sunnah then, actually this is going against the Quran so according to what you have said this hadith must be fabricated. What I want to know is how are you going to explain this?
The only explanation is that the Prophet was given the authority to declare halaal and haraam, and when he did a mistake he was corrected by Allah and all of this is in the Quran. Surah Tahrim, and Surah Abasa are examples of this.
"He who introduced some good practice in Islam which was followed after him he would be assured of reward like one who followed it, without their rewards being diminished in any respect."
*Sahih Muslim, Book 034, Number 6466 *
Good practice in religion means good ways of performing (practicing) religion. This is innovation in religion. Why do you deny it says this? Does it not suit your beliefs, so you reject Sahih Hadith which are not appropriate for you?
Look up the definition of "practice"
Islam is very flexible. There are some things clearly forbidden, many things are down to interpretation. Fiqh is basically the Sharia and there are many interpretations of this.
What does this have to do with how you interpret the Shariah? War is war, you dont go wasy on your enemies.
Let me sum it up again. Using cars, electricity, or loudspeakers has nothing to do with the religion itself. So using these types of things to improve our practise of religion is something good.
But to add, subtract or change something in religion is not allowed. This is what the christians and jews did as Allah said in Surah Tauba Ayah 31, and they strayed.
The point is that the message is complete.
Allah says in Surah 6 Ayah 38 that he didn't leave out anything in this Book. If any sort of change is required then this goes against the Quran.
When Abu Bakr was told by Umar to compile the Quran, he hesitated because he thought that this was an innovation and his reasoning was that if the Prophet didn't do it then we don't need to do it. Obviously he eventually realized that it did need to be compiled and that it wasn't an innovation.
"*Volume 3, Book 49, Number 861: *
*Narrated Aisha: **Allah's Apostle said, "If somebody innovates something which is not in harmony with the principles of our religion, that thing is rejected." *
I certainly hope you read the rest of those Ahadith.