I hope they sit out Shoaib and Younis out for Sunday match. They should give chance to Asad. Younis failed twice he shoud sit out next match otheriwsie he will never learn.
[QUOTE]
*Originally posted by Faisal: *
I am not a statistics person, as frankly speaking, statistics hide as much as they tell you. But after reading this thread, I did go and check out Younis Khan's ODI career statistics. And, honestly, I am disappointed.
Now, don't get me wrong. ODI cricket has some unique dynamics. For example a late order batsman, however talented, can not really score big runs. Can have a good S/R, but low average. But for a batsman who came in early in the innings (#3 or 4) for a long time, and knowing that our unstable opening partnerships means, for the most part that #3 is practically an opener, to have never crossed the magical 3 figure score in 81 innings, may not be a big deal for a mediocre player. However, Younis is not claimed to be a mediocre player. He is supposed to be better than good.
ONE-DAY INTERNATIONALS
(including 20/06/2003)
M I NO Runs HS Ave SR 100 50 Ct St
Batting & Fielding 85 81 12 2185 90 31.66 70.87 0 17 41 0
This is not an indictment, merely a point that he should pick up his game a few notches, from where he is. Failing in one or two or a few matches here and there is not really a big deal. However, one must be capable of playing big innings. Getting 40's and 50's is not good enough for a player who is the back bone of our batting line-up. He should aim for 80's, 90's and 100+ as much as possible. He does have 17 50's though. That he failed to convert any of them into a 100 is surprising, and a little disappointing.
[/QUOTE]
Younis Khan is alot better player than his avg reveals as you mentioned, stats hide more then they reveal.
Yes he has not scored many one day tons, but how many batsmen in world cricket who come in at number 5 go on to score centuries, look at some of the big names.
Micheal Bevan who has played so much more innings then Khan has had 2 or 3 tons. Tendulkar didn't score his first century till his 70th game, because he was also at 4 or 5.
The main point is, Younis Khan is one of the very few batsmen in Pakistani cricket team who can play good bowlers without fear and its actually the only man in the team who doesn't foil under pressure specially when chasing.
About Imran Nazir being like Afridi, very wrong.
Both are very different styles of batsman and are talented in their own way.
Nazir likes to play stylish cover drive shots while Afridi likes to play up in the air deep wicket pre meditaded shots.
Though I think Javed Coaching + Afridi = Very good batsman, but since his recent performance Afridi won't be coming back.
If Afridi is under good hands, then he can be devasting, I wish I had some stats to prove Afridi's performance under Miandad, but Cricinfo Statsguru doesn't provide such options.
Anyways coming down to the main point, Nazir has defintly improved from before, and Sambi yourself said that you didn't see today's match so you can just call for him being dropped by just looking at the scorecard.
^^ agreed with Umair about Imran and Shahid:k:
Considering the fact that Younis Khan is a middle order batsman, having played over 80 ODI has yet to make century is something that makes you wonder.
Younis Khan is the Pakistan middle order meaning he can not complain about the lack of opportunities or the lack of overs. Over the years the Pakistani batting line has flopped so very often, giving even the lower order batsmen plenty of overs.
So with so many batting collapses (opportunities to get a big scores..) if still Younis Khan has yet to make a century, what does it say?
I think he is short of “world” class and probably not as talented…
He is just average when you compare him with the world and not just Paksitan players.
Unless he improves...His position is open and for the taking. PCB should be looking for a replacement.
i think shoaib did what he was told to, the total was too small to defend and pak went out with no plan, they were too agressive and that cost them the game!
i think shoaib n sami were told to try n bowl out the opposition with sheer pace
I have to agree with Bilal on Shoaib and Sami. Obviously realizing the total was too small to defend they simply attempted to cause a collapse in the English order with pace. I think that despite Shoaib's big mouth we should hesitate before calling for him to be removed from the team. In all fairness he has bowled decently since the World Cup and his speed is still quite an asset for our team to have.
I would disagree with you on Imran Nazir only because he also has played well up till this last match, although I must say that for an opener to get out on 1 ball is extremely discouraging and cannot be tolerated for long. I think if he continues to fail, I would tend to favour giving Imran Farhat a chance. I think his left hand bat would help the line-up
Finally, I must say that I have lost a lot of faith in Yunis Khan. At first it seemed that he was a batsman of great potential but he has consistently failed to produce runs for us. In order to stabilize the middle of the order we should consider bringing back Inzi or perhaps allowing another player such as Misbah a chance. But of course in this case Misbah's age works against him because he, like Inzi, is an older player.
Its a just bad day with these people..nothing more..
Dont think taht we have to win all these matches..
I think unless a miracle happens Afridi is not coming back to the team. He was always included as a batsman who can bowl if needed. Basically it was his ability to bowl that use to get him in the side as his inlucsion as just a batsman could never be justified. He along with Razzaq were the only two all rounders in the team. Now with the inclusion of Shoiab Malik, Mohmmad Hafeez plus recall of Azhar Mehmood (Razzaq's still there) it would be very difficult for Afridi to make a comeback. He has the talent, to be a very good allrounder. He pushes through his overs very quickly, not a big spinner of the ball but if he maintains his line and length he could be very useful. Someone like him could also be used to quick runs in the lower order.
sambrialian
shoaib has to go.. well that's what u say.. i remember back in 1985 in a match (i saw the video of that match!) against NZ.. he took 10 wickets.. he was lightning fast back then.. fans enjoyed it.. fans wanted someone like him in Pakistani side.. y? not coz he used to swing alot... but the reason was WE needed someone with that pace to kill the batsman.. and nevertheless he did get his beating from the batsman once in a while.. before he switched to medium paced bowling.
Shoaib, is a classic example or what i call "One-day Cricket Fever".. its common now-a-days .. a batsman is recognized for his quick 50's and a bowler for his quick 3 wicket hauls! no one really cares of the over all techniques.. sometimes, even if you the god of bowlers you get the worst smacking on ur bowling ever! but that does't mean you suck! its just that you lacked something or the pitch wasn't just for ur bowling (i have experience in this) ..
Imran, a admire this guy... he has imporved himself... he is agreesive like Aamir Sohail used to be.. and the only thing he lacks is experience .. remember when he used to play along Saeed he was making runs.. that's coz the other end had the "experience" to tell him what he is doing wrong.. rather then just shouting at him when he plays a good stroke!
Younis Khan, a very classy unothrodox batsman.. love his way of batting .. the cool and calm face of his makes bowlers think even harder .. he loves his game, tries new shots and yes hasn't make a 100 yet but still remember he plays at number 5 ... so kinda limited in making big tons like upper order batsman..
Summary:
Array apni team is the best.. they win they lose.. its all part of the game... smile and make them smile coz they are the stars of our eyes.. i can assure you, next match if any one of these mentioned players make a boom they will be known as the Guns of Pakistan.. i will always admire them... they are my true ideals.. along with 30 more former Pakistani players.. :D
selection
i think sambi u are right about imran nazir, i really think saleem elahi shud be playin instead of him, and then if shoaib performs like the way he did, he shud get a kick as well just like others and one thing i wudn't agree wid is younis khan, hes been playin down the order so often and was always required to hit hard in the end or they put too much pressure on him, but i think him and shoaib malik are the only 2 players in our team who can pay under pressure, and yeah i think it was very stupid to make youhana vc because u need a bit more than just bein a betta player, i think younis is the right man for the job, i hope he starts performing soon :), and about his scoring hundereds i think imran khan only had one hundered to his name, but look at how consistent he is plus if he comes one or 2 down which i think he shud be then he might start gettin hundereds as well
Re: selection
[QUOTE]
*Originally posted by khumin: *
i think sambi u are right about imran nazir, i really think saleem elahi shud be playin instead of him
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Thats great... so along with Mohammaf Hafeez we get another openar who play slow and our scoring rate will suck.. that will put the middle order under a lot of pressure.
[QUOTE]
*Originally posted by khumin: *
i think younis is the right man for the job, i hope he starts performing soon :), and about his scoring hundereds i think imran khan only had one hundered to his name, but look at how consistent he is plus if he comes one or 2 down which i think he shud be then he might start gettin hundereds as well
[/QUOTE]
First of all Imran Khan was an allroundr who was primarily a bowler so a comparison betwen him and Younis Khan does not make any sense at all as Younis Khan is a regualr batsman. Though I agree that Younis is a good player and hopefully in future he will not only perform better but also get a few tons along the way.
Screw everyone who think and say bad about Shoaib...
just honestly think what he said about Waqar & Wasim..in a way he is right...No doubt Waqar and Wasim were the greatest Ws..but recently they were fluff...esp Waqar...Waqar had no place in team w/ Sami sitting on bench.. and Wasim Akram..well he is a legend..he can make place in any team..but age and his health was catching up...he was only playing limited matches.....What Shoaib said was about recent matches
As far his other comments are concerned..well no doubt he has big mouth....but so does Shane Warne..No one can deny how destructive these two bowlers are..
I saw him playing in Sirilanka...this guy has immense talent...he can even bat..unlike MIGHTY WAQAR..AQIB JAVED, AFRIDI..etc..long list..
Shoaib is not God!...just a human w/ all human flaws....before thrashing him all the time just remember how many times u guys have screwed up in your life...that is how u learn...
Shoaib has only few years left in him....atleast let him play
Younis Khan is not world class yet. But i think he will be. He hasn't even played 100match's yet and you guys want him to put up centuries every time he comes up. Give him some time. Once Younis Khan starts converting half centuries into centuries and Imran Nazir starts converting 30's into 50's we will be a better team. But for that to happen these players need stability.
Re: Re: selection
[QUOTE]
*Originally posted by LahoriMunda: *
Thats great... so along with Mohammaf Hafeez we get another openar who play slow and our scoring rate will suck.. that will put the middle order under a lot of pressure.
[/QUOTE]
Thank you for mentioning that. I think that most Pak supporters are afraid of the slow motion tactics of Hafeez and Taufeeq. So they're being a bit more accomodating to Imran Nazir than they normally would be 'cause they don't want Taufeeq to partner Hafeez and slow the scoring rate to a crawl.
[QUOTE]
*Originally posted by Jerablade: *
As far his other comments are concerned..well no doubt he has big mouth....but so does Shane Warne..No one can deny how destructive these two bowlers are..
[/QUOTE]
Dude you really need to get you cricketing sense checked. First of all Shoiab's mouth is way much bigger then Warne, secondly what a patheticaly chilidish comparison. You are comparing Shoiab Akhtar to someone who has alomost 500 test wickets!!!!! Shoiab is yet to prove if he can play one tournament without badmouthing someone (add his own team mates or ex team mates to that), or getting injured or getting banned.
[QUOTE]
*Originally posted by Jerablade: *
I saw him playing in Sirilanka...this guy has immense talent...he can even bat..unlike MIGHTY WAQAR..AQIB JAVED, AFRIDI..etc..long list..
[/QUOTE]
Well mighty Waqar has proved to be a match winner over the years. Again a comparison is stupid. Check out Waqar's record, his strike rate, the number of wickets. At his prime he was much more destructive than Shoiab. Afridi ofcourse can bat as much as Shoaib can and going by the present judgement of centuries Afridi was a better batsman than Shoaib as he does have a couple of centuries to his name.
The Game Responds:
You are a faithless whining moron, my friend. We had one bad day, and you go around running your mouth about how we need to drop everyone! Shut up, relax, and have faith. People, That Is All.
ok wanna be cool kid lets go with your * game * plan next time and hopefully get better results. By the way no one said anything about dropping everyone, the discussion was to see who is the * weakeast link * and what should be done about it.
I agree, He’s comparing Shoiab, who has a batting average of 13 against Afridi who has a batting average of 24 with 3 centuries and 22 fifties and 3387 runs 
Very well said Jerablade and game.
[QUOTE]
*Originally posted by LahoriMunda: *
Dude you really need to get you cricketing sense checked. First of all Shoiab's mouth is way much bigger then Warne, secondly what a patheticaly chilidish comparison. You are comparing Shoiab Akhtar to someone who has alomost 500 test wickets!!!!! Shoiab is yet to prove if he can play one tournament without badmouthing someone (add his own team mates or ex team mates to that), or getting injured or getting banned.
[/quote]
No disrespect, but I think you need to go reread the article before making false judgements, he said the 2 Ws' performance declined for the past couple years, specially around the time Shoaib started playing, nobody can't deny the fact.
And he never disrespected 2 Ws, so many people in this form have also said that many times but no one is disrespecting the 2 Ws.
Yaar, the reason warne has 500 wickets then Shoaib because he has played almost 3 times more cricket then Shoaib, if you look at Shoaib's wicket taking rate, if he were to play 100 matches, he can take alot more but thats different comparision, you can't compare a leg spinner with fast bowler
[quote]
Well mighty Waqar has proved to be a match winner over the years. Again a comparison is stupid. Check out Waqar's record, his strike rate, the number of wickets. At his prime he was much more destructive than Shoiab. Afridi ofcourse can bat as much as Shoaib can and going by the present judgement of centuries Afridi was a better batsman than Shoaib as he does have a couple of centuries to his name.
[/QUOTE]
Please go back and read the article again. No one is denying Waqar's greatness, Shoaib was talking about in recent years, not his whole career.
Plus why are we comparing Shoaib with Afridi. Affers is an allrounder while Shoaib is a handy batting option down the order.
Afridi is way superior to Shoaib as far as agressive batting is concerned.