*she had so many children, she didn’t know what to do.
She gave them some **broth without any bread; Then whipped them all soundly and put them to bed.
I believe that children are truly Allah’s blessing and that every child brings with him/her their own rizq. But despite that belief, is it irresponsible for parents to plan for and to bring a child into this world that they cannot provide for?
Take for example Octomom or the family with 18/19 children, it seems as if their motivation for having children was fame rather than parenthood (yes, this is an assumption on my part). But is this irresponsible parenthood? And how many children is “too many”?
I'll have dozen but can't bother to go through pregnancy and labour again.
I think we always ignore this issue whenever we discuss this topic. I wanted to say the same. Ladies have so much to do nowadays. I mean we dont live in days where you used to grow your own vegetables and had your own goats. In a normal household, ladies take care of all the domestic chores including grocery, taking kids for doctors appointment, going to Parent/teacher meetings, cooking, cleaning - and everything is more involved than it was 25 years ago. Burdening them with pregnancy after pregnancy is not just going to be too much on them but lower the quality of the whole household.
. I mean we dont live in days where you used to grow your own vegetables and had your own goats..
Not to say that modern day ladies have lot of time to take care of half or one dozen kids but this would require more time , No ? They used to do all household chores too. They did not have machines to help them with any household chores either.
Not to say that modern day ladies have lot of time to take care of half or one dozen kids but this would require more time , No ? They used to do all household chores too. They did not have machines to help them with any household chores either.
I agree, but that is why I said that everything is more involved than it was 25 years ago. Plus there are more things to take care of. It used to be cooked food, clean house and washed laundry. Its no more like that. People used to trust their neighbors and/or have a joint family system - so there were always more adults around for kids. Its not the case anymore. Hawkers used to come to your doorstep. That is not the case anymore in most of the world.
Doesn't necessarily have to be plural. Even just one child can be "too many" if you do not have have the financial means or the maturity or even the desire to support it.
We think the world is a one add one equals two place ... it is not! What is real or impractical for one is not for another ... I truly believe that if a person has been blessed with 10 children then Allah (SWT) has also given that person the means to give them a good upbringing, but when they "choose" not to ... we quickly blame things like "time" and "money" as the cause of that ... tarbiyyah is such a thing that it takes no money to divulge it and it self-propagates i.e. a well behaved child will make a good role model as a sibling. Tawfiq comes in many ways ... fertility, endurance to bear, the actual conception, and so on ...
This world is a world of deception - we are so used to cause and effect - we don't realise what power things like barakah, rahma, taqdeer, tawfiq, du'a have ...
Also keep in mind that the very low infant mortality rate is a very recent phenomenon. Back in the day people had lot of kids because only a few of them would survive to adulthood.
Being able to choose to have just one kid, and being (relatively) certain that he/she will survive is sort of a luxury.
This is a very tough question because in some first world countries people are not having enough kids, while the third world is overpopulated. I was reading an article on Bill Gates' work with vaccines and he found that people have lots of kids partly because of the uncertainty of their survival, as opposed to the common hypothesis that people in the third world have lots of kids solely because of a lack of sex education.
I've even heard of some couple have their tubes tied/vasectomies because they consider it environmentally unfriendly to have children.
I come from a family where the generation before me had 11 and 13 kids. Out of the 11 kids only 4 survived but 1 died in childbirth and only 3 made it to their 40th and above birthday. The other family where there were 13 kids, I have interacted personally with all of them and believe me having these many kids leads to a lot of insecurities and a lot of greed. The greed is mostly there because they were too many of them and not enough bread, butter, milk to go around. And the fights and greed even continues to this day plus all the kids have this thing among themselves where they can't get along with all their siblings. It is just sad.
I come from a generation where ppl had 4-6 kids usually and from what I have seen, the mothers were so busy with household work and the father was so busy trying to make ends meet, the kids were left to their own devices. No sit down talks, no going out every weekend. It wasn't that parents were providing material things and ignoring the emotional well being. Both were not available much.
Today's parents I feel are a lot lot more involved in their kids' lives, women these days look forward to being pregnant, they enjoy their pregnancies (as much as that condition can be enjoyed),they look forward to welcoming their kids, and fathers also actively take part in the lives of kids. Even those parents who can't provide a lot materially do try to give their kids time and take as much care as possible emotionally.
I have also come across a lot of ppl who say we should increase the ummah of Rasool Allah (Sallalahu alaie wassalam), I think this ummah needs quality more than quantity. Just churning out males and females is not the answer, we need to educate them islamically so they can be true muslims. I would rather see few strong muslim than a lot of weak imaned muslims.
Also keep in mind that the very low infant mortality rate is a very recent phenomenon. Back in the day people had lot of kids because only a few of them would survive to adulthood.
Being able to choose to have just one kid, and being (relatively) certain that he/she will survive is sort of a luxury.
This is a very tough question because in some first world countries people are not having enough kids, while the third world is overpopulated. I was reading an article on Bill Gates' work with vaccines and he found that people have lots of kids partly because of the uncertainty of their survival, as opposed to the common hypothesis that people in the third world have lots of kids solely because of a lack of sex education.
I've even heard of some couple have their tubes tied/vasectomies because they consider it environmentally unfriendly to have children.
Again we are making the assumption that people had many children BECAUSE there was high infant mortality ... this is not true ... Many of the people had no idea of what "infant mortality" was or represented and they definitely did not consciously work out a method to mitigate a risk of child loss ... they simply lived their lives and had children.
And then today modernity brings us technology which gives us a false sense of security that children will survive until that is they cross the road or get shot in the street ... The affairs of life are in His hands.
The people who do not want to have children out of fear of quality of life are going to lose out.
I come from a family where the generation before me had 11 and 13 kids. Out of the 11 kids only 4 survived but 1 died in childbirth and only 3 made it to their 40th and above birthday. The other family where there were 13 kids, I have interacted personally with all of them and** believe me having these many kids leads to a lot of insecurities and a lot of greed*. **The greed is mostly there because they were too many of them and not enough bread, butter, milk to go around. And the fights and greed even continues to this day plus all the kids have this thing among themselves where they can't get along with all their siblings. It is just sad.*
I come from a generation where ppl had 4-6 kids usually and from what I have seen, the mothers were so busy with household work and the father was so busy trying to make ends meet, the kids were left to their own devices. No sit down talks, no going out every weekend. It wasn't that parents were providing material things and ignoring the emotional well being. Both were not available much.
Today's parents I feel are a lot lot more involved in their kids' lives, women these days look forward to being pregnant, they enjoy their pregnancies (as much as that condition can be enjoyed),they look forward to welcoming their kids, and fathers also actively take part in the lives of kids. Even those parents who can't provide a lot materially do try to give their kids time and take as much care as possible emotionally.
I have also come across a lot of ppl who say we should increase the ummah of Rasool Allah (Sallalahu alaie wassalam), I think this ummah needs quality more than quantity. Just churning out males and females is not the answer, we need to educate them islamically so they can be true muslims. I would rather see few strong muslim than a lot of weak imaned muslims.
Just my two cents.
There we go again ... here the bad character trait of "greed" is linked with number of children ... "greed" is a trait that is linked with the way a person is raised. People in our past have proven to us how even with hunger we can be charitable and avoid greed ... we just want to blame something that has nothing to do with the actual problem. I've seen many single child families - the children are spoilt and hence become greedy and they can't interact with others properly. Ultimately only 4 children survived which is not a large family at all and still there was greed ...
And in households where there are many children then the parents must delegate work - to attempt taking on everyone together is a fault in their nurturing process and will lead to problems in their effectiveness.
Adding to this, I know of families with a large number of children. Growing up in such families, the elder siblings become so much more mature and responsible mashallah. They learn to be compassionate and empathetic towards the people around them. All children learn to share and share freely. They are never at a loss for company.
There are two sides to every coin. There is so much goodness that can be learned from these situations also. It is all about the handling.
There we go again ... here the bad character trait of "greed" is linked with number of children ... "greed" is a trait that is linked with the way a person is raised. People in our past have proven to us how even with hunger we can be charitable and avoid greed ... we just want to blame something that has nothing to do with the actual problem. I've seen many single child families - the children are spoilt and hence become greedy and they can't interact with others properly. Ultimately only 4 children survived which is not a large family at all and still there was greed ...
And in households where there are many children then the parents must delegate work - to attempt taking on everyone together is a fault in their nurturing process and will lead to problems in their effectiveness.
i'd like to point out that our grandmothers n mothers were more healthier than us..even after bearing 10-11 kids..now i c my cousins n friends..just after 1 delivery they're totally drained out!
i'd like to point out that our grandmothers n mothers were more healthier than us..even after bearing 10-11 kids..now i c my cousins n friends..just after 1 delivery they're totally drained out!
How do you know they were? They had no choice.
My mum has 6 children. The latter 3 were caesarian after complications and she would be back on her feet making rotiyaan a few days later. I thought this was normal when I was a kid. Now I know it's not. She just had no choice. Now she is paying the price for not taking care of herself or no one caring for her during those times, with health complications that are directly related. Oh, and no one outside the family would know because she hides it so well.
I think the toll of pregnancy and labour on the body is overlooked. It's very easy for a man to say his wife should keep producing.
when you have time for one and not for other(s). thats my definition of too many
This. I'm definitely planning less than my mum. I don't regret being the additional parent but I don't want my eldest going through the same. And my youngest siblings definitely don't have the same bond with my parents as I do and it's a shame. Sometimes I feel my father has barely even gotten to their real selves.
