There is no compulsion in religion

until and unless you can back this up, you're completely misguided and spreading falsehood in the name of Islam. Sorry for my harsh words though.

If i was born a muslim and dont find it appealing or have read Quran , tried to understand but not making sense to me.. I DO NOT need permission from anyone whether or not i can change my religion.

You're saying everyone should remain who they are and not ask any question, because according to you, Jewish would be killed if he accepts Islam. Will you save me from Jews if i was a jew and embrassing Islam? or would you fight with jews and try to kill me if i were to become jew from Muslim ?

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Al-Irtidaad (to renegade from Islam)

The religion of Islam is the most perfect and complete religion. The laws of Islam are flawlessly designed by Allah. These laws of Islam are for the benefit and of mankind.

Islam induces unity and always condemns division and sects.

Once a person accepts Islam, he sees its beauty and perfection. If after seeing the beauty of Islam, a Muslim turns away from it, it means he turned away from perfection towards imperfection, disassociating himself from the unity of the Muslims ummah towards a way that is unacceptable by Allah.

Allah always wishes good for His servants. By one accepting Islam, he will be Insha Allah entitled to paradise. However, after accepting Islam, one turns renegade, it means he has become entitled to Jahannam (Hell). This is not what Allah wishes for His servants. To prevent more people from becoming true candidates of the fire of Hell, Allah legislated a deterrent for it, i.e. the law of execution.

This law of executing the renegade is a unanimously accepted rule according to all Muslims.

Al-Hadith

Sayyiduna Ibn Abbaas radhi allahu anhuma says: Nabi sallalahu alayhi wasallam said “Execute the one who renegades from his Deen.” (Sahih al-Bukhariy Hadith6299, Sunan al-Nasaa’iy Hadith4059 edited by Shaikh Abdul Fattah Abu Ghuddah)

Sayyiduna ‘Uthmaan radhiyallahu anhu narrates hearing Nabi Sallallahu alayhi wa sallam as saying “……The one who changes his religion after accepting Islam must be executed.” (Sunan al-Nasaa’iy Hadith4057 edited by Shaikh Abdul Fattah Abu Ghuddah)

Sayyiduna Abdullah radhiallahu anhu narrates Nabi Sallallahu alayhi wa sallam as saying “It is not Halaal to kill a Muslim except for 3 reason: …no.3.The one that turns away from his Deen, thereby disassociating himself from the group of Muslims.”(Sahih Muslim Hadith4351 edited by Shaikh Khalil ma’moon Sheeha)

Ijma’

The one who renegades from Islam must be executed is the unanimous verdict of the sahaaba, none of them rejected it.

The unanimity of the Sahaaba on an issue is conclusive evidence of the same.

The Fuqaha (Jurists)

All the 4 Mazhabs are unanimous that a renegade must be executed if he does not revert to Islam. Hereunder are classical texts from each of the 4 Mazhabs:
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Al-Hanafiyyah
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Imam al-Marghinaaniy says: "If a Muslim, may Allah forbid turns away from Islam, the religion of Islam should be presented to him. If he has any doubts they should be cleared…and he should be kept under supervision for 3 days. If he reverts to Islam, he must be set free, otherwise he should be executed. (Al-Hidaya)

Allamah Ibn ‘Aabideen says: “Note well! It is unanimous that a renegade from Islam must be executed” (Rasaa’il Ibn Aabideen)

Al-Maalikiyyah

Imam Maalik says: “The one who renegades from Islam to another religion and exposes it will be asked to repent from his action. If he does not repent, he must be executed.” (Al-Mu’atta lil Imam Maalik)
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Al-shaafi’iyyah*

Imam al-Shaafi’iy says: “One who renegades from Islam will not be left alone, either he reverts to Islam or he will be executed.” (Kitab al-Umm)
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Al-Hanaabilah*

Allamah Ibn Qudaama al-Hanbaliy says: “All the scholars are unanimous that a renegade must be executed.” (Al-Mughniy with Sharh al-Kabir Vol.10 Pg.74 Dar al-Kutub al-Ilmiyyah Beirut)

From the above it is explicitly clear that there is no leeway in the religion of Islam regarding executing a renegade from Islam.

www.AskImam.org


Mr. Popat, you’re a Ahmadi, nothing for you to worry about on this issue. :slight_smile:
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you are totally wrong here and your argument is void
the string you are pulling doesn't exist. thats jews matter if they will protect you from any other person or not, but if someone enters islam, and AN ISLAMIC GOVT based on SHARIA is functional, it will be duty of the govt to protect each and every person under it, not only those who accept islam.

and if you are a born muslim, and don't find it appealing, you should approach the ones who are expert of the matter, the guided ones. and i don't understand how reading Quran can lead you to this? until and unless you have your own interpretation of Quran that is not in line with sunnah and hadeeth. and where did i say that nobody should ask any question? you are putting words in my mouth. and did you miss the part where i said implementation of this and other such punishments is arguable until a sharia compliant islamic govt is in place? i'm sure you missed this

thats why i said your argument is void and you did not even try to understand what was said.

moreover, read all what cricketplaya has posted, and i hope you will understand something...

CP: good post

Hmmm I could have sworn it was the other way around. Hadith and Sunnah had to be in line with the Quran.

Oh I smell something. I think its bull****.

  1. How many times is Apostasy mentioned in the Quran? Very Few, I think its only 7 or 11 times
  2. What are the punishment prescribed for Apostasy in the Quran? I'll give you a hint. There are none.

As humans who were given life by GOD, we have no authority to take it away. A sin as dangerous and extreme as killing someone should not even be questioned. The Prophet executed people, but guess what people it was not on his authority, he had direct revelations from GOD. It was only under those direct orders from GOD, did the Prophet dare to take away anyones life. At this day and age, no one has the right to prescribe this punishment because God is not communicating with you through revelation.

Forget what scholars have said. It does not take a person of great religious knowledge to come to the conclusion that the act of taking away life is sinful and evil. Even if one lives under Sharia law, there is a line where Sharia does not have jurisdiction over. No one has the right to take away life be it as a form of punishment, revenge, intentional or accidental.

Take your twisted Qadiani cult beliefs back to the village of Qadian.

We don't need some qadianis to tell us when DIVINE LAW has no jurisdiction over... give me a break. DIVINE LAW has jurisdiction all throughout this world INSHALLAH, when a united ummah stands, you qadianis will be the first ones to convert to Islam.

Re: There is no compulsion in religion

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

I love it when people use threats and their own prophecies to reply to rational arguments. Oh please teach me your eloquent and ever so convincing way of debating. I am in awe.

Re: There is no compulsion in religion

Why you still here? The ummah will not care of your baseless opinions. People will get executed.

Re: There is no compulsion in religion

My bad, are u a 12er? lmao, 12x worse than a qadiani kafir. :k:

Re: There is no compulsion in religion

You calling me kafir will not make me a kafir.

A court calling me a kafir will not make me a kafir.

Until God Himself calls me a Kafir, I will continue being an Ahmadi Muslim. And if my beliefs turn out to be false I will accept my punishment from God and no one else.

:k: You are so immature my friend.

all in all, killing someone in the name of God is absolutely unacceptable in Islam. If someone dont find Islam appealing despite his/her attempt to understand ( Islam is a complete code of life , and every bit of it makes perfect sense. Its just for argument sake ), then s/he should be given free choice to choose whatsoever religion s/he wills for him/herself. You dont force a person to stay Muslim. You have no such right given.

I guess one of the reason westerners are not coming close to Islam is because of such man made rules and the punishments that you prescribe. I'd rather see less Muslims BUT practicing Muslims than to see whole lot of Muslim population with just the name of Muslims.

Our Islam is a religion, so true , so wonderful and so logical that we dont need such punishments if one decide not to stay Muslim anymore. Our beliefs, our tradition speaks for itself for being the true one. We dont need force to convert everyone Muslim. It's Allah's choice whomsoever he blesses to become Muslim. Our duty should only be to guide all to the right path and pray for them, not threaten them that you'll be killed once you accept Islam and leave it. Its complete bogus.

First you label divine rules as “man made” then you go onto say “our islam” as if Qadianis now have the right to speak on behalf of Islam. :hehe: Mirza Qadiani may have sold his soul to shaytan to sit in the lap of the kuffar but we Muslims are not such cowards, that we give up DIVINE laws for the sake of some kuffar who doesn’t understand them.

oh and: http://www.paklinks.com/gs/blogs/cricketplaya/77000-fitna-of-qadianism-ahmadiyya-part-1.html

Re: There is no compulsion in religion

Islam is as much mine as its yours. Stop with your hatred posts already. It's not really helping much. You're not showing love for MuhammadPBUH in any way possible. Stop being extremist.

Jis deeN ka sirf qissoN pe saara madaar hai
wo deeN nahi hai, aik fasaana guzaar hai
sach poochiye to qissoN ka kya aitbaar hai
qissoN mein jhooth aor khataa be shumaar hai

'nff said!

If Mr.Poppat is saying the rules are mad made, wouldnt it make more of an impact for you to prove they are not man made. All you are doing is claiming these so called rules are divine. Can you give examples from the Quran or Sunnah?

Doesnt it get tiring always coming up with idiotic claims?

Also by saying that these arguments come from Ahmadi’s and using personal attacks you just embarrass yourself. Please try to use rational persuasive arguments that employ logic and evidence instead of hate and ignorance.

But hey ignorance is bliss right? I sincerely wish you happiness in your ignorant life.

I guess you called the sources I posted "bulls..." in couple posts back. No more need to prove to you anything. The fact is YOU guys need to back up your claims from Quran and sunnah without using any "metaphore" excuses. Islam is not metaphorical like Ahamdis claim.

Re: There is no compulsion in religion

Like Mr.Poppat said, all you did was list man made Hadiths and religious opinions. Can you give us examples from Quran or Sunnah?

Can you tell me what metaphors we use? Also how much of your knowledge about Ahmadiyyat comes from Ahmadi sources? We have book after book, article after article on our website. If you get info from Non-Ahmadi sources, then get info from Ahmadi sources as well. Talk to an Ahmadi Imam, visit an Ahmadi Mosque. Dont just spew hatred and ignorance.

Re: There is no compulsion in religion

fact of the matter truly is that im a hypocrite.. i dont feel good posting here because my amaal/actions dont reflect the type of posts i post here. My whole concern is to please have a look at the ahmadiyya teaching and see if it contradicts with Islam.. then only can you draw conclusion.. i'm avoiding writing long replies as i said earlier, i'm not being a good muslim these days either ( no praying , no Quran talawah etc ).. May Allah guide us all to the right path and enable us to love what He commands us to love and make us hate every sinful act. Aamin.

and cricketplaya, may Allah enable you to follow the footsteps of Muhammad PBUH. Keep us all in your prayers. Thanks.

I already have. Been to your website, downloaded pdfs after pdfs, started reading and honestly to tell you the truth it's professionally written but do you really want me to believe fighting in the path of Allah is not part of Islam and that Mirza was Krishna? Things like these just put me off more and more. Not to mention you believe Prophethood continues even after the last of all prophets < that is enough for me to look at your sources with a very critical eye.

When you start calling the sources as made up/man made, then what's the point in continuing. You spew the hatred and ignorance by that logic.

Re: There is no compulsion in religion

guys lets not derail it… truth has been posted in this thread with proper references ALHAMDULILLAH, its there for those who need to really understand and learn. those who are here only to neglect and insist on “their own version of islam” are more than welcome to continue practicing it…

CP: Hidayah is in ALLAH :subhanahu: hand, not ours : ) i suggest we should spare this discussion on qadiani religion to some other thread, and leave this one to its topic