The Pathan's of Chach

Chachi’s are referred to those people who originate from the
geographical area, Chach (Attock), in North-West Punjab, Pakistan.
Therefore, the word ‘Chachi’ does not mean any caste, creed or clan.
Not all Chachi’s are Pathan’s, some of who descend from Kashmiri’s
and Africans, who came with the Arabs, during the introduction of
Islam, to present day Pakistan.

There are still some Chach Pathans who speak Pashto. Hindko is a language, which can be traced back to the Gandhara civilisation. This particular region has been the centre of migration for thousands of years. Over the last five hundred years, the region has been dominated by Pathan’s, and Pashto was widely spoken amongst the populace. However, the administrators of the region, continued to speak Punjabi (the Hindko dialect), until Urdu became the official language. This has lead to a revival of Hindko as the popular language being spoken. Another contributing factor to the revival of Hindko has been the arrival of merchants and traders from the Punjab, over 150 years ago. Hindko is now the dominant language in Attock, and Pashto is hardly ever spoken amongst the settled inhabitants.

There is conflicting theory on whether Pashto or Hindko is the original language of the area, as many Chachi’s state that their elders used to speak Pashto. This confusion has led to many Pashto speaking Pathan’s in nearby regions, not recognising the Chach Pathan’s as Pathan’s. Indeed, who can argue with them, when some Chach Pathan’s themselves would argue that they are culpable because they have discarded their own language (Pashto) and culture to facilitate trade with the Punjabi merchants. This proud ness and modesty shows that the Chach Pathan’s have the original characteristics of the Pathan instilled within them.

There are some Chach Pathan’s, who are every bit if not more of a Pathan than the Pashto speaking Pathan’s. They are conservative and firmly hold on to the ideals and notions of Pashtunwali or ‘Pathanwalgi’ as pronounced in Hindko. Many of these people exist in small villages in Chach and even when they emigrate, they take their principles with them. They still maintain their strict code of honour in places like Birmingham, England, where there is a large community of Chach Pathan’s.

There are different types of Chach Pathans, some of whom are modernistic, and may no longer be called Pathan’s, but there are also those who are still very much conservatives. They, like the Pashto speaking Pathan’s, are proud of their clans.

Chachi was Pathan?

what about the Fonz? ehhhhhhhhh :jhanda:

Not all Attock-ies are chachis either!

Re: The Pathan's of Chach

[QUOTE]
*Originally posted by Ashti: *
Chachi's are referred to those people who originate from the
geographical area, Chach (Attock), in North-West Punjab, Pakistan.
Therefore, the word 'Chachi' does not mean any caste, creed or clan.
Not all Chachi's are Pathan’s, some of who descend from Kashmiri’s
and Africans, who came with the Arabs, during the introduction of
Islam, to present day Pakistan.

There are still some Chach Pathans who speak Pashto. Hindko is a language, which can be traced back to the Gandhara civilisation. This particular region has been the centre of migration for thousands of years. Over the last five hundred years, the region has been dominated by Pathan’s, and Pashto was widely spoken amongst the populace. However, the administrators of the region, continued to speak Punjabi (the Hindko dialect), until Urdu became the official language. This has lead to a revival of Hindko as the popular language being spoken. Another contributing factor to the revival of Hindko has been the arrival of merchants and traders from the Punjab, over 150 years ago. Hindko is now the dominant language in Attock, and Pashto is hardly ever spoken amongst the settled inhabitants.

There is conflicting theory on whether Pashto or Hindko is the original language of the area, as many Chachi's state that their elders used to speak Pashto. This confusion has led to many Pashto speaking Pathan’s in nearby regions, not recognising the Chach Pathan’s as Pathan’s. Indeed, who can argue with them, when some Chach Pathan’s themselves would argue that they are culpable because they have discarded their own language (Pashto) and culture to facilitate trade with the Punjabi merchants. This proud ness and modesty shows that the Chach Pathan’s have the original characteristics of the Pathan instilled within them.

There are some Chach Pathan’s, who are every bit if not more of a Pathan than the Pashto speaking Pathan’s. They are conservative and firmly hold on to the ideals and notions of Pashtunwali or 'Pathanwalgi' as pronounced in Hindko. Many of these people exist in small villages in Chach and even when they emigrate, they take their principles with them. They still maintain their strict code of honour in places like Birmingham, England, where there is a large community of Chach Pathan’s.

There are different types of Chach Pathans, some of whom are modernistic, and may no longer be called Pathan’s, but there are also those who are still very much conservatives. They, like the Pashto speaking Pathan’s, are proud of their clans.
[/QUOTE]

They have more in connon with the natives of Kafiristan then Pukhtuns, one reason is their peacful and timid stance in life.

Kaafiristan konsi jageh hai? Hamaari takfeer to na karo Molvi Sahib. :(

I just want to know what we are ethnically, I’ve thought about just calling myself a Hindko but that includes lots of different ethnicities, I really want to find out our roots.

Are we called Pathan because we are of Pashtun origin or because of the similar cultures? I couldn't careless which one it is just so that I know and my mind is at rest.

That's the **** thing about belonging to a small ethnicity, you don't fit anywhere.

[QUOTE]
*Originally posted by XTC: *
Not all Attock-ies are chachis either!
[/QUOTE]

I know yaar.

Attocki sounds cool for an Arabic surname though, Ashti Al-Attocki.

[QUOTE]
*Originally posted by Ashti: *
Kaafiristan konsi jageh hai? Hamaari takfeer to na karo Molvi Sahib. :(
[/QUOTE]

In Afghanistan the name of Kafiristan has been changed to Nuristan, whereas in Pakistan it is still called Kailash.

Allahu Akbar, to ham kya Younaani hein? Aur ham hein ke aesay hee apney Yahoodi honay pe afsos kar rahey thay, achi baat hai.

Chachis? has it any reference to Chach-Naama? Chach was a Hindu Maha-Raaja who ruled the Indus below kashmir. Educate me please.

^
So our area is named after a Hindu? That's a bit crap innit?

Does anyone have any proper info about Hindko speakers?????????

[QUOTE]
*Originally posted by Ashti: *
^
So our area is named after a Hindu? That's a bit crap innit?

Does anyone have any proper info about Hindko speakers?????????
[/QUOTE]

Ashti, what do you want to know about Hindkowan? Ilaaqa Chach is an ancient name for the the Hazara/Attock region of Punjab/Sarhad. Hinkians are a mix of Punjabi and Pakhtun, although most claim to be "Pathan" they are of a niether ethnicity..but rather a separate and unque group.

Attock is heavily hinkian, but the population has been tipping other way as ethnic Punjabis and Afghan refugees have settled there. I really think that Attock is a place where you can still see Pashtuns, Punjabis and Hinkians getting along very well.

[QUOTE]
*Originally posted by pk taz: *
...Hindko speakers from the Attock district, ..., it annoys me how they clain to be Pathan.
[/QUOTE]

I now think they are the same, this guy on another BB has managed to convince me.

The same tribes are usually found in both Hinkos and Pukhtoons, Mushwani's, Akhunzade's etc. and some of them are also bilingual.

Why do you people have to make it so hard?

Anyway, are Hinkian and Hindkowan the same thing? And is the language Hindko in anyway related to the language Seriaki?

[QUOTE]
*Originally posted by pk taz: *

I now think they are the same, this guy on another BB has managed to convince me.

The same tribes are usually found in both Hinkos and Pukhtoons, Mushwani's, Akhunzade's etc. and some of them are also bilingual.
[/QUOTE]

Taz, maybe your confused or swayed easily. Mixed ancestory and collective group identity makes them separate. Not to be overtly political but the good people of Hazara were avidly Pro-ML and to this day have been a link between Punjab and Sarhad.

Ask any Pashtun what Hind-Ko means..

[QUOTE]
*Originally posted by Imdad Ali: *
Why do you people have to make it so hard?

Anyway, are Hinkian and Hindkowan the same thing? And is the language Hindko in anyway related to the language Seriaki?
[/QUOTE]

Imdad, no one is making it hard. It's not a matter of black & white, thats all.

In our dialect we say Hinkian, and across the the Abasin they say Hindkowan..same people. The language is not related to Seraiki, although I have read a few strong papers on it. Most likely the link between Seraiki & Hindko is the Punjabi words. There are many Punjabi literary figures who consider bot Seraiki and Hindko to be dialects of Punjabi-- an assertion I do not agree with.

Also to avoid any confusion, when I say Hazara, I am referring to Hazara dist not Hazara of Afghanistan. Interestingly enough, the name of Tashkent (the Uzbek capital) was also Chach.

Salama alaiykum Rajput bro, u seem very knowledgeable about stuff like this :slight_smile:

Isn’t that a contradiction? :confused:

So are we the result of cross breeding between Punjabis and Pashtuns, a bit like mules then? Or are we totally different? Do we have anything to do with the Gandhara civilisation? Basically I’m not interested in what culture we have or what language we speak now, just wanna know our ancestry.

Hindko is very closely related to Punjabi then how come people from Sarhad speak it? Is it the result of migrations and stuff? Where did this language originate Punjab or the areas its spoke in i.e. Sarhad?

I know of people who we call Hinki, I don’t know if that’s the same as Hinkian, only know one family and they are dark with dark lips, not dat dere’s owt rong wid dat but I know for sure we’re not the same people as them.

Yeah I know, everyone gets on pretty well in Attock, the only problem are those bostord smelly Kabuli’s, biggest namak-haraams on earth, they are like stray dogs taken into a home, Pakistan gave them a safe haven to live in and how do they repay us? By bringing their drug culture and talking about how great their Afghanistan is, if that’s the case then why don’t they fock off back? And they eat yukky food, tea and those big roti’s, that’s the only thing they ever eat man.

My dada told me that we are not the same as Pashtuns, he said they use the word Pathan to describe their ethnicity and for us its used to describe our caste, we’re Pathan (high caste, farmers, landlords, ghairatmand) as opposed to the Kami’s i.e. Potters (Kumhaar), Barbers (Nai), Carpenter’s (Mistri), Weavers (Julaahey), Shoemakers (Mochi) etc.

But if the difference were only status due to profession then why would there be physical differences between the Kamis and the Pathans? I mean obviously we are ghairti and stuff (with a Kami you can go shag one of their women and they’ll sit their like a dead horse and let you get on with it) and they do crap jobs but there’s more to it than just that, there are physical differences, they tend to look a bit dark and we’re fairer skinned.

There are some Awaan’s in our village, I don’t think they are called Pathans but they are not low caste like Kami’s neither, are they Punjabi or something else?

http://www.ethnologue.com/show_country.asp?name=Pakistan

I’ve posted this before:

Ashti: Many ethnic groups are breakaway ones from others..with time and demographics new cultures and ethnic groups are created..that’s life. It neither diminsihes the groups history nor does it uplifts it, I would say one difference between Hazara hindko speakers and Attock ones is because of administrative and political reasons many people part of Hazara have to learn pashto, so the big families in Haripur like Gohar Ayub and Raja Sikander Zamans tend to know pashto..

[QUOTE]
*Originally posted by pk taz: *

I now think they are the same, this guy on another BB has managed to convince me.

The same tribes are usually found in both Hinkos and Pukhtoons, Mushwani's, Akhunzade's etc. and some of them are also bilingual.
[/QUOTE]

And also Bangash is a Pukhtoon tribe found amongst the Hindkowaan.

So are the people from Hazara ethnically the same as us? and are Northern Hindko and Southern Hindko closely related or just same names?

There are also some families in Attock who speak both Pukhto and Hindko, especially in Ghorghusti area.