The message of Mullah Omar to muslims.

Society Religion & Philosophy
41

Funny you should say that. Have you ever been to Tehran? Or do you know a Sunni muslim who has come from Tehran? I, for one Have been to Iran and know for a fact there are sunni mosques…

As for Khomeiny’s killing, do you really listen to all that american Bull that they splatter all over your TV screens? were you in Iran when they killed sunnis? did you see with your very own eyes?

I have friends from Afghanistan who have seen their families killed just because they were shia. Doesn’t that bother you? Even nw when they talk about it their eyes well up and grow dim…

You know what Khoon? I dont wish to argue uselessly with you. I have been doing that ofr the past two years and not one person has heeded. What makes me think you will? First Watcher, then Zalim and now…

Now before I leave you with your thoughts I have one thing to say, Afghans are happy there are no fanatics with guns running around their cities killing ‘unlawfuls’ anymore. They are jubilant and happy. Let them remain that way.

Thousands were killed under the rule of the Taliban due to various things such as faith, race, ideals and loyalty. None of which are wrong. We muslims are brought up to tolerate others. The Taliban dismiss the basic foundation of Islam. Subit yourselves to Allah’s will. Allah’s will is to:

“To you your faith, and to me, mine!”(Sura al Kafiroon)

This implies to anyone who doesnt listen. Now if you think that Shia, Hazaras, Tajiks, Uzbeks, Loyalists to the corwn ect. dont listen, let them be. Why shoot them down?

42

Erm, one who flees Jihad is called a munafiq and will got to hell right?

43

~Mickey~,

Thank you, for elaborating your belief in Mullah Omar as you Ameer-ul-Momaneen! I guess if he actually does come out of his hiding you will start considering him the rightful owner of the Khalifat as well!

http://www3.pak.org/gupshup/smilies/ok.gif

My question about his arrival back was based on the fact that it’s not very abnormal for leaders to ‘disappear’ after their defeat. Actually, they never could capture Hitler and some Nazi kept on believing that he is alive & will return. Not that I am comparing your Ameer-ul-Momeneen to Hitler now, it’s the defeat in war & disappearance afterwards that is common to both of 'em.

Yes, I do not want to be the likes of Mullah Omar and appreciate my differences from him. Now if you will just explain what is your view point of NA & Ahmad Shah Masood, we will end our discussion at this verse:

109: 7. ‘For you your religion, and for me my religion.’

44

Look Shah Jahan, we both used the same verse but in a little different context! :)

Please don't get offended by their talks & be patient with them. They haven't even been to Afghanistan but would like to defend Talaban as if they were there through the whole ordeal!!

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http://www3.pak.org/gupshup/smilies/biggrin.gif

hey! AJ, the verse is, in my humble opinion one of the most direct and blessed verses ever. Why should we bother people and why should they bother us? I follow what I follow. what’s it to you?

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[quote]
Originally posted by Shah Jahan:
** I, for one Have been to Iran and know for a fact there are sunni mosques.....

**
[/quote]

Man ! You are a ** sick liar !!!! ** You are just soooo ** obsessed ** with ** Taqiyah ("Holy Hypocrisy") ** .

Here, contact the Iranian embassies yourself, and find out. (Other readers are welcome to ** protest to the Iranian government ** regarding the ** brutal persecution ** of the Mainstream Muslims (i.e the ** Sunni Muslims) ** in ** Iran ** at the hands of the ** Shiites). ** :

** Iranian Embassy in Canada: **

245 Metcalfe St.
Ottawa, Ontario
K2P 2K2 Canada

Tel (consulate): (613) 233-IRAN (4726)
Fax (consulate): (613) 236-IRAN (4726)
Tel (embassy): (613) 235-IRAN (4726)
Fax (embassy): (613) 232-5712

** Iranian Embassy in the UK : **

The Embassy of Islamic Republic of Iran - London

16 Prince's Gate, London, SW7 1PT
Tel.: (44) 020-7225 3000 Fax.: (44) 020-7589 4440
E-Mail.: [email protected]

** Iranian Embassy in U.S.A : **

2209 Wisconsin Ave., N.W. Washington D.C. 20007

Tel: (202) 965-4990, Fax: (202) 965-1073

** Iranian Embassy in U.A.E : **

P.O. Box : 4080 , Abu Dhabi , UAE

Tel : +9712 - 4447618 Fax :+9712 - 4448714

** Iranian Embassy in Oman : **

Iran Embassy, Tel-696944

47

AHMADJEE I WILL ANSWER UR QUESTION IF UR PATIENT TO READ IT ALL..

before soviet war and entire history of afghanistan since it was recognized an independent state in the time of AHMED SHAH ABDALI (his majesty).till the taliban (well presently too).Afghanistan has been ruled by pashtuns since thr the natives of the country..except for a couple of years back in late 20's or i think early 20's cant remember but one of them when king nadirshah was overthrown and some tajik became the president unyil zahir shah in 1933 came to power (zahir shah son of nadir shah).
since that time pashtuns have played a key role in the history of afghanistan ...
later the uzbeks and the tajiks migrated to afghanistan due to soviet opression.while hazara lived in afghanistan since the time of mongols.(ghengez khan)..

before the soviet war till 1973 when zahir shah was overthrown ..that was the time when the communist started to influence the goverment of afghanistan with communism ..as many leaders ie babrak karmal ,noor muhammad taraki,najibullah and two morw cant remember thr name .were brought to power by soviets.
when the soviet war started in 1979 . tribal leaders from HERAT the 1st one to pick up arms and declare jihad against soviet opression .later everyone joined in...
pashtuns were the one who gave resistance to the soviet opression while on the other hand ahmed shah masood (he did fight too but not in a similar fashion like pashtun did)signed sieze fire with the soviets three times ..even though panjsher was the best strategic area for guerilla warfare..

soviets thr for targeted the pashtun areas.kandahar ,kunduz,herat ,jalalabad,laghman,wardag,gardez and many more .the pashtun unborn babies were killed so thr next generation cannot fightone one day more than 6 thousand pashtuns were killed in laghamn with thr stinky gunship helicopters...thr fore in afghanistan the pashtun population dropped from 62% to 45%.giving rise to other ethnic minorities in afghanistan.many pashtun families came to peshawer and quetta due to opression and raping of the womens.thr men wud send them to peshawer and quetta(thanx again to zia ul haq).

AHMADJEE I HOPE UR STILL READING

THE NORTHERN ALLIANCE:
commonly called the "shamali ithihad" in afghanistan was a group having uzbeks ,tajiks and hazaras in it and lil no of pashtuns.thr leader was BURHANUDDIN RABBANI who was the leader while his army general was AHMED SHAH MASOOD.
when the northern afghanis saw the pashtuns are week now and wont survive for long they started attacking key cities of pashtun strong hold.at that time pashtun leader was GULBADEEN HEKMATYAR.
before soviet war thr was no such name of shamali ithihad .why after the war.why at the time when pashtuns were week and tired of war...
i can prove why i say apshtun were the ones who fought the war in majority alongside arabs and pashtuns from pakistan and some panjabies.i dont say the farsi ban didnt fight either .but they didnt fight like pashtuns did.
why did ahmed shah masood sighned seize fire two times for a period of two and a half year while the fierce fighting was going on in the south.why?

[This message has been edited by fakeer (edited April 23, 2002).]

48

after soviet withdrawal in 1989 ..the warlordism came into being..from 1989 to 1996 7 YEARS only kabul itself was didvided into four fractions.
**one part was controlled by pashtun warlord GULBADEEN HEKMATYAR.
**second part by the tajik warlord AHMED SHAH MASOOD.
**third part by the uzbek warlord ABDUL RASHID DOSTHUM.
**while the 4th by the hazara and shiite people of afghanistan under the leadership of ISMAEL KHAN.
all these four warlords fought on the capital city for seven long years resulting in more than 50 thousand deaths and number of rapes.(more people died in kabul after the soviet withdrawal).
for sevn years no one could take control of the entire capital..
until 1996 when a lil number of pashtun stood up from kandahar and later on due to thr success many more pashtuns joined in and than it was called "the taliban"(students )
tell me while the other four were fighting seven years on one capital city ..tell me exactly how long did it take the pashtun talibans to take over not only kabul itself but the the whole entire country.in a matter of months afghanistan was in the hands of the pashtuns again.
this proves that the pashtuns had experience in war WHEN TO RISE UR HEAD AND WHEN TO TAKE COVER.and then abdullah abdullah the foreign minister says "the concept that pashtuns are the only rulers of afghanistan shud be brought to an end"
..go back to tajikistan u stink..u belong to tajikistan.

[This message has been edited by fakeer (edited April 23, 2002).]

49

Well said Mickey and Fakeer. As for ur question about Sunnis in Iran. Yes I personally know Baluch Iranian now living in Gulf Countries and describe how the Iranian government treat Sunnis there specially the Arabs and Baloch in the South. About one year ago some fundamentalist Iranian killed a Sunni cleric who was living in exile in Afghanistan coz of the persecution, in a suicide bomb attack near a mosque for which the Harat people stoned the Iranian diplomatic center in harat. It was even on the bbc.

50

fakeer,

Thank you for the long history lesson. Most of the things I have known before but Ahmad Shah Masood did three treaties with the Soviets, that's new to me. I will probe into that.

Few comments if you may let me:

  1. Saying Pathans fought more in number than other ethnic groups is probably acceptable keeping in mind the fact that they were in majority and that they were the ones from whom the power was snatched. Though saying they fought more bravely than other ethnic groups can be argued.

  2. Secondly, I believe the brutality of the Russians was common on all grounds.

  3. Talaban were not just those who from the south, after their early successes many Pustoon tribal war lords (if that's the right word for them) groups joined them, though they did not call themselves Talaban. And many of them have defected these days (causing a early collapse of Talaban) even resenting the fact that they have to accept defeat from NA, even for a limited time.

  4. You forgot to mention ISI in the whole story, which is a very key player in the construction & destruction of Talaban.

  5. So, the punch line is that Afghanistan is to be ruled by Pustoon alone and as Talaban were Pustoon you support them?

Thanks again for all your effort!

51

AHMADJEE

answering ur questions.

#1..u know in a war like situation thr’s a common saying in pashtu “chay kalla jang wee no toll jang kawee ,chay sog na kawee no agha pashtun na deh”.rough translation "when thr’s a war everyone fights ,whoever doesnt he’s not a pashtun..
and in this kinda siuation u call a pashtun “NOT PASHTUN”.that can be the biggest swear ever said to a pashtun.
yes we will argue on that topic too..i never said they didnt fight ..thr were ofcourse persian speaking ppl too who fought bravely.

#2..indeed the russian did destroy the whole country..but that was when they started the war ..in mazar shareef after two years when they invaded afghanistan ..the war thr was a joke we pashtuns used to make fun of mazaris they didnt even knew wat ak-47 was .the fighting thr was almost equal to “0”.u mightve heard of rasheed dosthum who used to swicth sides ..he fought against the mujahideens .and mazar shareef was used as the parking lot of russian tanks with no fear of being destroyed .they even used to go in the bazaar to buy food for themselves.

on the other hand .the tajiks (ahmed shah masood’s men) ist of all panjsher wasa very strategic place covered with mountains and the russian tried to take over but everytime thr planes wud be shot down.so russians didnt risked themselves going into panjsher valley.so they signed cease fire with them ..when that happened why didnt masooud’s fellow didnt fight in other key cities .why only panjsher ..wasnt afghanistan thr country , werent they afghans or just panjsheri?. + when taliban fought masood’s people at that time was the SALANG HIGHWAY blown up and blocked ..why didnt they do so at the time of the russians..if u ever go to afghanistan go to panjsher and see how many tanks and thr armoured vehicles are lying thr (destroyed).the mujahideens used to wait for them to come out on the other side of salang highway (ie the south side of salang highway not the other side that goes to panjsher)why didnt the panjsheris blew it up …when they cud easily blow them up or block thr way by simply destroying the tunnel.
why did they do it when taliban came ..were the soviets more dear to them than the pashtuns?

3rd..my friend why do u call them the defeated army ..when an army is defeated that means everyone throws thr arm (hathiar phaink dena).no one fights .so tell me when did they throw thr arms and said that ok we’re defeated .. thr still fighting bro.but now its not an armed struggle.its called the guerilla warfare.
but i agree with u on the groups joining theory

http://www3.pak.org/gupshup/smilies/smile.gif

4th..yes isi helped gulbadeen hekmatyar during soviet struggle.and they did assisted the talibans.i agree .

#5..ahmed jee wud u like if i come to your house and after spending a night i tell u to buz off this is my home now.tell me wud u like it?
if u do that to me i’ll simply kill you

http://www3.pak.org/gupshup/smilies/wink.gif

just kidding bro.
yes i 100% say that afghansitan shud be ruled by the people who are natives not the citizens of afghanistan..and i never said i support every pashtoon who ruled the country..the new guy karzai is a pashtoon too .i didnt like him from the start.neither do i like zahir shah.i supported gulbadeen hekmatyar until the soviet withdrawal but when he fought for power ,i think no pashtun supports him now.
yes i supported taliban cuz thr was peace in thr time.they did do some mistakes too ..tell me how many mistakes ur goverment made .?than question me about taliban..

thanx if u read the whole thing .. phew that was a lot of typing.

[This message has been edited by fakeer (edited April 23, 2002).]

52

http://www3.pak.org/gupshup/smilies/ok.gif

53

man i can talk for hours on this topic…ahmedjee cant beat me

http://www3.pak.org/gupshup/smilies/hehe.gif

.

is that enuf ahmed jee or u have more questions to ask too.i’m waiting patiently.

54

[quote]
Originally posted by Khoon-e-Shaheed:
** Man ! You are a ** sick liar !!!! ** You are just soooo ** obsessed ** with ** Taqiyah ("Holy Hypocrisy") ** .

Here, contact the Iranian embassies yourself, and find out. (Other readers are welcome to ** protest to the Iranian government ** regarding the ** brutal persecution ** of the Mainstream Muslims (i.e the ** Sunni Muslims) ** in ** Iran ** at the hands of the ** Shiites). ** :

** Iranian Embassy in Canada: **

245 Metcalfe St.
Ottawa, Ontario
K2P 2K2 Canada

Tel (consulate): (613) 233-IRAN (4726)
Fax (consulate): (613) 236-IRAN (4726)
Tel (embassy): (613) 235-IRAN (4726)
Fax (embassy): (613) 232-5712

** Iranian Embassy in the UK : **

The Embassy of Islamic Republic of Iran - London

16 Prince's Gate, London, SW7 1PT
Tel.: (44) 020-7225 3000 Fax.: (44) 020-7589 4440
E-Mail.: [email protected]

** Iranian Embassy in U.S.A : **

2209 Wisconsin Ave., N.W. Washington D.C. 20007

Tel: (202) 965-4990, Fax: (202) 965-1073

** Iranian Embassy in U.A.E : **

P.O. Box : 4080 , Abu Dhabi , UAE

Tel : +9712 - 4447618 Fax :+9712 - 4448714

** Iranian Embassy in Oman : **

Iran Embassy, Tel-696944

**
[/quote]

Well well well. I'm a sick liar now, am I? I'm also a hypocryte? Wow. you must be better than allah at distinguishing the true muslims from the munafiqs.....

I asked you, have you been to Iran? Have you seen only shia mosques in the country for yourself? I suspect not. All you listen to (and blindly belive in) are the baseless accusations by the wahabis of the Iranian govt......

Now now, dont let this get out of hand. If a hindu murders a muslim in Pakistan he will be punished. Not because he is hindu(which, if he gets killed will ultimately be the reason for 'human rights abuses' in Pakistan), but because he is a murderer. Same with Iran. The govt. doesnt run around ordering the killings of non shias. As far as I know, it is Saudi Arabia's Wahabi rulers who show prejeduce against the Shias......

55

ahmed jee did my answer satisfy you or no..u still have some doubts …if u do than u can challenge me

http://www3.pak.org/gupshup/smilies/hehe.gif

56

looks like ahmad jee is chickening out. paaak-pakpakpakka paaaak.

57

[quote]
Originally posted by reza khan:
looks like ahmad jee is chickening out. paaak-pakpakpakka paaaak.
[/quote]

Or maybe he has better things to do than waste his time arguing about a man who deserted his whole group of followers for his own safety.......

58

[quote]
Originally posted by Shah Jahan:
** Or maybe he has better things to do than waste his time arguing about a man who deserted his whole group of followers for his own safety.......**
[/quote]

If he had better things to do why came to argue in the first place in two pages. Read Mullah Omars history and tell he left his men to some ignorant Islam bashers. He fought against the Russians and then the communists lost everything in this world in holy jihad apart from his life. Deserted eh.......

[This message has been edited by reza khan (edited April 26, 2002).]

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http://www3.pak.org/gupshup/smilies/hehe.gif

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[quote]
Originally posted by Shah Jahan:
** Or maybe he has better things to do than waste his time arguing about a man who deserted his whole group of followers for his own safety.......**
[/quote]

1st of all my friend when u say he let his people down..than i guess in soviet war he let his people down to ehhh..
this is called guerilla warfare no one shows up his face ...its just like playing hide and seek..
who knows mulla umer might befighting now and sleeping in the caves with lack of food lack of air conditioner .no of sleepless nights in the cold dry mountains .with no sign of life..while u sitting here arguing that he let his people down..
i dunno when know one has anything left to say they just make these ignorant comments that are

1..when is comming out of hidding. do u know?

2..that he let his people down.hahhh

my friend at the time hazrat ali (ra) someone asked ali (ra) as he was the most knowledable personal at that time(at the time of his khilafa)..someone asked him "if u answer all my questions than i will embrace islam.he started asking question (tricky ones) and hazrat ali (ra) answered all of it one by one.in the end when the kafir got frustrated he started asking silly questions..he asked hazrat ali(ra) "ok tell me how many hair i have on my head ."
hazrat ali (ra) subhanallah answered this question too.he said"if i tell u how many hair u have wud u even know if i'm right (means wud u even be able to count how many hair uhave and challenge me that u were wrong"and than in addition he replied that
"I ANSWER ALL THOSE QUESTIONS THAT MAKES SENSE,NOT THE ONES HOW MANY HAIR I HAVE ON MY HEAD"
so if one asks a question that might be able to be argued and might expect an answer from the opponent.not like when is he comming out of hiding and he let his people down.