Ok this is what happened with me yesterday left me thinking for quite some while. I absolutely adore adore Ferrero Rochers, Kinder Surprises and Kinder Beuno chocolates and love eating them.
Just yesterday after googling I found out that these chocolates contain Alcoholic flavorings. Now hubby and I are quite conscious about halal and haram stuff and try our best to get everything alcohol free and suitable for vegetarians. Since I found out that E flavors contain gelatin made from pork, we try to avoid such products too, but it gets REALLY hard finding out ingredients all the time. According to GMWA food guide and a fatwa these alcoholic flavorings are halal.
However hubby says that when in doubt it’s best to refrain from the product. He also quoted these hadith.
***Sayyiduna Ibn Umar (Allah be pleased with him) narrates that the Messenger of Allah (Allah bless him & give him peace) said: “Every intoxicant is Khamr and every intoxicant is Unlawful (haram)…” (Sahih Muslim, Sunan Abu Dawud, No. 3671, Sunan Timidhi and others)
Sayyiduna Jabir ibn Abd Allah (Allah be pleased with him) narrates that the Messenger of Allah (Allah bless him & give him peace) said: “Whatever intoxicates in large quantities, then a small quantity of it is also forbidden.” (Sunan Abu Dawud, no. 3673, Sunan al-Tirmidhi, Sunan al-Nasa’i and others)
***But I was skeptical about this. This would make things so difficult esp for us who live in majority non-muslim countries. I didnt post this in Religion forum as I know the various school of thoughts rulings.
My questions:
If you were in my place would you eat these chocolates containing alcoholic flavorings?
How conscious are you in this haram/halal debate in various food on everyday basis? Esp for those who live in areas where majority of people are non-muslims and the halal meat shops or desi stores are very very rarely found.
If you were in my place would you eat these chocolates containing alcoholic flavorings?
No i will not eat anything that i figure has anything haram in it.
How conscious are you in this haram/halal debate in various food on everyday basis? Esp for those who live in areas where majority of people are non-muslims and the halal meat shops or desi stores are very very rarely found.
Quite conscious i must say to the point that whenever we had fish-o-fillet from macdonalds we use to make sure it was done in new oil . Also use to read up the ingredients for candies because i knew they can be tricky.
Alot of people are very relaxed on haram/halal, their excuse being that oh we live here now how long can we avoid it, etc etc. But the thing is nobody dies without a kfc/mcdonalds or some chocos or whatever. It’s not like replacement food is not available. However, at the end of the day i had say each to their own.
Just my opinion, but context is important. A large amount of alcohol is intoxicating, so a little bit (one or two drinks) is forbidden. The idea here is to avoid intoxication. Eating even 50 Kinder Surprises will not get you drunk so I personally see no harm.
Ghostie this is what I believe that the quantity isn’t intoxicating BUT now that I know it contains alcoholic flavorings…one part says there’s a widely accepted fatwa about this being halal but inside me ..something’s nagging me that something’s isnt right.
when i learn that a product has a wrong ingredient, I stop eating it.
:(
We have halal shops here ALHAMDULILLAH, so no such masla.
And before buying a product I do check it's ingredients if I have doubts.
Yes I always check for ingredients too and google them if am unsure before buying any product. But these flavorings are NOT written on the ingredients list which makes it even more ambiguous. For example my own mum and nani when they lived for a few years in south africa used Betty Crocker's cake mixes very frequently. But now that we know it's E flavorings dont make it halal am obviously not buying it.
I didnt go to any Mcdonalds or KFC here (not even had fish fillet burgers from there) for almost a year and when I went to Pak on a visit just recently…I couldn’t get enough of going there
I was not aware that there was a fatwa declaring them halal. It gives more credence to what I was saying: the idea is to avoid intoxication, not avoiding alcohol. Your own body has alcohol in it. The alcohol people drink has a specific kind of alcohol in it. The idea is not to avoid anything with an OH group, but to avoid intoxication.
That said, I think you have your answer. You don’t feel comfortable so you shouldn’t use those ingredients anymore. There’s no harm in being extra careful
Usually I read the labels before I buy something. If I see a questionable ingredient, I don't buy it. I found out that the more I dig for details, the more I'm getting myself into frustrating complicated issues because there's sooooo many opinions out there.
So I've settled with a comfortable medium where I avoid buying something if I know it isn't halal, go with what is common sense and obvious and enjoy the rest! :D
I second what Niksik said.I do read the list of ingredients and try my very best to stay away from anything that might not be right to consume.I try my best,and Allah knows best.
If I read on a box that it contains a flavoring agent containing alcohol,I would not be comfortable consuming it,even if it is a minute amount.
To answer the second part of your question,we have enough options available easily where we live so it has never been an issue.
Why would it make it difficult for Muslims in non-Muslim countries? There is plenty of food to choose from. If you have issues with packaged food go for fresh.
I would not eat those chocs if I knew they have alcohol in them. I am very surprised those choccolates contain them and I am disappointed that I read this thread before trying them one final time. ahahahaha
I am conscious and careful - i check labels to see if Vegetarian or contains alcohol. I used to buy Thorntons ice cream from the vendor in the shops and over the last year they label it all and I was surprised how many contain alcohol and non-vegetarian. Sometimes I ask why they need to put t i so many things?
I used to eat at Nando’s simply because a lot of Muslims ate there although a lot still considered it haram but when KFC went “halal” there was that divisive opinion again. I decided to look it up rather than follow the others and I came to the whole discussion surrounding halal slaughter in the UK. I stopped eating at Nandos because the certification they used was questioannable. They use the Halal Food Authority (HFA) which allows mechanical slaughter and stunning whilst the Halal Monitoring Committee (HMC) seems a bit more stringent - no mechanical slaughter, read prayer individually etc.
We Muslims make a huge fuss about what to eat but we can always make our own and there is nothing wrog with eating vegetables. I can understand why Westerners get annoyed at us.
I don't know about the percent alcohol in alcohol chocolate, but some flu medications have up to 10% alcohol. Though it is listed as an inactive ingredient, they did say to not take a whole chug for fear of liver damage.
would it really kill me if I don't eat it? Is it something that I can't live without?
if there is a doubt, then why take a chance? why would you want to maybe have a haram? If you avoid it altogether, there is no harm at all.
Where I live, there are issue with certain suppliers of chicken actually being halal. There are different opinions on whether the chicken is halal. Therefore, I just avoid eating from that supplier and from restaurants that carry that chicken supplier. Why take the chance? I can always eat elsewhere where I know the chicken is 100% halal.
Agreed with Afshi , my thought exactly , why take the risk when you know you can find something else where and even if you cant find the very same thing elsewhere , how about learning to compromise slightly to keep our Lord happy ..
Avoid the avoidable ... However, regarding the hadith what intoxicates in large quantities is haram in small quantities ... from this hadith - It refers to the whole product and not just the active ingredient ... Therefore, if in large quantities of a "whole product" one becomes intoxicated before becoming physically unable to consume more then it is considered khamr, otherwise it is not ... There are some alcoholic food products that will make you feel drunk before you can stop eating them ... most however do not ... If you want to exercise excellence however ... then that is different matter.
. Also use to read up the ingredients for candies because i knew they can be tricky.
