Re: The genocide of Hindus in Pakistan
Thousands of hindus are living in Karachi without any religious and sectarian discrimination.
The Jinnah Bridge on China Creek at Native's Jetty was constructed leaving place for Hindus' ashnan ghat over there.
Re: The genocide of Hindus in Pakistan
You CAN. No one is stopping you. How can you justify what Hindus are going through by pointing at what's happening to muslims in India?
Some of you just try to see who can play the victim card better- nothing else.
Nobody is justifying anything here , as i said. Read above carefully. Besides the Gujarat killings would still constitute an ethnic cleansing effort if not a full scale genoicide.
Re: The genocide of Hindus in Pakistan
Saad and Stir,
There's such a thing called carrying something too far.
In Stir's case, he is picking up a website that makes some allegations - yes, I am sure living as a tiny minority in Pakistan which is suffering from an attach of extremist and moderate islamists cannot be heavenly but it is not genocide either.
In Saad's case, with several hundred muslims living in India, the Babri or the Godhra riots do not constitute a pattern of anti-muslim violence either.
As I see it, and with due respect to both, both sides should chill and not try to gop one up, as someone mentioned, in playing the victim card
Re: The genocide of Hindus in Pakistan
Nobody is justifying anything here , as i said. Read above carefully. Besides the Gujarat killings would still constitute an ethnic cleansing effort if not a full scale genoicide.
reading this post tells me whatever I need to know. Why did you bring up gujarat in the first place.
Re: The genocide of Hindus in Pakistan
[quote]
Sorry guys, you'll have to try much harder to come up with a counter-Gujrat thread for Hindus in Pakistan.
[/quote]
again....another idiotic comment which proves me right. "Counter-Gujarat" eh? there are some pretty sick people here.
Re: The genocide of Hindus in Pakistan
We are simply forgetting humanity. We should not care for a life only when it belongs to a religion in which we believe.
I am fed up of all these hindu-muslim fight. screw u all..i am going home.
Re: The genocide of Hindus in Pakistan
reading this post tells me whatever I need to know. Why did you bring up gujarat in the first place.
I mentioned Gujarat not to justify anything...But to qoute the facts...Now you are derailing my response by manipulating it and using it without a reference.
Re: The genocide of Hindus in Pakistan
Request to all Pakistani supporters:
Please read my intro to this thread, if you have not. I have said in so many terms that I came across these allegations which is why I asked for your side. Don't jump up and down about Gujarath because that is a two way street and I have participated in a thread about that in the past, including Modei, Tehelka etc.
So the gist of what I am getting from you is that there is no decimation of Hindu population in West Pakistan and the genocide referred to in the article fragment (full test quoted in thread start) below was limited to East Pakistan?
- During 1970 and 1971, huge massacres were perpetrated upon Hindus, by the Pakistani army. A proper study into the casualty figures has never been conducted. Estimates for the number dead are up to 3 million. Millions of Hindu women were raped and kidnapped in this period. It was one of the largest massacres in recent history, and also one of the most ignored. *
Re: The genocide of Hindus in Pakistan
^ So you wanted to continue this thread as " Atrocities comitted by Pakistani Army against the East Pakistanis" but for that there is another thread on this forum. I wonder what made you start a new one.
Re: The genocide of Hindus in Pakistan
During 1970 and 1971, huge massacres were perpetrated upon Hindus, by the Pakistani army. A proper study into the casualty figures has never been conducted. Estimates for the number dead are up to 3 million. Millions of Hindu women were raped and kidnapped in this period. It was one of the largest massacres in recent history, and also one of the most ignored.
This is just getting absurd.
The most rabid Bangladeshi & Indian nationalists claim that 3,000,000 Bengalis were killed, and around 200,000 women were raped.
Now you want to claim that 3 million Hindus were killed, and millions of Hindu women were raped. Hindus made up like 15% of the population then...even if they were disproportionately targeted, and they made up 30% of the victims, that would mean that the Pakistani army killed 10 million people, and raped practically every woman in Bangladesh in the space of 9 months. Brilliant.
Also, let me just say how amused I am that you're sticking with this 3 million figure (well...you've now gone off the deep end and are quoting figures above and beyond even that). When I said that 50,000 Biharis were killed before the Pakistani army showed up, you accused me "just picking the death toll that suits my agenda best." You never bothered answering my follow-up question...why do Indians take Sheikh Mujib's 3 million figure as gospel truth? Didn't he have a vested interest in maximizing the Bengali casualties? What about the reports that Bangladeshi academics are claiming that Mujib's figure was mistranslated from 300,000 in the original Bengali to 3,000,000?
Re: The genocide of Hindus in Pakistan
During 1970 and 1971, huge massacres were perpetrated upon Hindus, by the Pakistani army. A proper study into the casualty figures has never been conducted. Estimates for the number dead are up to 3 million. Millions of Hindu women were raped and kidnapped in this period. It was one of the largest massacres in recent history, and also one of the most ignored.
Was there any proof of the claim made above. Where did the massacare took place? East Pakistan (Now Bangladesh) or West Pakistan. This web site just made up some figures and try to present them as facts.
I agree that the treatment of Hindus in Pakistan may not be at the highest level demanded by international Human rights conventions but issuing inflamatory statements without any solid evidence is also very wrong.
As far as the war of 1971 is concerned, International media puts the death toll in Bangladesh in 1971 from 200,000 to 3 million and I don't think that even if we come to the figure of 3 million, all of them were Hindus.
Actually the figure of 3 million is attributed to a comment by Yahya Khan to the journalist Robert Payne on February 22, 1971, "Kill three million of them, and the rest will eat out of our hands" and there is no proof that 3 million were actually killed.
Re: The genocide of Hindus in Pakistan
Jenab - the 3 million is in the quote from the article I quoted and certainly not something I have bought into. In fact the article itself says 'estimates up to 3M' and does not peg it at 3M.
Of course Mujib had a vested interest - just like people on the East Pakistan side had in publishing a smaller number. As usual the fact is probably somewhere in between
Re: The genocide of Hindus in Pakistan
:CareBear:, think twice while you write something like this
Re: The genocide of Hindus in Pakistan
Since StirCrasy seems to think that I approve of what the Pakistani army did in 1971, let me make something clear.
I dare you to find a post where I defended the atrocities carried out by the Pakistani army. I have (rightly) described their actions as genocidal in the past, and I do not have any doubt that an utterly obscene number of women were abducted and/or raped.
I have only taken issue with 2 ideas really...
1. That this was a Muslim vs. Hindu conflict. While there was no dearth of Hindu victims, I believe this was more an ethnic conflict, and the majority of both the victims and the perpetrators were Muslims unfortunately.
2. The acceptance of Sheikh Mujib's figures as gospel truth. I think Sheikh Mujib's figures are probably just as exaggerated as the Hamoodur Rehman Commission's are understated.
My earlier statements about Bengali atrocities against the Biharis prior to the Pakistani army's arrival were by no means an attempt to justify what happened later on.
Re: The genocide of Hindus in Pakistan
It is good to see that both sides agree on something here. Unfortunateluy it seems to require highly scaled genocide and. rape.
Whatt has maan made of maan.
I saw another huys were going at ticket price for paradise and one was asking for guidance on how to get promoted from rathood to mousehood to human
Seeing this thread he may want to remain in rathood and avoid any promotion!
Re: The genocide of Hindus in Pakistan
^your posts are always awesome to read:D
Re: The genocide of Hindus in Pakistan
The good news is that culprits have been caught. Read following news. Government should pay compensation to family of deceased.
http://www.dawn.com/2008/04/17/local1.htm
KARACHI: Three arrested for lynching co-worker
By Imran Ayub
KARACHI, April 16: Police have arrested three co-workers of Jagdeesh, who was beaten to death for allegedly making blasphemous remarks about Prophet Muhammad (Peace be upon him).
Initial findings compiled by the police suggested that Usman, Waqas and Hashim allegedly planned and provoked other workers to beat the member of the minority Hindu community to death outside their workplace in the Korangi Industrial Area.
“All the three workers absented themselves from work after the incident,” said an area police officer. “We came to know through questioning different co-workers of the victim and the management that initially these three men got involved in a discussion with the victim, which led to a brawl between them and others became involved in it.”
Jagdeesh Kumar, 22, was killed for allegedly making blasphemous remarks about Prophet Muhammad (Peace be upon him) on April 8. A resident of Mirpurkhas and staying in Lyari with his brother-in-law to earn a livelihood, Jagdeesh met the tragic incident which raised questions about the performance of police, who despite reaching the spot failed to prevent the workmen from beating their colleague to death.
Similarly, it also sent ripples of fears among hundreds of Hindu inhabitants at Marwari Mohalla in Lyari, who are not convinced of the alleged reason given by the police for Jagdeesh’s murder. They suspect the motive of the murder is beyond the one offered by the law-enforcers.
“It has never been an issue that we are Hindus and living in the middle of the majority Muslim population,” says Mina Kumari, a cook in her late 50s. Serving 100 per cent Muslim customers in shops at Jodia Bazaar, Ms Kumari like others feels there is more to it than meets the eye.
“We never felt strangers in this society. My business depends on Muslim clients, some of whom I have been serving for more than 20 years and they never made me feel that I am from a minority community. But incident like this one, if not investigated properly, may cast doubts over the future of our children in Pakistan.”
Kumari’s concerns matched the lines being followed by the law-enforcers while investigating the case, which was registered by the Korangi police station (FIR 207/2008) under Section 302 of the Pakistan Penal Code.
An area police official said that though the incident seemed a result of blasphemy, investigations were open and one could only find the motive behind the murder after the conclusion of the process.
“As we learned during the course of investigations that the incident took place after one of the arrested men was allegedly teased by Jagdeesh on religious grounds and it led to heated arguments between Jagdeesh and him, who was later joined by two other co-workers, later arrested by police,” he added.
He said though the police had arrested the workers on murder charges, none of the members from the victim’s family had approached the police station, neither law- enforcers had been able to contact any of Jagdeesh’s relatives, who are yet to return from Mirpurkhas after the funeral.
“But we are expecting them (Jadeesh’s family) within a week, which would help us expedite the investigations,” added the official.
Experts believe that in cases where motives of the murder are apparently described as a reaction against blasphemy, there is no provision in the law to charge such accused by people on their own.
“A person who takes the law into his own hands on the ground that he loses temper and can’t control his anger, can’t escape the charge,” said criminal lawyer Shahadat Awan.
He said the state was responsible for any law violated within its writ and in this particular case the suspects could be charged under Section 302 of the PPC for murder.
Re: The genocide of Hindus in Pakistan
Janab- lets look at Kashmir alone, which you claim to represent (though act & sound like a brainwashed Pakistani).
Hundreds of Thousands of Hindus forced out of their homes- living as refugees. Most pakistanis such as you, will claim this is not ethnic cleansing. Double faced as usual.
Re: The genocide of Hindus in Pakistan
Why?
In case you didn’t bother reading the thread title before you started whining, this is about Pakistan, which Kashmir is not a part of.
Blah blah blah…any Kashmiri who doesn’t believe in Indian imperialism is a “brainwashed Pakistani”
You Indians all sound the same after a while.
First of all, I’m Kashmiri, not Pakistani. You can be as childish and whiny as you want, it’s not going to change that fact.
Second, as I have repeatedly pointed out to you and your buddies, according to your own government’s census figures, there were all of 124,000 Pandits in Kashmir in 1981, not “hundreds of thousands.” Next thing you know, you people will be claiming that Kashmir had a Pandit majority till 1989 when “millions” of them were forced out :biggthumb
Third, I have always condemned the expulsion of the Pandits, as do the vast majority of Kashmiri Muslims. Everyone supports their return to the Valley. I also think the Indian government played a role in building up hysteria and sparking the mass exodus…and has done a deplorable job of rehabilitating the refugees in Jammu…preferring to keep them in tents and shanty-towns as museum pieces to legitimize the military occupation of Kashmir.
How ironic. You Indians whine ad nauseum about the plight of the Pandits, then turn around and send your soldiers in to butcher 70-100,000 Kashmiri civilians, make another 10,000 “disappear,” rape 10,000 women, imprison 16,000 young men on trumped up charges, destroy property worth millions of dollars…and you don’t give a rat’s ass about any of it. And then you have the audacity to talk about double standards.
Re: The genocide of Hindus in Pakistan
Ha! .. let's not maken an 'omelete' of a discussion here.
This issue, much like any debate on polticial or social issues, requires fundamental analysis, and a few rules to be laid out. First, remember that blood is blood whether of Muslims, Hindus, Christians or whatever. Second, two wrongs never make a right. Third, let's not bypass the limits of rationality, and answering an issue by questioning the questioner in terms of 'look what you did' is not always the right answer.
More later...