the following dialogue from the film mughal e azam is a great illustration of classical urdu’s beauty when spoken:
Sadaa kanindah: hukm huwa hai ke Anarkali divan-e-khaas mein haazir ho!
AKbar-e-Azam: humein yakin hai ke qaidkhanay ke khawfnaak andheroN ne teri aarzoo’on mein woh chamak baqi na rakkhee hogi jo kabhi thi!
Anarkali: Qaidkhanay ke andhere kaneez ki aarzoo’on ki roshni se kam thay!
AK: andhere aur baRhaa diya jaayeinge!
An: aarzu’ein aur baRh jaayeingee!
AK; Aur baRhti huwee aarzu’on ko kuchal diya jaayega!
An: aur zill e ilahi ka insaaf?
Ak: Hum ik lafz sun-na nahin chahitay! Akbar ka insaaf uska hukm hai! Tujhe Salim ko bhoolna hoga!
An: Bhoolna hoga?
Ak: Yaqeenan! Aur sirf itna hi nahin! Usse yeh bhi yaqeen dilana hoga ke tujhe us se kabhi muhabbat nahin thi!
An: Jo zabaan unke saamne muhabbat ka iqraar tak na kar saki ho woh inkaar kaisay karegee?
Ak:
tujhe Salim paR ZAHIR KARNA HOGA KE TERI MUHABBAT JHOOTI THI. ik kaneez ne hindustan ke malika banne ki aarzu ki aur muhabbat ka khoobsurat bahana dhoond liya!
An: yeh sach nahin hai! Khuda gawah hai yeh sach nahin hai! Yeh sach nahin hai…
Ak: Lekin tujhe sabit karna hoga ke YEHI sach hai!
An: Parwardigar mujhe itni himmat atta farmaa ke main sahib e aalam se baywafai kar sakoon. kaneez zill e ilaahi ka hukm bajaa laane ki koshish karegi!
Ak: Koshish nahin taameel hogi! Isse azaad kardiya jaaye!!
------from Mughal e Azam!
muhabatein theen kabhi apne dermian kitni…
bicha gaye hai anna hum mein doorian kitni…
abhi to toota hai dil hi teri judai mein…
girein gi hum pe abhi aur bijlian kitni…
Muzna ji–aap ne bajaa farmaaya…it is a most beautiful and elegant and ** polite ** language. Can you imagine such a powerful confrontation as the one i wrote down from Mughal e Azam being so polite in any other language [apart from Arabic and Farsi]?!
Tanhaa–you are right. But I thought there were governmental level efforts to revive Urdu in India? Agar Lakhnaw hi mein Urdu na rehe tau afsos, sadd afsos…aamad e aaftaab, daleel e aaftaab…
I remember reading a book on Pakistan by an American female journalist who lived their in the late 80s and one thing she mentioned was the sheer pleasure she felt in just listening to people speak Urdu. She said it was a joy to hear two people arguing in nafees Urdu and she contrasted that with a similar disagreement in Punjabi!!
In Urdu you would say, “mujhe tujh se yeh umeed nahin thi”; in Punjabi she said a person similarly offended would probably call the other a pehnch**!
The Government does promote Urdu. But its needs the media and especially the writers of songs , movies etc to keep the language alive.
Last year I visited India and attended the Urdu Promotion Exhibition held on Lal Qila grounds. I bought a lot of books and saw some historical Mogul dcouments with signatures of Mirza Ghalib, Shah Jahan , Babur etc. I was so carried away in the past. I visited Mirza Ghalibs house in gali Balli Maraan, Chandni chowk. I wish I could die and be born in 1800's during time of Ghalib, Momin, Mir, Zauq etc. Vo tha zamana !! Lekin vo Delhi ab kahaan !! Now its all western Bu*****t everywhere.
Asif, I was waiting in this thread for a Punjabi to dish his mother tongue to sing kaseedas of Urdu. You won the award.
You are comparing the conversation between kings in Urdu with an argument between two rickshaw walas in front of Bhatti Gate.
Let me say this, Every dirty word that we have in Punjabi, an equivalent of it exists in Urdu/Hindi....and many of them are very close variations. I am sure Punjabi speakers being Dhaggay and dumb did not invent them but borrowed it from some more refined species.
My intention was not to insult or mock Punjabi–after all I am a Punjabi–and it is a beautiful language too (and the kaafi’s of Baba Bullhe Shah and Hazrat Mian Muhammad Bakhsh’s Sayful Malook etc. are evidence that its best literature is on a par with anything in the world); my point was the usage of it by common folk who speak it compared with common folk who speak Urdu…
The only difference I find is that refined Urdu speakers don't use those words.<<
I believe refined Punjabi speakers don't use them either.
It is more of a matter what environment the conversation is going on...e.g. sometimes weeks pass that I don't say any of such words in my speech but then sometimes I am in the company of my close friends and males only having fun....telling dirty jokes and using foul language. I have seen some well refined english, hindi and urdu speakers do the same in these situations.
So my contention is that it is status of the person making the conversation and the environment and tone of the conversation that decides the verbiage not that a certain language is dirty or not-refined.
On the other hand I do believe that Punjabi language and character is more direct in its approach. If you hate someone you say it loudly on the face,not have a chhuri in the baghal and do raam raam, soft praise and nice words like in the conversation in the original post. No matter how refined the language is the order is being given to ruin and kill someone....
Refined vacublary is more often used not to convey the true feelings but to hide them.
I was reading Josh's "Yaadoon ki baraat" and was surprised to see his usage of galiyaan....coz Josh was a person who was well-known among the literary circle for his zabaan'dani, tehzeeb n shaistgi.....
So refined or unrefined, everyone galifies...bus zara andaz ka farq hei. An unrefined punjabi jat like chan ji will say, "oye tu baRa paynchod ay", and a refined nawaab like Josh will say the samething like, "qibla aap tou baRe behnchod hein".....aur sun'ne wale ko ghussay ke bajaye pyaar aa jaaye ga....
shaid aisay refined galibaazoon hi ke liay ghalib sahib farma ge hein....
"kitne shirin hein tere lab ke raqeeb
galiyaan kha ke bemaza na hova"
Ciao
Naik
ps> and a refined punjabi like Asif will be extra careful and instead of using complete word will say something like this..."tum bare pehnch** ho"....
bari moqa-shanas ho kaki naik…message bhi post ker dia aur galian bhi de dein halankai inka yahan koi kaam nahin tha lakin kia kahain…akhir naik ki post hai…naikian bhi to kamani hein…
muhabatein theen kabhi apne dermian kitni…
bicha gaye hai anna hum mein doorian kitni…
abhi to toota hai dil hi teri judai mein…
girein gi hum pe abhi aur bijlian kitni…
An unrefined punjabi jat like chan ji will say, "oye tu baRa paynchod ay", and a refined nawaab like Josh will say the samething like, "qibla aap tou baRe behnchod hein".....aur sun'ne wale ko ghussay ke bajaye pyaar aa jaaye ga....
Naik ji, tuhada tay pata naee par saanooN tay phair vee Chann tay ee payar aayay ga.
[This message has been edited by Roman (edited August 28, 2001).]
yes i feel urdu is one of the finest languages in the universe but it has seen a decline over last 50 years
the partition of the subcontinent also hurt urdu and esp
the younger generation of muslims in india seem to be getting further and further away from urdu this is very tragic it was due to the policies of hindu leaders that urdu is on decline
anyways there is a new chanel on tv in urdu from hyderabad deccan (india) and it has that sweet deccanised urdu in it .so urdu might just get the much needed boost
so perhaps the picture is not gloomy as one might fear .but i pray that it does not get any worse
I completely agree with what you have stated about the differences and similarities of Punjabi and Urdu.
Urdu is a beautiful language no doubt, though i don’t think the majority of the urdu speakers speak such refined Urdu on a daily basis. I guess that exists in other languages as well. I don’t think any comparisons should be made between Urdu and Punjabi. Both have forms that are highly elegant. I’ve heard very beautiful shaista punjabi as well as Urdu. And have heard the not so ‘shaista’ version of both too.
What’s the exception? I didn’t say that refined Punjabi speakers use them. Please don’t put words where they aren’t and I will try to be more precise in how I say what I think.
I have had very little exposure to Punjabi speaking people in day to day life, at least when compared to the exposure that most participants in this thread have had. But even then, the Punjabi that I have witnessed has been very, very sweet…it has always given off an air of “apna-pan”.
Note: I will leave Azkar out of this equation/statement.
......An unrefined punjabi jat like chan ji will say, "oye tu baRa paynchod ay", and a refined nawaab like Josh will say the samething like, "qibla aap tou baRe behnchod hein".....
**
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