Re: Telll me something ...
Taking care of parents???? soooo 19th century!
Re: Telll me something ...
Print this and hand it over to the guy.**
Quran**
And (remember) when We took a covenant from the Children of Israel, (saying): Worship none but Allah (Alone) and be dutiful and good to parents, and to kindred, and to orphans and Al-Masakeen (the poor), (Tafsir At-Tabaree, Vol. 10, Page 158 (Verse 9:60)) and speak good to people (i.e. enjoin righteousness and forbid evil, and say the truth about Muhammad Peace be upon him ), and perform As-Salat (Iqamat-as-Salat), and give Zakat. Then you slid back, except a few of you, while you are backsliders. (Tafsir Al-Qurtubee, Vol. 2, Page 392).
( سورة البقرة , Al-Baqara, Chapter #2, Verse #83)
They ask you (O Muhammad SAW) what they should spend. Say: Whatever you spend of good must be for parents and kindred and orphans and AlMasakin (the poor) and the wayfarers, and whatever you do of good deeds, truly, Allah knows it well.
( سورة البقرة , Al-Baqara, Chapter #2, Verse #215)
Worship Allah and join none with Him in worship,** and do good to parents**, kinsfolk, orphans, Al-Masakin (the poor), the neighbour who is near of kin, the neighbour who is a stranger, the companion by your side, the wayfarer (you meet), and those (slaves) whom your right hands possess. Verily, Allah does not like such as are proud and boastful;
( سورة النساء , An-Nisa, Chapter #4, Verse #36)
Say (O Muhammad SAW): "Come, I will recite what your Lord has prohibited you from: Join not anything in worship with Him; be good and dutiful to your parents; kill not your children because of poverty - We provide sustenance for you and for them; come not near to Al-Fawahish (shameful sins, illegal sexual intercourse, etc.) whether committed openly or secretly, and kill not anyone whom Allah has forbidden, except for a just cause (according to Islamic law). This He has commanded you that you may understand.
( سورة الأنعام , Al-Anaam, Chapter #6, Verse #151)
Our Lord! Forgive me and my parents, and (all) the believers on the Day when the reckoning will be established."
( سورة إبراهيم , Ibrahim, Chapter #14, Verse #41)
And your Lord has decreed that you worship none but Him. *And that you be dutiful to your parents. If one of them or both of them attain old age in your life, say not to them a word of disrespect, nor shout at them but address them in terms of honour. *
( سورة الإسراء , Al-Isra, Chapter #17, Verse #23)
And We have enjoined on man to be good and dutiful to his parents, but if they strive to make you join with Me (in worship) anything (as a partner) of which you have no knowledge, then obey them not. Unto Me is your return, and I shall tell you what you used to do.
( سورة العنكبوت , Al-Ankaboot, Chapter #29, Verse #8)
*And We have enjoined on man (to be dutiful and good) to his parents. His mother bore him in weakness and hardship upon weakness and hardship, and his weaning is in two years give thanks to Me and to your parents, unto Me is the final destination. *
( سورة لقمان , Luqman, Chapter #31, Verse #14)
And We have enjoined on man to be dutiful and kind to his parents. His mother bears him with hardship and she brings him forth with hardship, and the bearing of him, and the weaning of him is thirty (30) months, till when he attains full strength and reaches forty years, he says: "My Lord! Grant me the power and ability that I may be grateful for Your Favour which You have bestowed upon me and upon my parents, and that I may do righteous good deeds, such as please You, and make my off-spring good. Truly, I have turned to You in repentance, and truly, I am one of the Muslims (submitting to Your Will)."
( سورة الأحقاف , Al-Ahqaf, Chapter #46, Verse #15)
"My Lord! Forgive me, and my parents, and him who enters my home as a believer, and all the believing men and women. And to the Zalimoon (polytheists, wrong-doers, and disbelievers, etc.) grant You no increase but destruction!"
( سورة نوح , Nooh, Chapter #71, Verse #28)
Hadiths
Disobedience to parents is a major sin
Anas narrated from Prophet Muhammad about the major sins. He (Mohammed) observed: Associating anyone with God, disobedience to parents, killing a person and false utterance. (Muslim)
One of the dearest deeds to God is being good & dutiful to parents
Narrated 'Abdullah: I asked the Prophet "Which deed is the dearest to God?" He replied, "To offer the prayers at their early stated fixed times." I asked, "What is the next (in goodness)?" He replied, "To be good and dutiful to your parents"...(Bukhari)
Being dutiful to parents is one of the keys to enter Paradise
Abu Huraira reported Prophet Muhammad as saying: Let him be humbled into dust; let him be humbled into dust. It was said: God's Messenger, who is he? He said: He who sees either of his parents during their old age or he sees both of them, but he does not enter Paradise (because he has been undutiful to them). (Muslim)
Acts of kindness we can do for our parents after their death
While we were with Prophet Muhammad of God . A man of Banu Salmah came to Him and said: Apostle of God is there any kindness left that I can do to my parents after their death? He replied: Yes, you can invoke blessings on them, forgiveness for them, carry out their final instructions after their death, join ties of relationship which are dependent on them, and honour their friends. (Abu Dawood)
The High Status given to Mothers
A man came to the Prophet and asked him for permission to join a military expedition. The Prophet asked him if he had a mother, and when he replied that he had, he said, "Stay with her, for Paradise is at her feet." (Ahmad)
Re: Telll me something ...
^Being dutiful and obeying are two different things. As an adult, you are not asked to obey your parents. You should still care for them in their old age.
I agree with the poster's friend to an extent. I don't believe parents should consider their kids as their retirement plan. That's horrible! This is the reason why our culture is failing so miserably, every set of parents wants a boy so he can take care of them when they get old. Isn't that selfish? This however doesn't mean a child should forget what his/her parents have done for him/her. Unfortunately, in our culture a woman is asked to do just that. I just laugh when I see Desi men getting all emotional thinking about their parents but are completely insensitive towards a woman that feels the same way about hers.
Hypocrites.
Re: Telll me something ...
^ We have been asked to obey our parents unless they are asking something against Islam. There is no distinction of adult or kids in that.
Re: Telll me something ...
^Yes, I have only heard that from Desi scholars/mullahs and of course it's obvious why. I also only hear this from desi scholars that woman must live with inlaws if her husband asks her to do so because she must obey him. They will also show you Ahadith where it's ok for a man to divorce his wife if his parents are asking him to do so.. Parents are humans too and are capable of making the same mistakes. Let's not have this mentality that they are wiser than everybody else..
They have twisted it to their liking and taught the rest of us the same BS and it clearly shows here...
P.S. show me a single reference from the Quran that says an adult must obey his/her parents. It's not a challenge, I simply don't believe it's there.
Re: Telll me something ...
Do not jump to another topic of in-laws/bahoo we can surly discuss that in another thread. Here, we are talking child-parent relationship. BTW, I dont disagree with you on inlaws and divorce matter but I dont think you are right on this issue.
Here is the translation of Ayat 8 of Surat Al-ankabut (#29). I am posting translation by multiple ulmas including desi and non-desi (who you trust more perhaps? ). Person is instructed only to disobey their parents if they are asking for anything un-islamic. Everyone has used the word 'Obey' in their translation. This is just one quick search btw.
[INDENT=2]Sahih International
And We have enjoined upon man goodness to parents. But if they endeavor to make you associate with Me that of which you have no knowledge, do not obey them. To Me is your return, and I will inform you about what you used to do.[/INDENT]
[INDENT=2]Muhsin Khan
And We have enjoined on man to be good and dutiful to his parents, but if they strive to make you join with Me (in worship) anything (as a partner) of which you have no knowledge, then obey them not. Unto Me is your return, and I shall tell you what you used to do.[/INDENT]
[INDENT=2]Pickthall
We have enjoined on man kindness to parents; but if they strive to make thee join with Me that of which thou hast no knowledge, then obey them not. Unto Me is your return and I shall tell you what ye used to do.[/INDENT]
[INDENT=2]Yusuf Ali
We have enjoined on man kindness to parents: but if they (either of them) strive (to force) thee to join with Me (in worship) anything of which thou hast no knowledge, obey them not. Ye have (all) to return to me, and I will tell you (the truth) of all that ye did.[/INDENT]
[INDENT=2]Shakir
And We have enjoined on man goodness to his parents, and if they contend with you that you should associate (others) with Me, of which you have no knowledge, do not obey them, to Me is your return, so I will inform you of what you did.[/INDENT]
[INDENT=2]Dr. Ghali
And We have enjoined upon man the fair (companionship) to his parents; and in case they strive with you to make you associate with Me that whereof you have no knowledge, then do not obey them. To Me will be your return, then I will (fully) inform you of whatever you were doing.
[/INDENT]
Re: Telll me something ...
^Well, it goes hand in hand that's why I mentioned it. I know that verse. Again, it doesn't say an adult child needs to obey his/her parents. They are asked to be dutiful. Like I said, i don't believe it exists.
Re: Telll me something ...
Law of being desi #12312312: only a man's parents matter and count. Not a woman's. :)
Re: Telll me something ...
^Well, it goes hand in hand that's why I mentioned it. I know that verse. Again, it doesn't say an adult child needs to obey his/her parents. They are asked to be dutiful. Like I said, i don't believe it exists.
It says do not obey them if they are instructing against Islam - doesn't that mean obey them in rest of the cases eh?
well to me it does and its not coming from some 'desi mullah' as you stated. Its the true translation of Quran.
Anyway, lets agree to disagree :)
Re: Telll me something ...
Most non-desi scholars agree that adults in Islam don't have to obey their aging parents. It makes no sense to...because as they age, they lose their ability to think clearly and make proper decisions. BUT you still need to be respectful. Desis are fed way too much crap about this... that's my only point and it's causing the downfall of our nation.
Re: Telll me something ...
I am not a scholar but as a general faithful/good person, my opinion is that Islam instructs people to be gentle, kind, and respectful to parents. But a person can have a difference of opinion with them, in that case use tact and patience and never disrespect them.
Allah wants us to take care of them, occasionally cook what they like, make tea for them, go for walks with them, chitchat with them, include them in our decisions, put oil in their head, and take care of their financial needs without them saying it, clean their room/house if they are too old. Just be available to their needs, dont neglect them. It's our duty.
Re: Telll me something ...
The topic here is taking care of parents and not obeying them "blindly". I myself didnt agree to my dad when he asked me to accept a proposal that i received at home. I gave him my reasons, but he was still insistent. I threw my weapons coz i couldnt see him requesting to me any more. But Allah was seeing and He for sure knows everything. He helped me, that guy made an excuse and marriage was called off.
As someone rightly said in 1st or 2nd post that parents are capable of taking care of ten kids, but ten kids mostly fail to take care of two old individuals. Coz when the ten kids grow up they start fighting like us, talking about being desi and non-desi, look up for Quran and Ahadith references, try to look up for all those references which can minimize our duties towards our old parents. This is sad and pathatic and this is actually causing the downfall of our nation. We do not realise our duties and responsibilites. Respecting your parents, keeping them dear, taking care of them, being gentle to them and obeying them where ever possible, refusing them without hurting them, is not the cause of the downfall.
As far as the argument on woman's parents and man's parents is concerned. Again, for god sake, wrong is wrong and it will always remain wrong, regardless it is a desi who is wrong or a non-desi. People from all communities have these differences. There are those people in this world too, who do not discriminate. I can quote examples from my own family, my parents attitude towards there parents in laws, my married sisters treatment to their prents in laws. I have never heard my parents saying anything bad about each other parents. Though my daadi (Late) was a typical Saas. I remember if we ever tried to complain to Mom that Daadi tou bas aisi hein ..... she would tell us to shut our mouths, because daadi bari hein.
I think it all comes down to what you see around you, i.e. near you, within your families. Coz thats the place from where you get all these initial basic ideas, which are hard to change later in life. Who knows that this guy have seen his parents doing the same with their parents. What goes around comes around eh? Or as someone here said, wife taught him all that crap. but that you wont want to believe coz she is not a desi but a gori.
Someone said here, not a good idea to consider their kids their retirement plan. Excuse me??? so you can suck their blood when u were growing up, you needed money for your education, food, picnics, college trips, parties, books, birthdays and everything, not to forget money for that fake life style that maintained infront of your friends. But now when they cannot earn any more, and expects from you that it is ur turn to help them, you will push them away? wow ... yeh kahan ka insaaf hai? and which non-desi community has taught you this?
I have not spoken to that guy again. he is not a friend or anything. I told him what I wanted to tell. I hope I gave him something to think about.
Re: Telll me something ...
Theorist's point is right, we have to treat parents with respect but not obey them just for the sake of it (I hear plenty of desi scholars even say if you want to marry someone but your parents object due to race or their personal preference you have to give that person up to keep them happy - NOT true, it's their duty to say 'yes' unless it's a matter of bad character or something serious.. Another obvious example is that thing about how a son must put his mother over his wife.. Of course the mother has many rights but her rights mustn't infringe on the rights of the DIlL or others.. it's also common decency)..
All this putting parents and husbands on a huge pedestal seems to come more from old Hindu culture imo.. Islam recognises the fact that parents can sometimes be wrong or oppressive hence we can appoint another wali/guardian to replace them if they're not doing a good enough job..
When it comes to parents in old age there's no straightforward answer, some should live with their son or daughter + their families, some prefer not to (we used to have a very old neighbour who was a widow and lived on her own in a six bed home, her family would pop in and see her every day and she told my dad it was her choice as she liked having that feeling of independence).. Each to their own.. I don't think there's anything wrong with parents living alone if they're healthy and content and I don't necessarily think you have to live with a parent to look after them either..
Re: Telll me something ...
Most non-desi scholars agree that adults in** Islam **don't have to obey their aging parents. It makes no sense to...because as they age, they lose their ability to think clearly and make proper decisions. BUT you still need to be respectful. Desis are fed way too much crap about this... that's my only point and it's causing the downfall of our nation.
Does it really matters??i thought you are an athiest.
Re: Telll me something ...
The topic here is taking care of parents and not obeying them "blindly". I myself didnt agree to my dad when he asked me to accept a proposal that i received at home. I gave him my reasons, but he was still insistent. I threw my weapons coz i couldnt see him requesting to me any more. But Allah was seeing and He for sure knows everything. He helped me, that guy made an excuse and marriage was called off.
As someone rightly said in 1st or 2nd post that parents are capable of taking care of ten kids, but ten kids mostly fail to take care of two old individuals. Coz when the ten kids grow up they start fighting like us, talking about being desi and non-desi, look up for Quran and Ahadith references, try to look up for all those references which can minimize our duties towards our old parents. This is sad and pathatic and this is actually causing the downfall of our nation. We do not realise our duties and responsibilites. Respecting your parents, keeping them dear, taking care of them, being gentle to them and obeying them where ever possible, refusing them without hurting them, is not the cause of the downfall.
As far as the argument on woman's parents and man's parents is concerned. Again, for god sake, wrong is wrong and it will always remain wrong, regardless it is a desi who is wrong or a non-desi. People from all communities have these differences. There are those people in this world too, who do not discriminate. I can quote examples from my own family, my parents attitude towards there parents in laws, my married sisters treatment to their prents in laws. I have never heard my parents saying anything bad about each other parents. Though my daadi (Late) was a typical Saas. I remember if we ever tried to complain to Mom that Daadi tou bas aisi hein ..... she would tell us to shut our mouths, because daadi bari hein.
I think it all comes down to what you see around you, i.e. near you, within your families. Coz thats the place from where you get all these initial basic ideas, which are hard to change later in life. Who knows that this guy have seen his parents doing the same with their parents. What goes around comes around eh? Or as someone here said, wife taught him all that crap. but that you wont want to believe coz she is not a desi but a gori.
Someone said here, not a good idea to consider their kids their retirement plan. Excuse me??? so you can suck their blood when u were growing up, you needed money for your education, food, picnics, college trips, parties, books, birthdays and everything, not to forget money for that fake life style that maintained infront of your friends. But now when they cannot earn any more, and expects from you that it is ur turn to help them, you will push them away? wow ... yeh kahan ka insaaf hai? and which non-desi community has taught you this?
I have not spoken to that guy again. he is not a friend or anything. I told him what I wanted to tell. I hope I gave him something to think about.
FAIL!
You see we keep coming back to the same point. We WILL never see it as a genuine concern until desi men start respecting how women feel and let us bring our parents along to take care of them. Then maybe we can both cry about this other guy that does not care about his parents like you do!
P.S. Yes, I get upset and jealous because I am doing everything for his parents that I can do for my own but I can't! It's bound to piss anyone off..:)
Re: Telll me something ...
[quote="FairyTale"]
The topic here is taking care of parents and not obeying them "blindly". I myself didnt agree to my dad when he asked me to accept a proposal that i received at home. I gave him my reasons, but he was still insistent. I threw my weapons coz i couldnt see him requesting to me any more. But Allah was seeing and He for sure knows everything. He helped me, that guy made an excuse and marriage was called off.
As someone rightly said in 1st or 2nd post that parents are capable of taking care of ten kids, but ten kids mostly fail to take care of two old individuals. Coz when the ten kids grow up they start fighting like us, talking about being desi and non-desi, look up for Quran and Ahadith references, try to look up for all those references which can minimize our duties towards our old parents. This is sad and pathatic and this is actually causing the downfall of our nation. We do not realise our duties and responsibilites. Respecting your parents, keeping them dear, taking care of them, being gentle to them and obeying them where ever possible, refusing them without hurting them, is not the cause of the downfall.
:) plus parents dont go around searching for ahadiths and ayats whether or not they should take care of their children. If they have bestowed so much LOVE on me, i almost feel like obeying them blindly.
Re: Telll me something ...
Theorist's point is right, we have to treat parents with respect but not obey them just for the sake of it (I hear plenty of desi scholars even say if you want to marry someone but your parents object due to race or their personal preference you have to give that person up to keep them happy - NOT true, it's their duty to say 'yes' unless it's a matter of bad character or something serious.. Another obvious example is that thing about how a son must put his mother over his wife.. Of course the mother has many rights but her rights mustn't infringe on the rights of the DIlL or others.. it's also common decency)..
All this putting parents and husbands on a huge pedestal seems to come more from old Hindu culture imo.. Islam recognises the fact that parents can sometimes be wrong or oppressive hence we can appoint another wali/guardian to replace them if they're not doing a good enough job..
When it comes to parents in old age there's no straightforward answer, some should live with their son or daughter + their families, some prefer not to (we used to have a very old neighbour who was a widow and lived on her own in a six bed home, her family would pop in and see her every day and she told my dad it was her choice as she liked having that feeling of independence).. Each to their own.. I don't think there's anything wrong with parents living alone if they're healthy and content and I don't necessarily think you have to live with a parent to look after them either..
From where have you quoted this??? Seriously i have heard this lines first time in my life???
Re: Telll me something ...
^This is exactly what I mean when I say Desis are spoon fed things that are non existent outside of our culture and they wrongfully attribute to the religion os Islam - not that I am much impressed by either one. I am just saying..
I love my parents to death. The point is parents are humans just like you and me some will make good decisions other will make bad ones. It's their decision to have children, they are responsible for raising THEIR children because THEY had them. THey are not responsible for keeping you with them after you are old enough to take care of yourself. As adults, you are not responsible for them but SHOULD take care of them in their old age. use common sense and basic humanity principles. If you need a religion to tell you that.. well I don't have much hope for you..
Re: Telll me something ...
Cutefifa, it's if they aren't giving you ur rights/treat u badly eg. don't let u marry someone because of his/her race or something.. Also it is supposed to go according to some order (I can't remember how exactly but you go to the next male relative - perhaps brother or uncle or something and then in the end if they are all useless you can appoint an imam to do the job.. will have to look up the exact details.. There are exceptions to needing a wali for marriage anyway that depend on your personal circumstances and which madhab you follow eg according to **Hanafi **fiqh u technically don't even need your guardian's permission to marry someone 'legally suitable' altho obviously this is discouraged - a fact that desi culture likes to hide as it means parents losing complete control over their daughter's choice of partner)..
Re: Telll me something ...
^This is exactly what I mean when I say Desis are spoon fed things that are non existent outside of our culture and they wrongfully attribute to the religion os Islam - not that I am much impressed by either one. I am just saying..
I love my parents to death. The point is parents are humans just like you and me some will make good decisions other will make bad ones. It's their decision to have children, they are responsible for raising THEIR children because THEY had them. THey are not responsible for keeping you with them after you are old enough to take care of yourself. As adults, you are not responsible for them but SHOULD take care of them in their old age. use common sense and basic humanity principles. If you need a religion to tell you that.. well I don't have much hope for you..
I get what you are trying to say.
Why does it matter though if Islam says 'obey' OR 'dutiful'?
Bottomline is you are going to gain tons of rewards and inshAllah Jannah, if you take care of your parents. Doesn't matter how or why - whether out of duty, love, religion, or humanity.
If you listen to your parents (even if you don't want to do what they are asking of you too) and they become really happy from you and give you lots of duas, then it doesnt even matter if you did smtng for them out of obeying them or out of duty.
Now, who cares why you are doing it..whether its love, religion, humanity.
Just keep them happy, feel loved and respected. Doesnt matter how or why.