Re: Swiss voters 'back ban on building of minarets'
Think...think about the ideology of the right wing parties, and then think hard over you're views on minorities, and then perhaps, just perhaps, you might get the whole picture, either that, or you'll end up lamenting you're petty brown existance for ever.
Think...think about the ideology of the right wing parties, and then think hard over you're views on minorities, and then perhaps, just perhaps, you might get the whole picture, either that, or you'll end up lamenting you're petty brown existance for ever.
I do get the whole picture and i know very well that this whole minerat issue is raised specially in europe as the hositility is more towards non-white immigration there than islam per se ....but ur attitude towards this issue is highly partisan as u take this as a debate, and thats what irks me ...if muslims cannot be objective and free of bias themselves how can they expect others to be
^^
Mind your language. It just shows your upbringing.
LMAO! And your defense of racist ideologies shows yours. Intriguing when faced with facts that is your only response.
Re: Swiss voters 'back ban on building of minarets'
^^
Racism is a matter of perception, but for your comments I need not look no further than the gutter.
Re: Swiss voters 'back ban on building of minarets'
Yes and your perspective racist against Muslims. Note that whenever Muslim human rights are violated you actually support the violation.
Lets put it in perspective. The EU has stated its a violation of Basic Human rights. The Swiss government is shocked and dismayed by what happened. YET YOU DEFEND IT!
Bottom Line
It is OK for Mulsim countries to be non -secular while it is not OK for non-muslim countries.
Not really.
What's not kosher here is the on-the-fly redefinition of what is okay and permissible within the confines of secular cultures. This too, as a reaction to a specific community, not as a reflection on the deeper meaning of what is and is not "secular".
Where your example falls flat is that Muslim restrictions, whatever they are, have been in place and are pretty much constant.
Whereas in Europe, we are seeing a wild mood swing from embracing multli-culturalism to the outright vilification of a particular religious minority.
The ban on Hijab and Minaraets is not about conformity to established social norms or mores; it's an on-going redefinition of them in favor of xenophobic sentiment that targets the most visible of visible minorities.
And I have no doubt that the issue does not extends beyond this superficial edifice. It's not really about assimilation, as there are probably a multitude of things to ban prior to minars if this were the case. Nor is it about safeguarding rights, as it's hard to imagine what right is being trampled on by an architectural feature of a building.
So if it is a double standard to hold others to their own beliefs and ideologies, then I suppose those criticizing the ban are guilty as charged. And better off for it, too.
Yes and your perspective racist against Muslims. Note that whenever Muslim human rights are violated you actually support the violation.
Lets put it in perspective. The EU has stated its a violation of Basic Human rights. The Swiss government is shocked and dismayed by what happened. YET YOU DEFEND IT!
Whenever non-muslim's human rights are violated in muslim countries, there is no body to condemn it. As I said before it is OK for SA to not allow construction of churches and temples. It is OK for Pakistan to have blasphemy laws which are grossly misused, while it is not OK for Switzerland to prevent construction of certain structures.
Re: Swiss voters 'back ban on building of minarets'
Stick to the topic at hand. See you always go back to your racist comments on Muslims whenever you can't defend your logic.
The Eu said it was a violation of human rights.
The Swiss government is shocked and upset by it.
YET YOU DEFEND IT!
You know, that s a tad rich coming from someone whose house is so broke, its full of horses crap....yet we dont see it stopping you or anyone else complaining of minorities in other countries. Oh the glory....of hypocrisy. Must be pretty comfy, sitting high on that throne of sh1t eh?
If my house is full of horses crap, yours is constructed from a rotting horse carcass. You defend your beloved terrorist and intolerant state of Iran which prosecutes religious minorities and anyone who dare disagree with their terrorist regime. When you defend such heinous actions (and actually pretend it isn't even true) you have no creditability when whining about treatment of minorities in other countries. Talk about hypocrisy. Talk about full of shi!T.
^ Seminole, do you not consider Muslims living in the West citizens of the West? Could you explain why you're talking about "fix your own", do you assume that everyone criticizing this is a non-resident alien, or do you think that the West really isnt home for its Muslim citizens, and that they really belong elsewhere that they should go fix first.
Having said that, do you think it is a fair argument for a white supremacist in pre-civil rights era to deny blacks rights on the basis that things are so bad in Ethiopia, why dont you criticize that first.
I wasn't talking about everyone, I was specifically referring to the hypocritical poster defends fascist, intolerant and racist regimes and then acts indignant over incidents like this. I am all for people of any faith having places to worship in no matter what country they live.
Regardless, the Ethiopian example doesn't compute since blacks did not have a choice in coming to America. Ethnic Muslims are CHOOSING to live in areas where the entrenched culture is secular, Christian and different in so many different ways.
This post is about Swiss and not french.. i know it is hard for you to stay on topic and discuss stuff but when you quote someone try to reply in the context of discussion... hint check the original post you quoted...
Then maybe you should have clarified it.
As for the Swiss Flag....it has a cross due it being a predominately christian country just like Secular Turkey has a Crescent
So deal with it.
Not really.
What's not kosher here is the on-the-fly redefinition of what is okay and permissible within the confines of secular cultures. This too, as a reaction to a specific community, not as a reflection on the deeper meaning of what is and is not "secular".
Where your example falls flat is that Muslim restrictions, whatever they are, have been in place and are pretty much constant.
Whereas in Europe, we are seeing a wild mood swing from embracing multli-culturalism to the outright vilification of a particular religious minority.
The ban on Hijab and Minaraets is not about conformity to established social norms or mores; it's an on-going redefinition of them in favor of xenophobic sentiment that targets the most visible of visible minorities.
And I have no doubt that the issue does not extends beyond this superficial edifice. It's not really about assimilation, as there are probably a multitude of things to ban prior to minars if this were the case. Nor is it about safeguarding rights, as it's hard to imagine what right is being trampled on by an architectural feature of a building.
So if it is a double standard to hold others to their own beliefs and ideologies, then I suppose those criticizing the ban are guilty as charged. And better off for it, too.
No one is embracing multi-culturalism in Europe.
Its been shoved down the European's throats. Europe is not a multi-cultural continent unlike North America.
I perfectly understand why Europeans are getting angry when these backward, uneducated, illegal immigrants move into Europe and start bringing their own culture contaminating Europe.
How would Pakistanis feel if millions of Africans moved into Pakistan and started building their place of Worship, forming ghettos, harassing pakistani girls, committing most of the crime, plotting terrorist attacks, riots, etc....
Pakis would hate them and will vote for people who want to kick them out.
Sorry, But I dont want to see Europe being turned into a middle eastern hell hole.
[quote]
If my house is full of horses crap, yours is constructed from a rotting horse carcass.[/qoute]
yet tis not me towing the line 'fix your own house first'. As per your 'logic', you may aswell sew your lips up now...we shouldnt hear a peep, thankfully i do not prescribe to such rubbish, hence i am not bound by such indoctrinations.
[quote]
You defend your beloved terrorist and intolerant state of **AMERICA **which prosecutes religious minorities and anyone who dare disagree with their terrorist regime. When you defend such heinous actions (and actually pretend it isn't even true) you have no creditability when whining about treatment of minorities in other countries. Talk about hypocrisy. Talk about full of shi!T.
[/quote]
There, now that makes much more sense.
I wasn't talking about everyone, I was specifically referring to the hypocritical poster defends fascist, intolerant and racist regimes and then acts indignant over incidents like this. I am all for people of any faith having places to worship in no matter what country they live.
Here is what you said:
And other posters are right, until Muslim countries allow religious freedoms, houses of worship for non-Muslims and equality for all, then it is really hypocritical and nonsensical to expect it in other countries. Maybe if you fix your own, more deeply broken houses, you will be treated with more respect elsewhere.
Can you defend this statement? Seems pretty unequivocal in the approach Muslims should have regardless of whichever poster you were referring to.
So do you think Muslims should fix 'their own houses' before complaining about religious freedoms or not?
[quote]
Regardless, the Ethiopian example doesn't compute since blacks did not have a choice in coming to America. Ethnic Muslims are CHOOSING to live in areas where the entrenched culture is secular, Christian and different in so many different ways.
[/QUOTE]
Not really. It can be said of immigrants but many of these Muslims complaining are second/third generation. They didnt really make a choice did they?
And even allowing for choice.. you can choose to parse this particular example but theres a ton of others... Irish.. Jews etc etc. All of whom who made a CHOICE to live in areas where the entrenched culture is secular/Christian/Protestant etc but nevertheless wanted better treatment from the broader society. Would you have the same approach towards them, "Fix Ireland before you complain"... "Fix Romania/Germany/Poland before you cry about anti-semetism".
Re: Swiss voters ‘back ban on building of minarets’
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Updated: Sunday, 21 Feb 2010, 7:39 PM CST
Published : Sunday, 21 Feb 2010, 7:36 PM CST
BERNE, Swizerland -** The Swiss politician, who worked to ban minarets from mosques, has converted to Islam.**
Daniel Streich was a member of the Swiss People’s Party, or SVP, in Switzerland. Along with the party, Streich greatly supported banning construction of any minarets on mosques. The referendum passed, despite the opposition of the Swiss government and the United Nations.
The ban does not affect the four existing minarets; however, it does prohibit them from putting out the call to prayer. The Swiss government maintains that this ban is not an action against Muslims or Islam, but aimed at fighting extremists.
According to a German language newspaper in Switzerland, 20 Minuten, in November of 2009, Streich announced his resignation from the party as well as his conversion to Islam, two years ago.
**"Islam gives me logical answers to important questions of life, which I did not find conclusive in Christianity,” said Streich. **
Re: Swiss voters ‘back ban on building of minarets’
Re: Swiss voters 'back ban on building of minarets'
^
Booyah!! As soon as you learn about true Islam, you will be compelled to follow it.
I am dismayed by the vote and the situation. Muslims in Swissland are probably the most integrated in Europe and what we are seeing is much more of a reactionary move by voters.
Re: Swiss voters 'back ban on building of minarets'
Subhanallah. :)
This is a good part of your post & it is mostly true the middle eastern countries. The only muslim country to which non-muslims have gone to work & live in more numbers is UAE. It is not been decades or centuries since it started & despite very controlled media & other government policies against non-muslims / non-arabs, still we did get to hear the news of many incidents where expatriates were 'thrown out' of the country just because their actions did the comply with the local traditions. And imagine this is the most modern islamic state.
By that standard, how long before we see muslims being thrown out of europe (just like the US after 911)? Then again the people who would suffer the most by being thrown out of europe are muslims themselves because their own governments are too corrupt & stupid to provide a good shelter, necessities & a good way of living to their own people.
And I strongly advise & encourage muslims here depressed over this 'human rights violation' of swiss to live in any middle eastern muslim country for a change atleast for 6 months. I would love to see their opinion of the swiss & europe after that. They would get to have a very very good idea of what 'human rights violations' actually are......... especially when committed against your own people.
How would Pakistanis feel if millions of Africans moved into Pakistan and started building their place of Worship, forming ghettos, harassing pakistani girls, committing most of the crime, plotting terrorist attacks, riots, etc....
Pakis would hate them and will vote for people who want to kick them out.
Sorry, But I dont want to see Europe being turned into a middle eastern hell hole.
This is a good part of your post & it is mostly true the middle eastern countries. The only muslim country to which non-muslims have gone to work & live in more numbers is UAE. It is not been decades or centuries since it started & despite very controlled media & other government policies against non-muslims / non-arabs, still we did get to hear the news of many incidents where expatriates were 'thrown out' of the country just because their actions did the comply with the local traditions. And imagine this is the most modern islamic state.
By that standard, how long before we see muslims being thrown out of europe **(just like the US after 911)? **Then again the people who would suffer the most by being thrown out of europe are muslims themselves because their own governments are too corrupt & stupid to provide a good shelter, necessities & a good way of living to their own people.
And I strongly advise & encourage muslims here depressed over this 'human rights violation' of swiss to live in any middle eastern muslim country for a change atleast for 6 months. I would love to see their opinion of the swiss & europe after that. They would get to have a very very good idea of what 'human rights violations' actually are......... especially when committed against your own people.
Agreed!
The only inaccuracy is the bold red part. Muslims were NEVER THROWN out of US after 911, not because of their faith ONLY.