Yes I know suicide is haraam.
That being said…have any of you ever felt suicidal? Any of you know someone who has felt it or attempted it?
What’re ya’lls thoughts on it?
PS. To ChannMahi, thanks a lot for the “happy beginnings” thread…I really needed to laugh. Thanks.
Yes Dear, indeed this is an interesting topic. I have felt suicidal at times. those times have been realy freaky, its like u are possessed and someone else is controlling you via remote control. But I swear it dosent feel good at all, even while doing something suicidal, u know thats its wrong and that its haram, and how much hurt it'll cause to ppl whole love u, still u wanna do it. I told u its a very freaky situation to be in, I have been in it once and I just feel horrible abt it whenever I think abt it, but u know no matter how much u reason with ureself and talk urself out of it, the suicidal germs are still deeprooted eithin u, and can come out anytine when triggered, thats the scariest part i suppose. These are my views, but ofcourse I dont intend to reveal the reason behing my suicidal act.
Love All
PPl contemplating of it should consult immediately to a psychologist, thats all I can suggest.
Even losers in thier life r not allowed to commit suicide becoz as long as they live more there is always a chance to win.
Nope.....never felt like it and niether know anyone....
I think only those people think of it or do it that are loosers in life and cant face up to their problems....probably they cant tolerate it.....Life is a gift...not anything to paly with!...
I’m not justifying suicide being the moral or the right step but it can’t be denied because people do go through the thought of it, and when we call people who go through the contemplation of it as “losers” than we are just contributing to even more, it sort of like the saying “putting salt on the wound,” the last thing someone who is going through depression or what not needs to hear is that they are a “loser” unless you area a certified psychologist and you have a method to declare someone a “loser” and than have them bounce back as being a “winner”, yes it is a easy way out which life is not meant to be all peachy, and so many people hurt by this act not only the committer and most importantly its haraam, if you feel that way seek guidance through a friend or talk to professional people about it, there are so many people trained to guide one through this, its reality and it’s a phase that people go through and for some its an extreme case, I have personally have not gone through it and have had an acquaintance go through it whom was told that it was just a foolish phase and sadly it was his way of seeking help which turned out for the worst. So my point is to acknowledge it and know that there is a way out and things do get better. InshAllah.
When someone is suicidal, they are not going through some sort of imature child-like phase which will pass if you tell them to, "cheer up, it's never as bad as it seems".
Having worked with suicidal people in the past, all I can tell you is that it's something that can happen to any one of us. Who knows what life will bring? I have seen it happen to old people, young people, religious people, muslims, christians, rich and poor alike.
So, regardless of whether your 'aproove' of suicidal feelings or not, the fact is that people have suffered them for thousands of years, and will continue to suffer them until we can remove the stigmatism and shame associated with it and openly treat it the way it should be treated.
mm10 your views on everything are so extreme, discussing something with you is like having a conversation with a tree.
And Aashi, you sound like you're a child. Dubbing people with such serious problems 'loosers' is very childish and immature. You tell me, have you ever lived on your own, worked for a living, taken care of your own household without any help? Probably not, you've probably lived a sheltered life with mummy and daddy, and just because they hand you everything doesn't mean things are easy. Just because you don't have problems, doesn't mean others don't. And calling real people with very real problems 'loosers' is just ignorant of you.
mm10 your views on everything are so extreme, discussing something with you is like having a conversation with a tree.<<<<
Dear Sir, in life either there is black or white, if you want to color your life with life you have to digest this simple centuries old philosophy!
PPl trying to create gray zones basically make themselves of fool and hide from realities.
Like I said, conversation with a tree.
[quote]
Originally posted by mm10:
Dear Sir, in life either there is black or white
[/quote]
I will prefer to differ. In life, rarely anything is black or white. :)
However if you are living in Utopia, then you may have a point.
I know I'm not answering the question at hand but I have to emphasize here that life is not about winning OR losing. It is simply about LIVING. It's about striking up a conversation with a street-corner musician to get a glimpse into his world. Enjoying little pleasures like pulling off a country road to eat peaches with your dad at a farm produce stand or rescuing a kitten from being flattened on a highway even though you know the animal shelter's probably going to put it to sleep. To be able to breathe, smile, walk, communicate, taste, to do these things is such a remarkable privilege.
You OWE it to yourself (I mean this to anybody who is suicidal) to make this precious time you have on this earth, as rich as possible. So, perchance, should you catch yourself thinking "WHY?" you can also look to these memories and say "why ever NOT?"
[quote]
Originally posted by Pristine:
** I will prefer to differ. In life, rarely anything is black or white. :)
However if you are living in Utopia, then you may have a point.**
[/quote]
I agree. A man cant be a total loser, nor can he be a total hero.
But I've noticed that in children, there is either black or white. The shades of grey are non-existant. A man is either good. Or he is bad. A man cant be neutral.
Suicide is a dire topic and needs to be addressed as soon as possible. People give thier lives away for things so little as failed tests. We must bring out joy in people by showing joy in us and not pointing any fingers...
I had a very good friend who committed suicide a few years ago. It was a really difficult time for everyone that was close to him. I've never had more difficulty dealing with a death - there is a constant feeling that maybe something could have been done, that maybe you missed a cry for help. At the same time there is a feeling of anger and betrayal. I disagree with other posters, suicide is not an act of a looser, it is often an act of desperation carried out by people with immense popularity and fame.
I have to admit, I don't know much about the psychology of suicide. But I can relate the story of my friend. He was East Indian, physically abused as a child, he witnessed his mother being beaten by his dad on a daily basis. At around the age of 15 he reacted. While his father in a rage and drunken stupor was assaulting his mother, he took a knife and placed it in his fathers chest. His father survived. But as a result of the incident my friend was charged and placed in a youth detention center. Upon release he lived with another friend, and didn't return home.
He did eventually return home though, a few years later. To witness the same violence. I should note that on no occasion did he reveal much of this information to anyone. His friends knew little about the abuse, we knew little about anything, until after his suicide. And when he returned home, it was almost as if everything was ok. He couldn't have looked happier - he had two jobs and was enrolled full-time in school. But the day came again when his father turned on his mother and threatened him with violence.
A few days later my friend, went around his regular business. He returned the things he borrowed from others, the nintendo games, the CD's, he called in sick to work, he dropped another friend off at school, he made himself dinner - leaving enough for his mother once she returned from work. He proceeded to step into his garage, turn on his car and place a pillow on the ground. He lay there with the smoke filling the room, until his breath was no longer. His mother found him, but it was too late.
The next few days were filled with sadness and shock - for his family, friends and community. At the funeral we were reminded by those giving the eulogy that we should remember the way he lived and not how he died. But the selfishness of his act didn't lend itself so easily to such an interpretation. Perhaps in his mind, he thought that his death would be a statement of sorts - a statement to his father of the misery he had placed on his son. And in the end, perhaps it did serve that purpose, but that wasn't it.
By committing suicide he left the strongest feeling of resentment amongst his friends. How selfish could he be? He took something away from us - which we loved. I'm still not sure how to counsel or how to see the signs of suicide. I think they can be so disparaging, yet latent, that you fail to notice. We didn't notice and I don't think there would be anyway really for us to have noticed and prevented what had happened.
If your thinking about it, and serious about it. Think again, think of the ones you love, the ones that love you - you probably don't even know how many people care about you. What is happening to you is not uncommon - what your thinking is not uncommon - we all think it. We have certain threshold for pain and we have coping skills to deal with that pain, but once that pain exceeds the ability to cope with it, we feel tremendous pressure. And people have different thresholds for pain. What you have to do, is try to increase your coping mechanisms. Rely on your friends, rely on those you trust, confide in them - they should help - and if they can't get help. Like other posters have said, pick up a phone, call someone - in N.America there are services available.
Achtung
Achtung,
I really cant see any reason for you calling your friend selfish. Rather its selfish on your part to think like that. We never realize how much we are isolated from each other, and we never realize how the people around us are suffering. Nobody's pain is the same/similar as anyone's elses and we can never guage other people's feelings.
The people who are suicidal, for whatever reason, tend to take every bad happening in life as a push closer to their ultimate fate. The general attitude we have towards each other in everyday life, by way of which we think that everyone around us is at least as happy as we are, certainly doesn't go well with people having suicidal tendencies.
Your friend did make a statement. It was his way of showing to the world how helpless some people can be in this world, even though they are a 100% right, and how unjust everything is. It was his way of rebelling against the insensitivity present in the human beings. I think he was at peace when he decided to commit suicide and though he had no hope, he was content. And he was brave and definitely more knowledgeable that most of us. **** the crappy world.
Human soul is something that should be dealt with ultimate care and a lot of love; without making any assupmtions. If only we all could do that!
As for me, I can certainly relate to suicidal tendencies albeit not to the last extent. But I think I am lucky. There have always been reasons to hang in there for one more day.
So what you wanted to See good has made you blind
And what you wanted to Be yours has made it Mine
So don't you lock up Something that you
Wanted to see fly
Hands are for shaking No not tying
I sure don't Mind a change But I fell on black Days
How would I know That this could be My fate
[This message has been edited by Scratch (edited March 07, 2002).]
Ditto Scratch. If someone around you commits suicide it means you were not caring enough for them to open upto you. Make an extra effort to relieve whatever is hurting those around you.
Life is funny :)
I think the word "selfishness" in Achtung's post didn't convey the meaning properly. What I understand, he is saying that the person who commited suicide was thinking of himself, that he will leave all world problems behind him, and basically will just quit. He wanted to make a statement for those who hurt him. What he failed to realize was that there are people around him who would feel sad on his suicide. The friends neither encouraged him to commit suicide nor were responsible for his miseries.
Basically its a circular argument. The guy committed suicide because he felt that some people around him don't realize how they are hurting him. And his death resulted in them becoming very sad indeed.
Why did the friends not help him earlier is a very difficult argument. Many people don't share their inner most feelings with anyone. Friends can not invade your private space. If you share your problems, they can help. If you want to carry all your load yourself, thats your choice. To blame the friends entirely is absurd.
Ofcourse, if someone shares your problems and seeks advice and you shoo him off, and the person commits suicide... then ... u have an argument.
I think it's vital if you see any sort of warning signs coming from your friends, that you take it seriously. When you're in a state of mind where nothing seems right, you lose sight of all the pleasant things in your life that still exist. The darkness envelopes you, cutting you off from any rational thinking. You would need to make them see the light. There is always hope. However hopeless life may seem.
[This message has been edited by baad-e-saba (edited March 08, 2002).]
Note from Admin: Please address the subject with the seriousness it deserves rather than trivializing it
[This message has been edited by Admin (edited March 08, 2002).]
The friend that commited suicide...before when his attacked his father and got send to detention center, his parents(especially his mother) must have realized at that point what her son was going through seeing her get beaten up. Yet she still stayed in the same house, enduring the same treatment from the father knowing that her son knew(felt the same feelings) what was going on. The father obviously didn't care much either as to how his son felt(b/c of the stabbing incident the parents can't say they didn't know their son was being effected by the violence). What else was the son suppose to do? He couldn't stop his father from hurting his mother...he couldn't get his mother to protect herself...he couldn't live knowing in his mind that his mother was getting beat up by his father...what else could he have done? He made it VERY clear that he can't handle seeing his mother hurt....he's dead now...I'm assuming that his mother is still with his father and PROBABLY gets treated the same way as she did before(please correct me if I'm wrong)...only diff. now is that the guy isn't here to see/feel her pain.(This is my personal view...I'm sorry if it offends anyone).
Do you guys think that there are times when certain problems can't be solved...no matter how many ppl. hear it, no matter how much the "problem" may be bothering someone...every single person is helpless to do anything to make the situation better?
To those of you who mentioned that this guy was selfish in killing himself(or ppl. who commit suicide are selfish)...would you prefer that they go through life being miserable each day? Suicidal people do what they believe will be the best solution for them...they primary concenrn is not other people's happiness...and that's a bad thing?
[quote]
Originally posted by janete:
***Note from Admin: Please address the subject with the seriousness it deserves rather than trivializing it*
[This message has been edited by Admin (edited March 08, 2002).]**
[/quote]
I didn't intend to trivialize a serious issue like that.
I know how difficult is dealing with a lost of someone whom we love and a lost of our own 'desire of living'. But silence is worse. I felt that. In many cultures is shameful, and a sin, to say "I tried to suicide". But it's necessary to breake this hard silence. When I tried it, I felt unworthy, dirty, stupid. But the load upon my shoulders still was there. I didn't know how to say "help". I looked for helping in Budism, Zoroastrism, Spiritism, some so-called self-helping books and a lot of trash. And, Gosh, I was just 12! By my own hard experience I can conclude that there are many children and teenagers who feel suicidal and depressed but don't know how to ask for help. Millions of kids are dying before our eyes. I intend to be teacher, so I hope being able to read their scared eyes and help them.
Its spoken that even storms can be useful. Lightning makes ground more productive. So, bad experiences can make us stronger and even more sensitive to sad hearts. Like a 'life pos storm'.