suppose you’re 40-50 or over that age, you have adult kids, one of them does something you don’t like. Not because it’s against Islam, but because it’s simply not liked in your own culture.
How far would you go lying about your child towards your other paki friends who critisize you? Why do we do that against each other? Why is ‘izat’ even more important than our own bloods happiness? Why do we eat each other alive if we get the chance? Why is our ‘izat’ so much more important than what is truly right or wrong (religiously)?
Any answer wud be easier said than done. Human beings are social animals who have to interact and be accepted by society. Especially Muslim societies, still very much family oriented and dictated by societal norms unlike the western individualistic model. There is no shame in protecting your own, it has been going on for centuries at different scales but same effect. Izat or respect is extremely important in clan recognition, those who lose respect or their izzat are derided and ostracized by society, thus the need to protect and hide. Moreso, over the centuries these traits have been conditioned in our psyche so much so that we have made them part of our life sometimes giving them preference over religion and blood.
Fk them. Daffa karo, those people are just cheap bast@rdss who have nothing better to do than to sniff in other peoples busienss and bring them down because they are lacking any happiness in thier own miserable lives. They want to find any little flaw and hit you with it, they want to tell others that your children are so horrible, this is what happens when you raise them in big bad america, whereas thier own damn kids are doing a hundred times worse, but htey turn a blind eye to it, or it’s alright coz it’s THEIR kids. Refer to SarahSplendors thread “inanity” as well. You told me in my thread that people are miserable creatures who will do anything to bring each other down…
Not sure how it goes with other families, but in my family, whatever bad thing happens stays IN the family. My parents wouldn’t evne let me tell others that my brother moved out of the house whne he was in his early 20s. I’ve messed up a few times but I know they will never ever ever ever ever tell their relative, even ones that my mother considers her own daughters, simply coz you don’t sell out ur own kids. If something is against religion, you have every right to be angry and feel upset but if it’s something simply cultural, say for example, your daughter decides to dorm or live on her own, then i dont c the need to lie. Tell your ugly aunty friends to shut the hell up and mind their business
I think sadya, this is true for most of the desi families. I was gonna start a thread today which is somewhat related to this.
The senario you have provided has happened alot, atleast to me. I think part of the reason is that parents think that they need to do this inorder to protect us. We kids on the other hand think that it doesn't matter what others think.
I was always told that "jahez' is haram.. that one should not give 'jahez' but then i hear my mom saying that on our cousin's wedding we bought her the whole furniture for her room, an AC and what not.. and i wondered if we really do follow the rule of not giving 'jahez'? or are we just being hypocryte (SP?) and finding new excuses for old habits?
Ofcourse, all this is done to keep others happy.. which bothers me and i am sure bothers alot of ppl here. I would like to hear the other side of argument.. I respect all of the elders in family and friends circle but when they try to nudge in on my personal matters i being to lose that respect..
At lots of desi dinner parties I hear parents bragging about their own 18-30 year old kids about how good they are in uni, how religious they are, how smart they, that they have good jobs, etc. But I see them all at uni and stuff screwing around, dropping out of programs, not working where their parents say they work, drinking, staying out until late night and even ones wearing hijab are worse but their parents seem to think they are angels. I know some hijab girls in my city who are desperate about boys and go to ISNA and stuff only to meet guys. I mean do the parents really think their kids are that innocent? Like even my mom saw this auntie's son at blockbuster with his hand on his girlfriend's butt, and still like a year later she is always like "oh so and so's son is so laike" and "kitna laike khandan". Like whatever!
I think its natural for parents to brag about their kids. I am sure we will all do it when we have kids.. its just natural ..
but the point here is how desi's take decisions and actions just to please the society even if they have to go through hell for it. a simple example would be buying house that is out of your budget. Its quite common, i have seen desi uncles and aunties talk about how uss kay ghar ka yeh acha hai uss kay ghar kay yeh bura hai.. woh dekho 4 lakh ka ghar liya hai uss ney..
sigh and worst thing is that in my own family this sort of thinking exists.. :(
Hm, well...if your kid did something wrong, then they did something wrong. And kids always do something wrong at one point or another, right?
First off, if anyone is prying into the business of your children, you have full right to ask them why they dont mind their own business, and proceed to tell them that their own kids aren't on the right track.
Its usually parents whose own kids' are screwed up that start attacking other parents. To make up for their own deficiency as parents, I suppose.
I don't know that's never been my experience. I'm sure I've been an embarassement to my parents many a time but they never said so to me. They've always supported me and never pressured me (too directly) to conform. I was like Siouxie Sioux with black cropped hair, combat boots, all black, vintage clothing, very skinny. I'm sure some of our relatives thought I was a wierdo but my parents understood it was probably just a phase and they respected me enough to have my own tastes and opinions. I think they knew everything was ok cause I wasn't going out, intoxicated, dating, or doing anything else haram.
The thing that really gets to me is, when a kid "messes up" because of the family pressure. Some kids are pressured too much into doing something they don't want (anymore). To avoid that pressure they "mess up".
Sometimes parents/family makes a child so desperate and when something goes wrong, they only put the blame on their child. They forget they had an equally and maybe even more important part in it.
I've seen from very close parents who were critisezed by some of their friends that what they were doing with their kid(s) was the wrong way to treat their kids. To avoid those comments from their friends, the parents started to say stuff about their kids which wasn't true, so they would come off better. They cared more for their own naqli "izat" than about the truth.
What's wrong with admitting that you as an elderly person were wrong (too)? It's not bad to admit a mistake when you know you've made one. Age shouldn't matter.
I think it's something for cowards, not acknowledging you can make a mistake too. That's only human no matter how old you are! Even buzoorgs can be wrong in certain issues.
Garding your izat could be positive too. But unfortunately we humans turn everything normal into something bad.
If we start looking at ourselves before pointing fingers at others, if we open up to other ideas, understand each others point of view, if we allow each other to have a different opinoin, a different way of life as long as it is still in Islam, as long as we allow each other to make a mistake as normal humans do, it shouldn’t be something negative.
An Aunty once told me, that when you die, the witness of the people you leave behind about your character is important. She said, if there are more people who remember you positively you get more sawaab. that puzzled me, suppose they don’t even know your heart? Suppose they have misunderstandings about your character? How could any human truly judge another human being for 100%?
I think what she meant was that if you are nice to ppl around you, chances are that they will remember you and make dua for you. Its not that they are ultimately making the decision of whether you lead a good life or not but their duas will make a difference in the end
Protecting your family is normal. People don’t need to know everything about you. Besides, even when you tell someone something unimportant, they find ways to change that unimportant small thing into something big it is not.
Yes, unfortunately this runs in our family and friends circle too, doing stuff we know is wrong, only to make others happy. I think we are all being hypocrite in one way or another in our social lifes. I even know many people (including family members unfortunately) who are different in front of non desis, they act like non desis around them, they suddenly have different ideas of life when they are with non desis. but the minute they come home or they are with others Pakistanis, they change again.
I don’t care anymore if it shocks non - desis when I do have a certain opinion. I don’t act different anymore in front of non-desi friends. I used to do that too in the past.
Oh boy, I can fill a complete book about this topic! Yes, we’ve heard that million times too from the elderly in our family. Us ka bacha unchi school mai dakhal huwa hai, tum na laiq hu. Us ki beti 10 saal ki thi, to haandi banana sikh liya thaa. bla bla bla. If only they knew how those kids act when they are among their friends.
Desis are dumb. That will be your final answer for most of these sorts of problems. Watch some of these shows on GEO and ARY - the sociology type - you'll be amazed at what people say/think.
This izzat thing is typical and it shows a more underlying problem which underlies so many other problems: INSECURITY.
