Status of woman in Hindu religion

In our two gran Epics Mahabharata and Ramayana I find the relations towards women very derogatory.

  1. In Mahabharata Draupadi loved Arjuna. But to justify the mistake made by Kunti all five brothers married her. She was compelled to live with four others apart from Arjuna.

  2. Yudhister the eldest brother of Pandvas lost Draupadi in gambling.

  3. Draupadi’ cloths were removed at the king’ palace and no renowned person objected.

  4. If her husbands were not real cowards they must have fought and defended her at the spot. They did not.

  5. In Ramayana the God Rama fought back his wife Sita from Ravana. And after he compelled her to prove her chastity by entering fire. She fulfilled all his demands. Even after that Rama abandoned her to maintain the sanctity of public opinion

  6. If Rama really loved his wife he could give up the thrown and honor his family.

Is there any difference between the Draupadi cloths removing episode and Phulan Devi rape case?
Our today’ rulers hypocritically stick to the chair instead of following norms……is it anywhere different from what Rama did centuries ago.

After all Mahabharata and Ramayana are our heritage, culture etc……

http://web.utk.edu/~jftzgrld/MBh1Story.html

http://www.maxwell.syr.edu/maxpages/special/ramayana/story.htm

Re: Status of woman in Hindu religion

Yes, your quotes are right and I agree to them.
And thanks for admittance that this is your culture. That makes things quite easy…
Do you think the morally degraded society of India is a result of all this?

Re: Status of woman in Hindu religion

Lord Krishna had 16,000 wives yet he portrayed to the world that he has only one. He called the secret wives as “gopis”… If I use the word “cowboy” for lord Krishna, I am sure you’d not mind because he was a shephard.

Has anyone seen a man in history with 16,000 wives, I repeat **16,000 :blush: **


It was Lord Krishna

Re: Status of woman in Hindu religion

Anjan,

Ramayana and Mahabharatha reflect the life and times of a different generation. They reflect what actually happened in those Yugas. It is a factual report and has all the Good, bad and ugly represented in it. It is left to humans to read them and understand the difference between good and bad.

Lord Ram is always known for his leadership and capabilities, but he did something to keep the honour of his family. Whether it is right or not - we do not know, Rama was human and he also had the same strengths and weaknesses that we possess.

The History of the entire world has not been kind to the women and it keeps on happening even today. But, the truth is everyone at that time and today know the difference between right and wrong. It is only few who will stand up for the right.

For eg. During Draupadi’s Vasthraparaharan, there were the best of best men, like Bheeshma, Drona, Vidura, Dhrithrashtra, Karna etc. in the court and none of them dared to stop Dushyasana.

Individually Bheeshma, Drona, Vidura, Karna are the best of men ever to walk on earth, however, their loyalty to the crown was so much that they did not dare to stop the humiliation of Draupadi.

It is similar to the situation that we are seeing every day. We see women being harassed, beaten, subjugated under the secret veil of family, religion, culture etc. and we accept that as perfectly normal and many times condone these acts.

Mahabharatha and Ramayana are Historic Epics that showed the human frailities in all its colours and the victory of Good or evil.

Re: Status of woman in Hindu religion

Lahore,

Krishna did not portray that he had only one wife. Infact there are numerous stories to substantiate that. Please read Parijathaharam to get more insight into the case.

Regarding 16000 gopikas, the story goes like this , Shri Krishna killed Naraka-asura - the demon of sorrow and hell, who had kidnapped and imprisoned 16,000 princesses for his harem. After being freed from the prison, all the gopikas believed that Krishna was their husband as he was their liberator.

Re: Status of woman in Hindu religion

Frankly speaking I like the 'cowboy' image of Krishna with 8+16000 wives
Krishna is the only faultless character in our Epics. He was the only one who interrupted the 'rape' or 'cloth removing scenario’ of Drauapadi.

I cannot say the same for others.

Re: Status of woman in Hindu religion

the worst part is Satti which used to be obligatory (correct me if im wrong). But it's practice isn't that common anymore.

Re: Status of woman in Hindu religion

Anjjan is this ur opinion or that is written in some un corraborated websites lying around.
Do not take things out of context and make it look like its the bad thing to ever to have happened.
As victory said.. the epic shows the human nature and fraility. Its an epic with morals all around it. In Mahabharat the husbands were humiliated and could not face draupadi. U know the draupadi declared that she will not tie her hair untill Dhushyasana is killed and wash it with his blood.
Bhim did that. The all mahabharat ( the story of the war between the causins) started after that.

Re: Status of woman in Hindu religion

In puranas nobody was forced to do a sati. The sati became a common practice after a war defeat and killing of their husbands, the enemy would come for them. In order to save their womens honour sati became prevelant and became a practice.

Re: Status of woman in Hindu religion

What do you mean by an un corraborated websites? This is my opinion.

I cannot find any difference between Draupadi rape and Phulan Devi rape case. In both the cases men were coward spectators and were enjoying the scenario.

And why a Phulan Devi rape case takes place near about every month in some remote village? It must be our culture.

I have often asked my Indian friends if we really respect our women?

Re: Status of woman in Hindu religion

Point # 1: So it means you agree he had 16,000 wives, OKAy, so why do you blame any other faith for Polygamy, especially Islam ?
There is a common misconception among some Hindus that Lord Krsna had only one consort/wife, Radha, and these 16,000 gopis were just spiritual followers of this God. That is totally false. In fact, Lord Krsna got so many gopis & wives pregnant that he populated much of the earth with Yadus (Yadavas) and had to annihilate them later…
Need reference? I can give you that, just ask me… :bukbuk:

Point # 2: Tell me one thing buddy, what is the difference between believing in someone as a “Liberator” and a “Husband”… Please enlighten us one that. If a women is freed today of some sort of tyrany by some man, does it mean she becomes his wife or that she has to believe him her husband?

Point # 3: You are trying to portray Krishna in this manner, while in fact Ksishna used to steal the clothes of the women taking bath in the stream… What a playboy character and you seem to portray that he is a pious person to be believed by the gopis as their Husband?

Re: Status of woman in Hindu religion

I think all of us should honor our ancestors but drop the need to either idolise or demonise them. We are smarter. We may not have the muscle strength of the old warriors, but we do have a greater sense of right and wrong.

Good work Anjan. I feel women have to start respecting themselves more before men will follow. It will happen, one day the world will be largely secular, democratic and gender-equal. Those who will fight it will get left behind.

Re: Status of woman in Hindu religion

You lier. Give reference to your claim…

  1. Is Krishna a character of your Epic OR god/Lord? Be sure what are you saying.

  2. Krishna (Character/god) used to steal the clothes of the women taking bath in the streams and used to ask them “come out you ladies”… how do you prove him otherwise.

Re: Status of woman in Hindu religion

I disagree. In the case of draupadi.. the noble men were all ashamed of themselves of what Dushyasana did. But the people with some respect were too overwhelmed to say anything or do anything untill Krishna came to the rescue of Draupadi. And there was no rape happened. No body was enjoying the scene except the Kauravas.
Phulan devi case is different. She was raped and like Draupadi she had all the right to take vengeance on the perpetrators. And she did it.
Exploitation of Women happens in every society. It is the women with the help of just men to fight against it. The case of Draupadi is in point as well as Phoolen Devi. Phoolen Devi built her army with men, not with women.

Re: Status of woman in Hindu religion

I wouldn’t blame it on “culture” per se, but rather that in most rural areas the law is of “jungle”, “might is right”.

Re: Status of woman in Hindu religion

I do not understand what his problem is. We Hindus do not learn our religion at a Madrisa in our childhood and have every right to talk with an open mind.

Sorry Lahori 862, you will not understand it!

Re: Status of woman in Hindu religion

To be ashamed of something and fight at the spot are two different things. What her coward husbands and noble class did at the Karauv palace was hypocrisy. Only Krishna came forward to defend the woman.
We Indians must accept this truth…instead of looking for excuses.

We can not behave with a woman in Europe as we do at our home. Are Europeans better than us in culture?
I am sure we have learnt a lot from our Epics. Have you ever seen an Indian offering a seat to a woman in local transport in India? (Calcutta is only exception, a little.)

Re: Status of woman in Hindu religion

I am asking a simple question.
Is Krishna a character of your Epic or your Lord/god?
Is this question difficult for you to understand?

May be this will make you understand about Krishna and status of women in Hinduism :frowning:

*"In the first month of winter, the gopis of Nanda’s village performed a certain vow to the goddess Katyayani (Durga). They ate rice cooked with ghee; they bathed in the water of the Kalindi (Yamuna) River at sunrise; they made an image of the goddess out of sand and worshipped it with fragrant perfumes and garlands, with offerings and incense and lamps, and with bouquets of flowers, fresh sprigs of leaves, fruits, and rice. And they prayed: ‘Goddess Katyayani (Durga), great mistress of yoga, empress of great deluding magic, make the son of the cow-herd Nanda my husband. I bow to you.’ Saying this prayer, the girls would worship her, and having set their hearts on Krsna, the girls performed this vow for a month; they worshipped Bhadrakali (Durga) so that the son of Nanda (Krsna) would be their husband. Arising at dawn, calling one another by name, they would join hands and go to bathe in the Kalindi (Yamuna) every day, singing loudly about Krsna as they went. One day, when they had gone to the river and taken off their clothes on the bank as usual, they were playing joyfully in the water, singing about Krsna. The Lord Krsna, lord of all the masters of yoga, came there with his friends of the same age in order to grant them the object of their rites. He took their clothes and quickly climbed a Nipa tree, and laughing with the laughing boys he told what the joke was: 'Girls, let each one of you come here and take her own clothes as she wishes. I promise you, this is no jest, for you have been exhausted by your vows. I have never before told an untruth, and these boys know this. Slender-waisted ones, come one by one or all together and take your clothes.’ When the gopis saw what his game was, they were overwhelmed with love, but they looked at one another in shame, and they smiled, but they did not come out. Flustered and embarrassed by Govinda’s (Krsna’s) words and by his jest, they sank down up to their necks in the icy water, and, shivering, they said to him, 'You should not have played such a wicked trick. We know you as our beloved, son of the cow-herd Nanda, the pride of the village. Give us our clothes, for we are trembling. O darkly handsome one, we are your slaves and will do as you command, but you know dharma: give us our clothes or we will tell your father, the chieftain.’ The lord said to them, ‘If you are my slaves and will do as I command, then come here and take back your clothes, O brightly smiling ones.’ Then all the girls, shivering and smarting with cold, came out of the water, covering their crotches with their hands. Then the lord, the son of Devaki, gave their clothes to them, for he felt pity when he saw them bowed down in this way and he was satisfied with them. Though they were greatly deceived and robbed of their modesty, though they were mocked and treated like toys and stripped of their clothes, yet they held no grudge against him, for they were happy to be together with their beloved. Rejoicing in the closeness of their lover, they put on their clothes; their ****The lord was pleased and gratified by their chaste actions, and he looked at them and placed their clothes on his shoulder and smiled and said, ‘Since you swam in the water without clothes while you were under a vow, this was an insult to the divinity (to Varuna, God of the waters). Therefore you must fold your hands and place them on your heads and bow low in expiation of your sin, and then you may take your clothes.’ When the village girls (gopis) heard what the infallible one said, they thought that bathing naked had been a violation of their vows, and they bowed down to Krsna, the very embodiment of all their rituals, who had thus fulfilled their desires and wiped out their disgrace and sin.***Then the lord, the son of Devaki, gave their clothes to them, for he felt pity when he saw them bowed down in this way and he was satisfied with them. Though they were greatly deceived and robbed of their modesty, though they were mocked and treated like toys and stripped of their clothes, yet they held no grudge against him, for they were happy to be together with their beloved. **Rejoicing in the closeness of their lover, they put on their clothes; their **bashful glances, in the thrall of their hearts, did not move from him. Knowing that the girls had taken a vow because they desired to touch his feet, the lord with a rope around his waist said to the girls, ‘Good ladies, I know that your desire is to worship me. I rejoice in this vow, which deserves to be fulfilled. The desire of those whose hearts have been placed in me does not give rise to further desire, just as seed corn that has been boiled or fried does not give rise to seed. You have achieved your aim. Now, girls, go back to the village and you will enjoy your nights with me, for it was for this that you fine ladies undertook your vow and worship.’ When the gopis heard this from Krsna, they had obtained what they desired; and, meditating upon his lotus feet, they forced themselves to go away from him to the village."
Srimad Bhagavatam 10:22:1-28
Also written in Brahmavaivarta Purana 1:27
And in Brhaddharma Purana 3:17

Re: Status of woman in Hindu religion

So what should one do.. I know where u got this.. should i give u the reply in the same way that guy gave about the Prophet:D:p..

Re: Status of woman in Hindu religion

^ First of all, learn what is the status of women in Hinduism from this quote. Show pieces, objects of pleasure. Learn that the Krishna, either a character of Hindu epic or god/lord is teaching you how to behave with the women.

Second, I am not using any source other than Hindu source. I am telling you the name of the Hindu books from where I am quoting. I am not quoting any Muslim or non-hindu source. If you believe these are wrong, I urge you to tell what exactly these verses say in the respective books......

Thirdly, we welcome all sorts of questions **about Islam. Please make a new thread and write whatever you want quoting a Muslims book as reference, like I am quoting a Hindu book to talk about Hinduism **so as we could check the authenticity of your reference. You don't need to give any website address, we don't need it. Just tell us the Book, chapter and verse or Hadith Number.

Thankyou.