Re: space colonization and religion
i dont understand the issue. if you can go there, do that. live there for whole life. have mauj masti if you think no religious ruling applies to you. Allah will decide.
Re: space colonization and religion
if you think no religious ruling applies to you. Allah will decide.
Where did I say that Ajaz?
Re: space colonization and religion
Okay then for the sake of discussion how do we manage the pillar of hajj? How would that be reinvented? With the example of the Muslims living in the poles, they can still take a trip to Mecca if they have the financial and physical means to do so. For sure these things pose as hindrances but not impossibilities, whereas a one-way trip will make hajj an impossibility unless one performs it before embarking upon the journey.
Also, TLK, one will only take the risk of a one-way trip to some location provided that they believe there are greater benefits than cons to living there compared to where they are currently living. So, what greater benefits do you see in living not just temporarily but permanently on Mars? Throughout history, people have sought to "make it" in far and new lands believing that they could form a civilization and prosper, only to find the environment to be a brutal one. But in their case, it wasn't a one-way trip.
The other thing that comes to my mind is that I've always heard that Islam doesn't condone isolation from society. The amount of people on Mars will not compare to the vast population of people on Earth they will be leaving behind. Are we allowed to remove ourselves so far away from the ummah to the point that we cannot help/benefit them? Those living in the poles are a minority, but it's still the same planet.
Re: space colonization and religion
Where did I say that Ajaz?
I say if you think.
and when you said it will become impossible to follow religion.
so on the day of judgment, you could have an excuse that it was impossible for you to follow religion while living on mars.
please dont get me wrong.
Re: space colonization and religion
Okay then for the sake of discussion how do we manage the pillar of hajj? How would that be reinvented? With the example of the Muslims living in the poles, they can still take a trip to Mecca if they have the financial and physical means to do so. For sure these things pose as hindrances but not impossibilities, whereas a one-way trip will make hajj an impossibility unless one performs it before embarking upon the journey.
Also, TLK, one will only take the risk of a one-way trip to some location provided that they believe there are greater benefits than cons to living there compared to where they are currently living. So, what greater benefits do you see in living not just temporarily but permanently on Mars? Throughout history, people have sought to "make it" in far and new lands believing that they could form a civilization and prosper, only to find the environment to be a brutal one. But in their case, it wasn't a one-way trip.
The other thing that comes to my mind is that I've always heard that Islam doesn't condone isolation from society. The amount of people on Mars will not compare to the vast population of people on Earth they will be leaving behind. Are we allowed to remove ourselves so far away from the ummah to the point that we cannot help/benefit them? Those living in the poles are a minority, but it's still the same planet.
RV. Please allow me to answer ur question re greater benefirs wrt permanent settlement in MARS. At the rate we r going, sea levels could rise, the oceans are dying, plastic is killing the fish in the sea. Life as we know it will be UNSUSTAINABLE here on earth.
The critical issue, in my opinion, is not whether one can follow ones religion in Mars. The critical issue is are we going to allow our beautiful earth to be raped and pillaged.
That is why insertion of Religion in the Science section is unfortunate. And disturbing. Folks have stopped talking Science. If you scale this across humanity, we are doomed.
Re: space colonization and religion
I get that, Southie. I'm also thinking about the NWO, which I don't feel is merely a conspiracy theory...and is already contributing to the corruption of our world. But even so, how many people will be lucky enough to escape the chaos on Earth and to go to Mars? Most people will be left behind on this planet that is being raped and pillaged, no? What about them? And Southie, most religions do not condone pollution/destruction of the environment.
Re: space colonization and religion
What is NWO. new world order. Don't know anything abt it.
I do know the Religious Right and the extremely Conservative groups in west by and large scoff at climate change. And r proud to drive gas guzzlers. So while religions do not preach earth pillage the practioneers in the westc- the extreme right - do pillage it. And spread nonsense re climate change non existence.
PS. I did not imply religions preach dart rape. I simply stated by diverting Science forum to religious discussion, we have simply stopped discussing Science. And that's not a good thing.
Re: space colonization and religion
Southie, how can you separate science from religion? Religion is part of our social setup and everything science affects everything social. The goal of discussing religion in this forum is to checkout the possibilities of redefining the norms of religion so it does not appear to be clashing with the science.
Re: space colonization and religion
And Southie, most religions do not condone pollution/destruction of the environment.
If that is true then I think that is where Islam shines. There are many ahadees about the rewards of planting trees and also the prohibition of cutting any green tree during war
Re: space colonization and religion
^True. We are even told to finish planting a tree even if Judgement Say is moments away. But answer my previous questions. How will the pillar of hajj be improvised or reinvented. Also is it jaaiz for us to remove ourselves so far away from the Ummah thar we cannot help/benefit them? After all we'd be leaving behind majority of the Earth's population never to return again. Is that okay morally? It's not the same as living on or close to the poles.
Re: space colonization and religion
Southie, how can you separate science from religion? Religion is part of our social setup and everything science affects everything social. The goal of discussing religion in this forum is to checkout the possibilities of redefining the norms of religion so it does not appear to be clashing with the science.
Religion indeed is part of Society. But not everyone is religious. There simply is NO connection between Science and Religion. There is peer review in Science. The truth rises to the top. Experiments not repeatable lose credibility.
Several things are partition of Society. Doesn't mean we have to discuss each of them in relation to the other. When Religious dogma, mythology, superstitions and even rekigious principles are discussed with Science the line gets blurred.
People shoukd practise religion in private. But to require religious norms to be in synch with science makess no seense
No peer reviewed journals will accept such topics. Cause circular logic does not cut it in the scientific world. One would get grade F. If one uses religious reasoning in science exam.
Anyway it looks like only way to get eyeballs in science forum is to throw religion into the mix. That's a shame. Especially when "religious" folks dishonestly accuse the other of disrespecting Muslim scientists. When no such disrespect was shown. Accusing the opposition of ranting and flooding. Simply because points of view are different. Btinging up old ban unnecessarily in this thread. Totally unwarranted. Level of debate reaches 3rd grade.
Re: space colonization and religion
"O assembly of the jinn and the men! If you are able to pass through the regions of the heavens and the earth, then pass through;..."
Boss if he allows us to go out, then there must be arrangements as well. So dont worry.
Re: space colonization and religion
^ that is a good one.
Re: space colonization and religion
Monk, He has allowed us to go out, the issue now is of colonizing but consequences (pros and cons) have to be considered before embarking on this 1-way adventure. Seriously, the 1-way thing doesn't bother or scare anyone else? It's not like a one-way flight to a country on Earth. Wow, this thread is making Earth more beloved and beautiful to me.
Re: space colonization and religion
^True. We are even told to finish planting a tree even if Judgement Say is moments away. But answer my previous questions. How will the pillar of hajj be improvised or reinvented. Also is it jaaiz for us to remove ourselves so far away from the Ummah thar we cannot help/benefit them? After all we'd be leaving behind majority of the Earth's population never to return again. Is that okay morally? It's not the same as living on or close to the poles.
Hajj's ruling can remain the same. Even on earth, Hajj is only fard on you if you have means and funds available to travel to Mecca. You wont have that at Mars, so that obligation is gone.
Is it Jaa'ez? If you have a colony going on in Mars, then not only its Jaa'ez, but its almost Fard-e-Kifaya for at least one muslim to go there (more are better) with the intention of Tableegh. Think of a time couple of centuries from now when earth is no longer livable, but no muslim ever decided to leave. Islam would vanish, just because we decided not to adapt to the change.
Several things are partition of Society. Doesn't mean we have to discuss each of them in relation to the other. When Religious dogma, mythology, superstitions and even rekigious principles are discussed with Science the line gets blurred.
We dont have to discuss each in relation to the other, but we cannot compartmentalize our lives. You have to accept that there will be an overlap. Next, we will not discuss emotions because it has nothing to do with science? We cannot live a life of robot, can we. You dont have to agree to the fact that faith matters, but you cannot deny that integration of faith into human life is real.
Then again, apparent grand design of our universe is forcing many scientist to discuss the possible existence of a creator in their work and publications (even to negate the idea by counter arguing at the end). Just because its hard to define God as of now, does not mean that it cannot be proved in the future. Who is to say that science will not take a full 360 degree circle and come to a conclusion that we all are the result of a planned event.
Re: space colonization and religion
What overlap? There is as much overlap between science and religion as between science and Mujra. In other words its a stretch.
One can always find some outliers that may have incorporated creator in their peer reviewed publication. I doubt the reviewers judge the paper on its religious content.
Re: space colonization and religion
You know what is the problem with all the holier than thou people? They automatically assume that one who is asking questions has a low level of belief.
well it is disturbing for me to know that somewhere my posts made someone think that i believe their levels of faith are low. Thats something between you and Allah. Hardly something i could ever judge.
Re: space colonization and religion
why not save the earth rather than abandoning it ?
Re: space colonization and religion
For example, one person using a car every day means he/she is consuming resources of 6 persons. Same applies when we are to fulfill other luxurious needs :lame: That is the ‘so-called’ need to move to mars and scientists on behalf proponents of modern systems are hell bent on making mars habitable.
Re: space colonization and religion
Why would scientists not arrange for this trip to include waapsi to Earth? Why make it one-way? Population kum karnay ka iraada hai kya? 