Re: Sindh Through Centuries!
What's your take on him Bro?
Re: Sindh Through Centuries!
What's your take on him Bro?
My take on him is not clear, but my take on Arab invaders is very clear. they don't deserve to be called heroes. They were just looters.
Re: Sindh Through Centuries!
My take on him is not clear, but my take on Arab invaders is very clear. they don't deserve to be called heroes. They were just looters.
Did he fight for his people and his land?
Re: Sindh Through Centuries!
Did he fight for his people and his land?
may be he fought for his own rule, as there are accounts that many quarters of the society were not happy with him
Re: Sindh Through Centuries!
Sindhi Saathi was the name of the college magazine,I told you Bro yesterday.
Re: Sindh Through Centuries!
Sindhi Saathi was the name of the college magazine,I told you Bro yesterday.
okay apart from Raja Dahir, who do you know about local rulers of Sindh?
Re: Sindh Through Centuries!
The history that we had been taught as kids didn’t have mention of our history before Muhammad bin qasim. It seems as if some quarters thought that we will become non Muslims while investigating the past of the region. I also subscribed to this theory as a kid, but seeing the historical buildings especially taxila I have come to a different conclusion.
Re: Sindh Through Centuries!
The difficulty to progress in thread and randomness is due to this reason 
Re: Sindh Through Centuries!
I know, we should embrace our past and march ahead
Re: Sindh Through Centuries!
Sindhis are hardly 10% in Karachi. Migrants do change lifestyles, but I would rather call internal factors like Waderashahi reason for sufferings of Sindhi than others.
Exactly when millions of Pushtoons can make Karachi their home? Why cant people from Sindh? Probably its because people do not want to leave their birthplaces!
Re: Sindh Through Centuries!
Exactly when millions of Pushtoons can make Karachi their home? Why cant people from Sindh? Probably its because people do not want to leave their birthplaces!
I think its a misunderstanding and generalization that has developed over the years.
We got a character in our folklore of Sassi, who went on to find her lover from Bhanbhor to Makran. So mobility is in our roots. Look at Sindhi Hindus who traveled to far east countries and establish their business even before partition. There are some views that the famous character of Sindbad was a Sindhi.
Over the periods, there have been some hindrances for mobility of Sindhi from their areas to other. Lack of Education remained one major reason. As the ratio of educated Sindhis increasing their presence in urban areas of Pakistan and outside Pakistan has also increased.
Due to 1980s-1990s Sindhi-Muhajir clash, people from rural Sindh were hesitant to move to Karachi. This is the same era, when Afghan refugees and migrants from Pashtun areas started settling in Karachi.
Re: Sindh Through Centuries!
Sindh was one of the most prosperous provinces of India before the arrival of English - with Thatta being the centre of education in India! The historic ruins of the district tells you how advanced were the people of Sindh during that time. But things keep on changing in the history of nations - if they abandon education thats what happen to them like the example of the Greek people!
Re: Sindh Through Centuries!
As per Wikipedia, Raja Dahir was Brahmin :)
Re: Sindh Through Centuries!
As per Wikipedia, Raja Dahir was Brahmin :)
so Brahmins can't be king otherwise? As per Islamopedia, he married his sister.
Re: Sindh Through Centuries!
so Brahmins can't be king otherwise? As per Islamopedia, he married his sister.
They can be anything they want :D, they made the rules then :D
May be it might have been case of incest, otherwise Pundas don't marry in same gothra, same paternal lineage. Like my Kiddos are Vashistha, so every
punda with Vashistha lineage becomes their brother and sister. Same is with me Jatwise :)
Re: Sindh Through Centuries!
They can be anything they want :D, they made the rules then :D
May be it might have been case of incest, otherwise Pundas don't marry in same gothra, same paternal lineage. Like my Kiddos are Vashistha, so every punda with Vashistha lineage becomes their brother and sister. Same is with me Jatwise :)
They say that it was due to control over rule. same story as Cleopatra.
Re: Sindh Through Centuries!
They say that it was due to control over rule. same story as Cleopatra.
this is the most logical explanation possible. According to hindu system, many of the muslims who marry their own cousins are already committing crime by mixing same bloodlines :)
Re: Sindh Through Centuries!
But punjab has pulled ahead especially if you see faislabad, sialkot, gujranwala. It wasn't long ago that hyderabad used to be the third largest city in Pakistan, but now tons of punjabi cities have come ahead with industrialization and the resultant boon in population.
KP could go ahead as well if PTI delivers in the province.
Balochistan can be developed well (has much but low population base) so this just leaves interior sindh as a developmental and economic black spot in Pakistan.
I agree. You do get the impression that Sindhis are quite rigid about their identity, and too absorbed in self pleasing romanticism. The real tragedy of all is that xenophobia really sells in Sindh. There’s this perpetual fear, anxiety and scorn for ‘outsiders’. Either someone is a saint or everyone else is the enemy, and it is usually the locals who are the saints. Why is it that Pakistan can have one President and two widely popular Prime Ministers from Sindh, but no one from outside of Sindh is good enough for Sindh? What makes Sindh so special? You look at Larkana the supposed City – and it looks like a glorified village. The shame inducing fact is that this supposed village like City is the one ex-President and two ex Prime Ministers of Pakistan.
KPK, despite its inelastic and temperamental tribal culture and religious conservatism, has the most impressive record political evolution. It seems KPK is the only province that seems to reject parties that do not perform, and experiment with new socio-political ideas. On the other hand, you have Punjab which literally had a love affair with all the rulers, be it dictators or democratically elected, be it local or from a different province. It’s been a home of movements and birth place of ideas. As a result, all leaders – to certain significant extent - always felt some kind of pressure or self-interested obligation to woo the public of Punjab through meaningful developments or providing ideological vigour. Baluchistan has serious population and insurgency issues, KPK had been the home ground for all religious experiments that manufactured the religious extremism and violence that made province the biggest victim of the War, but what exactly is Sindh’s excuse for being so behind in time? Take Karachi out of Sindh (which is a home of many different ethnicities and is ‘built’ by immigrants) what is Sindh? Why is there no such thing as progressive Sindhi middle class which is political enlightened and empowered and really believes in breaking the vicious cycle they they’re in? Why Sindhis have reduced down to mute passive spectators, and why arm chair cynicism has become the only ‘sign’ of intellectualism, and why is that they cannot look beyond habitual critiquing?
Unfortunately, for Sindh and rest of the subcontinent, we have moved far away from the age where we would always be blessed with a local 'saint' to fall in love with and comfort ourselves. Time to get practical.
Re: Sindh Through Centuries!
I agree. You do get the impression that Sindhis are quite rigid about their identity, and too absorbed in self pleasing romanticism. The real tragedy of all is that xenophobia really sells in Sindh. There’s this perpetual fear, anxiety and scorn for ‘outsiders’. Either someone is a saint or everyone else is the enemy, and it is usually the locals who are the saints. Why is it that Pakistan can have one President and two widely popular Prime Ministers from Sindh, but no one from outside of Sindh is good enough for Sindh? What makes Sindh so special? You look at Larkana the supposed City – and it looks like a glorified village. The shame inducing fact is that this supposed village like City is the one ex-President and two ex Prime Ministers of Pakistan.
KPK, despite its inelastic and temperamental tribal culture and religious conservatism, has the most impressive record political evolution. It seems KPK is the only province that seems to reject parties that do not perform, and experiment with new socio-political ideas. On the other hand, you have Punjab which literally had a love affair with all the rulers, be it dictators or democratically elected, be it local or from a different province. It’s been a home of movements and birth place of ideas. As a result, all leaders – to certain significant extent - always felt some kind of pressure or self-interested obligation to woo the public of Punjab through meaningful developments or providing ideological vigour. Baluchistan has serious population and insurgency issues, KPK had been the home ground for all religious experiments that manufactured the religious extremism and violence that made province the biggest victim of the War, but what exactly is Sindh’s excuse for being so behind in time? Take Karachi out of Sindh (which is a home of many different ethnicities and is ‘built’ by immigrants) what is Sindh? Why is there no such thing as progressive Sindhi middle class which is political enlightened and empowered and really believes in breaking the vicious cycle they they’re in? Why Sindhis have reduced down to mute passive spectators, and why arm chair cynicism has become the only ‘sign’ of intellectualism, and why is that they cannot look beyond habitual critiquing?
Unfortunately, for Sindh and rest of the subcontinent, we have moved far away from the age where we would always be blessed with a local 'saint' to fall in love with and comfort ourselves. Time to get practical.
what do you mean by rigid about their identity? Do you mean that they say that they are first Sindhi and then Muslims and Pakistani? If they do so, they follow chronology. :)
As far as political evolution is considered, I would recommend you to read history of agitation against One-Unit from 1955 to 1970 and MRD in 1980s. You will learn that while others were sleeping, it was Sindhi middle class and peasants who raised voice against the injustice. If afterwards, they didn't show active agitation, it doesn't mean that there is no history for raising against atrocities or this will be permanent feature. Being in this sorry state, they still show solidarity over issues like Kala bagh Dam.
BTW if we were that afraid and scornful of outsiders, we haven't accommodated all the migrants in every era of history and converted to minority in our major cities. I call my ancestors hospitable to the extent of foolishness.
So you think only Sindhis are arm chair critiques? How much do you know about Sindhi intellectuals? Have you read Dr Nabi Bux Baloch? Heard name of Ibrahim Joyo or Sobho GianChandani? Ever heard about Shaikh Ayaz and Dr Sirajul Haq Memon? They have invested in new generation and rest assured that this will soon bring a real change in Sindhi society. As I already said in this thread 'Change in Sindh is inevitable, that will happen if not due to conviction then due to frustration'.