Sikhism in comparison to Hinduism (an opinionated view)

Society Religion & Philosophy
1

I want to make a clarification on one note, when Hindu’s try to design Sikhism as almost a sect of Hinduism, which extremely bothers me a (non-religious Sikh), and even many other Sikhs.

Lets begin by clarifying that Sikhism is NOT a combination of two religions (Islam and Hinduism). Sikhism is more of a FILTERATION of the two religions. This is entirely different than combination.

Now, I’ve seen many posts in these forums when a certain individuals whom I rather not name, have defended Hinduism by using Sikh principles (and inadvertently made these two religions the same). It is, funny these days alot of non-indians do not even know the difference between Hindu’s and Sikh’s, which is sad, considering Sikhism is almost a direct contrast, and OPPOSITE of Hinduism in almost every way, ie, equality, sexual equality, montheistic, no idol worship, and the list goes on.

Sikhism and Hinduism only share one philosophy, that is the concept of reincarnation, and even then the concept isn’t directly the same, in Sikhism the cycle can be broken easily to attain salvation with God. Whereas, Hindu’s defiably have a set number of lives ( 32,000,000 I believe? )you must go through if you mess up in Human life, to return to Human life to become good and then attain salvation.

In addition, in Sikhism we don’t have mandatory rituals or practices. All Sikhism requires is to meditate the word of God all through life and live honest and truthful and hardworking life. The Sikh does not even have to ever attend the Gurdwara to do this, nor does he have to make a pilgrimage to Harmandar Sahib (Golden temple). In addition, the Sikh is not even required to even read the granth sahib if he knows the first few sections of the Granth Sahib (which I believe is the Japji), which similar to Islam is where it states, God is all powerful, merciful and benevolent etc.

and, we have ONE BOOK, the Eternal Guru (Granth Sahib), he is the official 11th Guru, and is regarded as a living guru itself, and treated with the same respect as you would of a man, in fact the Granth Sahib is usally given it’s own room, like you would do for a guest.

In addition, the major contributing factor that seperated Hinduism and Sikhism, is Sikhism’s obvious principles to help people who are oppressed and to fight against injustices. This is strictly mentioned in the Guru Granth Sahib and is carried out. In Hinduism, they tend to believe that the evils oppressing them is due to what God has bestowed upon them (ie; their bad karma, they deserve it due to what they did in their past life etc), and for them to fight against it, is going against God(s). (Such as the Hindu low castes as the Sudras). A natural Sikh, when seeing an injustice to any man, of any religious belief, will fight for that man if he sees fit that he is being oppressed unjustly, regardless of his skin colour, religion, caste etc. One of our Guru’s in fact lost his head in execution because he gave his life saving Hindu’s only in Delhi to prevent their forcible conversion into Islam, by Emperor Akbar (or Aurangzeb).

As an Atheist, I respect Sikhism and still consider myself as an Atheistic Sikh. Because, it teaches much more than God. It teaches, how to fight against the in and unjust and opression, respect and equality for all of man kind, and for committing one’s self to hard work and truthful living (which is almost similar to socialistic/communistic beliefs). This all can be done without even mentioning God in the context.

Arai

2

Can I ask you why you bow to that book thing(is it a book?) I'm asking this out of curiosity!! so don't take if offensive!

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arai thanks for the information but does not the Indian constitution itself hint that Sikhs, Buddhists and Jains are merely Hindu's?

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Do not see any immediate reason for this thread. I do not see anyone claiming sikhism as sect of hinduism here and sikhs like banta and rani that took lot of pains to defend hinduism did it because they felt what was going on was junk propaganda. Given that u claim pork is forbidden to sikhs (in other thread) and cycle of reincarnation can not be broken in Hinduism (in this thread) I have doubts on how much youn know either religion. So why not stick to topics that you know well, e.g britney spears.

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So why not stick to topics that you know well, e.g britney spears.

ZZ, thats not very nice...

They shoot partypoopers, don't they?

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ZZ said -

" Do not see any immediate reason for this thread. I do not see anyone claiming sikhism as sect of hinduism..."

Like the Indian constitution you mean?

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i think arais post is meant for rani and banta singh so that they may undertsand that
sikhism and hinduism is 2 separate religions.

arai, thanks for telling me the difference between hinduism and sikhism.......its a very big difference.

8

malik, hindu code bill is discussed before and it is a modern law hardly to do anything with any religion. hasn't it. u cant wake up those pretending to sleep. unlike muslim code bill, hindu code bill is not a religious law and the person who wrote it was not a buddhist.

i donno why discussions here go in circles.

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I understand that ZZ but it has allowed the impression (confirmed by the US state dept) that some Hindu's view Sikhs, Buddhists or Jains as merely Hindu's - rightly or wrongly thats the impression the constitution has engendered?

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There are Hindus who have different opinion and there are sikhs, buddhists and jains who have this opinion. People can have different opinions. Right! Padmaraj Jain was a head of hindu mahasbha. (in fact jains are very active in BJP today.) master tarasingh was a founder member of vishva hindu parishad and wanted a saffron flag for independent india. So it depends on whom u talk to.

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Exactly ZZ and you see where the confusion and room for misunderstanding comes in?

[This message has been edited by Malik73 (edited October 20, 2000).]

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arai,

I have never said Sikhs and Hindu are one and same religion. I don't claim to be scholar in Sikhism but i seem to have lot more in depth knowledge of Sikhism than you. Anybody who believes in Guru Granth Sahib is a Sikh.

I will not go into lot of detail because of the time constraints:

Can you tell me why Guru Govind Singh offered following prayer to the lord shiva when he went on war with the Mogul armies: he did it because at that time Sikhism was not a seperate relgion, we all were Hindus:

"Deh Shiva var mohay shub Karman sai Kahbi na Daru.
Rann mai jab ayai varo nichay kar apani jeet karo"

Translation: Oh lord Shiva give me this blessing that i am never afraid to do the right thing. When i go to fight for the true cause (right cause) please give me blessings that i will fight to the end and be victorious.

Sikhism started as a reform movement of Hinduism when Guru Nanak was asked by muslim ruler who he was he replied:

Hindu kahiya tay mariya, mussalman mai nahi,
panch tut ka putla nanak maira naau,

Translation: if you i call myself hindu you will beat me up and i am not muslim. I am made up of five elements and nanak is my name.

Word Ram is used more than thousand times in Guru Granth Sahib.

The most fundamental principal of Sikhism is that is many paths (religions) lead to one God nobody is superior or inferior.

Sikhism shares lot of philosphy with Hinduism the most important one being concept of Karma (you reap what you sow ) and reincaranation.

Sikhism rejects all meaningless rituals. It doesn't believe in Prophethood, we call our religious sagas, Gurus (teachers) they never said they were messengers of God.

If you believe that Sikhism is the only path as Islam believes, then you will be rejecting the very basis on which Sikhism stands. I think you mean well but you have superficial knowledge of Sikhism and also of other religions you are trying to compare Sikhism with.

[This message has been edited by Rani (edited October 20, 2000).]

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arai

I want to make a clarification on one note, when Hindu's try to design Sikhism as almost a sect of Hinduism, which extremely bothers me a (non-religious Sikh), and even many other Sikhs.
Lets begin by clarifying that Sikhism is NOT a combination of two religions (Islam and Hinduism). Sikhism is more of a FILTERATION of the two religions. This is entirely different than combination.

After reading my answer i realized i may not have answered your original question. No Sikh thinks that Hinduism and Sikhism are same religion otherwise there will be no need to have seperate gurdawaras and holy book. Sikhs believe in Guru Granth Sahib but they also respect other relgions and stand up against tyranny.

Sikhism became a seperate religion to protect Hindus from onslaught of muslim armies and to stop forcible conversions. Sikhs actively fought zulm aganist all Indians regardless of their religion. Sikhs and Hindus are both people of the same soil even majority of the muslims from Indian subcontinent belong to same group of people, although they want to think of themselves as Arabian or Persians. They have alway claimed that they feel bond toward all muslims and don't care for non-muslim Indian due to religion.

Sikhs and Hindus share centuries old cultural and historical heritage and are people of the same soil. To me religion is personal it should not stand in the way of attachment you feel for your own group.

[This message has been edited by Rani (edited October 20, 2000).]

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master tarasingh was a founder member of vishva hindu parishad and wanted a saffron flag for independent india. <<

ZZ, can you please give the reference where you got the info about master Tara Singh being founding member of VHP? I know he wanted saffron because Kesari nishan is the flag of Khalsa.

Rani, if from your indepth knowledge of Sikhism...shiva, ram, bhagwan, govind,madho, jagdish,hari are the people whom GGS refers and worships as gods then Sikhs are certainly Hindus. If Guru Gobind Singh worshiped Shiva, a Hindu god then your claim that Sikhism is a different religion than hinduism is naive.

15

Chan

Thanks for your sarcasm which at the best achieves nothing. You are very welcome to offer your opinion.

Khalsa in this present form come about to fight tryanny. Before this there were followers of Sikh Gurus but there was no Khalsa. Obiviously Guru Goving didn't think he was doing anything wrong by refering to God as "Shiva" or Sikh gurus didn't think it was wrong to call God "Ram" a hindu name more than thousand times in Guru Granth.

It is radiculous we are having this debate when Sikh gurus didn't erect firm bounderies between religions and did not hestitate to use name of hindu Gods and considered all human beings equal.

Instead of critizing me give me your version as to why he prayed to Shiva...saying that he was just praying to God is not sufficient because Shiva is specifically "Hindu God of war"...if wanted Sikhism to be so seperated from hinduism he would not have uttered name of Hindu God (Shiva) in his prayer.

In my humble opinion Sikhism was initially started as a reform movement of Hinduism and and acquired its present mode to fight tyranny.

[This message has been edited by Rani (edited October 20, 2000).]

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. Sikhs believe in Guru Granth Sahib but they also respect other relgions and stand up against tyranny.<<

So Sikhs are supposed to stand up against any tyrant? right
(When one tries to separate Sikhism from Hinduism, why you take it as if the peosn is insulting Hinduism or their right to their religion? They have as much right to pray or follow their religion as they wish as much as I do as a Sikh. I will respect their right to do so.)

Sikhism became a seperate religion to protect Hindus from onslaught of muslim armies and to stop forcible conversions.
<<

oh no not any tyrant but against the only ones who do zulam on Hindus.

Rani, Sikhism started with Guru Nanak Dev ji. Tell me how he was protecting Hindus from onslaught of Muslims? was it when he gave up the janeyoo that Pandit Har Dayal wanted him to wear? or was it when he was throwing water towards Kartarpur instead of Sun? DOn;t tell me you were refering to the sacrifice of Guru Teg Bahadur. You said "sikhism became separate religion". Sikhism became separate religon the day Guru Nanak refused to wear janeyoo. Guru Teg Bahadur would have given his life to protect any oppressed regardless of his religion. Or you say that he was biased and would have not stood up if oppressed were say Budhists or oppressors were not Muslims? You think he would have sadi to Bhudists" Please go away and suffer or give up your religion. I am here only to protect Hindus"?? Tell me would your Teg Bahadur would have said that? Mine certainly would have gone with them and given his life for anyone who wanted protection of his religion.

Anyways, Now Hindus are self sufficient to protect themselves. Give up your sikhi rutt and wear your janeyoo back and vajja some talliyan in the local mandir. Bhagwan will forgive you.

[This message has been edited by ChannMahi (edited October 20, 2000).]

[This message has been edited by ChannMahi (edited October 20, 2000).]

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Obiviously Guru Goving didn't think he was doing anything wrong by refering to God as "Shiva" or Sikh gurus didn't think it was wrong to call God "Ram" a hindu name more than thousand times in Guru Granth. Do you think he was Sikh and Khalsa and thought he was different than Hindus when he prayed and refered to God Shiva. Even if he did he didn't hesitate to take name of hindu God.
<<

Rani, is Guru Gobind Singh "refering to God as Shiva"? or he "prayed and refered to God Shiva."? Please clarify to this confused Sikh.

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VHP website says so. I am not finding it right now. But there is also Acharya Sushil Kumar among the founders (he was jain)

On saffron flag, in fact there were plenty more supporters including ambedkar, if i remember righ, there was flag comittee which recommended saffron flag. But gandhi did not budge. i cant get the references right now.

if i remember right, even ardaas starts with 'chandi de vaar..' complete delinking of sikhism with hinduism is a recent political exercise. one could argue that it is a separate religion and that is fine by me. but if u are going to tell that sikhism is more like islam than hinduism or that it is equidistant from two, it smells politics.

[This message has been edited by ZZ (edited October 20, 2000).]

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Anyways, Now Hindus are self sufficient to protect themselves. Give up your sikhi rutt and wear your janeyoo back and vajja some talliyan in the local mandir. Bhagwan will forgive you.

Why...what is your problem did i asked you what should i do, keep your advice to yourself,. Actually people intolerant of any other point of view and cannot discuss anything without personal attacks, like yourself are better candidate for "Janau". So every Sikh that thinks that Sikhism started as a reform movement of Hinduism should go back to Hinduism. Sant Kabir started this reform movement 100 year before Nanak came on the scene ...read his vani and you will find out.

Nanak rejected hindu rituals which he found meaningless, he was trying to reform the religion which had become mired in rituals and class system.

BTW, my sikhi rutt is none of business you can continue with your hatred towards Hindus ..i don't want to fall into your trap of hating others.

P.S. I am sorry i cannot help to solve your confusion...i have told you the way i understand it...you don't have to take my word for it, i am sure you are capable of finding your answers.

20

Can I ask you why you bow to that book thing(is it a book?) I'm asking this out of curiosity!! so don't take if offensive!<<

Desert Fox, Sikhs are supposed to bow only in front of their Guru. As none of the ten Gurus is alive, and last Guru Gobind Singh gave the Guruship to The Granth(book), In Sikhism Guru Granth Sahib is the last Guru. Guru is teacher, master who guides you to the true path of God. It does not have to be a human form. So it is The Granth. In Sikhism you bow and pray only in front of Guru Granth Sahib who guides you to the path of God. Sikhs are not supposed to bow in front of any Pictures/painting of previous gurus, any gurdwaras, any buildings, any symbols etc. but only in front of Guru Granth Sahib which is the word of their previous Gurus and many other Saints.