here is a link, try listening to the sikh poet praising Islam and telling some facts about Islam.
http://www.mushaira.org/audio/bedi1.ram
Masooma
P.S YOU NEED REAL PLAYER TO LISTEN TO IT
[This message has been edited by Masooma (edited August 13, 2000).]
As far as I know Baba Guru Nanak was great MUSLIM sufi who even went to perform Haj.Imagine the degree of his devotion he traveled across continent for this purpose.He even went to Banaras to find commonality in religions.He was born in hindu household.And believed in One God.Whom he affectionately called "Wahe Guru".He NEVER declared a separate religin in his life time.Formal Sikhism was formed hundreds of year after him.Sikhs developed separate identity for unity against onslaught of Mughals.Even foundation stone of their holiest of shrine "Golden Temple" was laid by greatest Muslim sufi saint Of his time Hazrat Mian Meer.You have to understand Sufis do not divisive but inclusive.They have romantic version of concept of God and religion.Which at times disagrees with conventional"wisdom".
If Guru Nanak ji performed haj, as far as i know, only muslims are allowed to enter Makka Shareef,so that makes Guru Nanak a muslim,but sikh people don't consider Guru ji as a muslim?
Masooma
Sikh's are probably the hardest to be converted to Islam, this is amazing Sikhs becoming muslims for our time.
Kingshah, so who is easier to convert? You seem to have lot of experience in this area.
Bulleh Shah ji, read Guru Nanaks' writings he talks about Guru and Sikh, manmukh and gurmukh, he slected the next Guru of Sikhs to follow himself, gave him Guruship and bowed(matha taik) in front of him(2nd Guru, Guru Angad Dev ji) to continue the lineage. Non-Muslims were allowed to visit Mecca back then. Also, he went to Mecca and other parts of middle east but did not actually perform Hajj. Is just visiting the Mecca-Madina town considered a Hajj?
It is great that so many Muslims consider him a great sufi and go as for as calling him one of their own......such is the effect of his words and actions.....All Sikhs believe Baba Sheik Farid was a great Sikh and consider him one of their own as they consider Bhagat Kabir one of their own too.
anyways, I could ot open the real audio file at work. Bedi is a Urdu poet, what is he saying? Can anyone write it here please?
Sure Channmahi ji,
"Delhi mai ek baar muslim conference hoiee, mujhai bhi bulaya gaiya,sab nai aitaraaz kiya kai ye muslim nahi phir kion bulaya gaiya, mujhai bulaya gaiya aur mai gaiya
nazam lambi hai ,mai arz karta hou
*hum kisi deen(mazhab) sai hou kail-e-kirdaar to hai
hum sana-khan-e-shah-e-haider-e-karaar to hai
Naam laiwa hai Muhammad kai paristaar to hai
yaani majboor bar-e-Ahmade mukhtaar to hai
Ishq hojai kisi sai koi chara to nahi
sirf muslim ka Muhammad sai idara to nahi
Mairi nazrou mai to Islam Muhabbat ka hai naam,
amn ka ashqi ka mehro-muravvat ka hai naam,
ufat-e kalb ka,ikhlaas-o-akhuwat ka hai naam,
takhta-e-daar pai bhi haq-o-sadakat ka hai naam,
maira Islam likho naam mai badnaam nahi
baat itni hai kai AAM YE ISLAM NAHI.*
agai chalta ho Hazrat-e-Ali karam halawajo ki shaan mai,mai hazrat ali ka motikir ho, humarai punjab mai aaj bhi jab gair-muslim kushti kai akhaarai mai utartai hai to YA-ALI MADAT
ka naara lagaatai hai, ye tareekhi waqaiya hai
arz karta hou
aap sai musalmaano sai khaas toor par mukhatib hokar arz karta hou
tu to har deen kai har door kai insaan ka hai
kam kabhi bhi teri toqeer na hoonai daingai
hum salamat hai zamaanai mai to INSH-ALLAH tujhko is qoum ki jageer na hoonai daingai
IMAAM shohda kai barai mai chaar misrai sun leejeeyai
*Zinda Islam ko kiya tuunai,
Haq-o-Batil dekha deeya tuunai,
jee kai marna to sabko ata tha,
mar kai jeena seekha deeya tuunai
Lab pai Shah-e-Shaheedan tera naam ata hai
Saamnai saqeeyai koosar leeyai jaam ata hai
Mujhko bhi apni gulaami ka sharaf dai deejo
khota sika bhi to kabhi kaam ata hai
============================================
I tried my best to write word by word but it will be better if you listen to it, anyways
hoon jai tusi urdi wi samajhdai oo then u will understand these ishaars.
Masooma
Chanmahi ji living in a country surrounded by muslims you seem to figure out what the story is behind every religion.
Guru Nanak Dev ji went everywhere with his two companions, Bhai Bala ji (hindu) and Bhai Mardana ji (muslim). When he had finished his three of the udasis (his travels in three directions to spread the word), Bhai Mardana ji humbly requested Baba Nanak ji to do the fourth udasi in the westerly direction so that he could also do the hajj. Guru ji agreed and set of in the westerly direction for the fourth udasi and they arrived in Mecca.
Guru Nanak Dev ji was kicked by the attendent of the Quaba in the morning and was told that he was a kaffir because he was sleeping with his feet towards the house of God.
Guru Nanak Dev ji very humbly responded to the person who had kicked him and asked him to turn his feet in the direction where there was no house of God. Which ever direction guru ji's feet were turned, the attendent could see the Quaba turn in the same direction. After many attempts, when he could not find a direction in which the Quaba was not visible, he fell to Baba Nanak's feet and asked for forgiveness. Guru ji forgave him and told him that God resides in all directions.
So, there is a lesson here for you Muslims from Baba Nanak, When you want to pray to Allah the allmighty, it is not important at all to face towards the Quaba. Allah is everwhere and resides in every direction.
Banta ji thank you, we muslims already know that Allah is everywhere, when we offer our prayer it is told that we face Kaba shareef if we know the direction but if we don't know, it doesn't matter we can still say our prayer facing any direction.
We know Guru nanak ji was a great man, we respect him whole heartedly and consider him as a muslim. Now the question about he being a muslim or non-muslim is a mystery, who knows what his faith was, only GOD knows that, all we know is he was a great human being.May Allah rest his soul in peace, ameen.
Masooma
Bantha ji like Masooma ji said, we muslims know that allah is everywhere, this is one of the first thing Islam teaches you "ALLAH IS ALL AROUND YOU" in your heart, soul therefor its not a new lesson to us. I have looked into many religions, I found out that Islam is the only religion which give allah "the almighty" the highest status.
sikhs seem to praise more shia islam than sunni islam. that's why they always come to pakistan during muharram. one sikh came to our mosque and said the same thing written above and everyone lifted him up on their shoulders
[This message has been edited by 2PaK (edited August 14, 2000).]
Guru Nanak never considered himself a muslim or a hindu,"Na koi Hindu,Na koi Mussalman"
Yes Ranjit,
You are absolutely right, he was neither a Hindu nor a Muslim. He went everywhere with a Hindu on his one side and a Muslim on the other. He was born to Hindu parents and whilst he made pilgrimmage to the Hindu places of worship he also made pilgrimmage to the Muslim places of worship, treating good things of both the religions with same respect and at the same time condemning the wrong practices of both the religions.
You can go back as far back as Baba Adam in the Middle Eastern religions and to Lord Rama or Lord Krishna in the indian religions, only two Apostles of God will come to mind, who never had any threat to their lives and had no enemies in their lifetime, and never had to pick up any weapons to protect themselves. These two great Apostles of God were 'Mahatama Budha' and 'Baba Guru Nanak Dev ji'
Lot of people would like to say that if he was not a hindu and not a muslim then he has to be a sikh. Sorry, but they would also be wrong in saying that. The word 'Guru' means a teacher and 'Sikh' means a pupil. All the followers of Guru Nanak Dev ji's teachings, Hindus or Muslims, from during his lifetime or from today are Sikhs. He was the Guru (teacher) we are the Sikhs (pupils).
As far as we Sikhs are concerned, Hazrat Mohammed Sahib was not the last paigamber, as muslims would like to believe and neither was Guru Nanak. The all mighty will never stop sending his paigams to his loved ones as long as the Human race exists.
Well, if He felt the need to make alterations to his Paigams which He had sent through Hazrat Musa and Hazrat Isah, then I'm sure that the world moving so fast, He must have felt the need to send new Paigams which can be appropriate to the later times. I'm totally convinced that under no circumstances God could have said that Hazrat Mohammed was the last Paigamber.
whats the total sikh population in the world? any estimates?
and whoever said sikhs are not easy to convert… etc. well wake up my friend and take a look in Pakistani punjab. i can count ten friends of mine whose great grandfathers were sikhs and then converted to Islam.
A good friend of mine who was a sardar converted to Islam a month or so ago here in U.S. The stories of sikhs getting kicked in their groins for sleeping in the direction of Kaba and other doesnt surprise me… you can definitely digup more horrendous stuff in hindutva websites. If muslims were only kicking sikhs and hindus in their groins… and not showing them the righteous path, you wouldnt not see a single muslim in india or anywhere else in the world for that matter.
The Sikh population is about 20 million,50 years ago there were about 6 million. Your friends grandfathers probably became muslim during partition when they had no choice because they wanted to keep their lands.
read again i said great grandfather... our great grandfathers weren't alive during partition. Was urs?
Once again Ranjit
You are absolutely right. All those Sikhs and Hindus who converted to Islam about 53 years ago did so because to them their wealth was more valuable than their pride, or on the other hand they converted because otherwise they would have been killed during the partition, by the Muslims of now Pakistan.
During the times of Mogul Emperor Aurangzeb about 300 years ago every tactic was adopted to ensure as much conversion to Islam as possible. Everyday, Aurangzeb would only have his dinner if there were enough 'jenneoo' equivelant to his body weight. The only way you could get the jenneoo off of a Hindu person's neck was either by converting him through fear or greed or by beheading him. The brave ones like the 9th Guru Teg Bahadur chose not to convert and were beheaded but there were some coward Hindus also, who in order to stay alive and to get rewards chose to convert.
There is no doubt that a large percentage of the Pakistanis today are the offspring of those cowards who converted to Islam in order to stay alive and become wealthy.
"Sikh's are probably the hardest to be converted to Islam"
Nope dear, my great grandfather was sikh but he converted to Islam and so did his brothers,father,mother and the whole khandaan.Alhamdulillah!
Sikhs treat muslims better than hindu's do because they try following Guru Nanaks teachings which was respect for Islam and other relegions as well.Hindusim teaches cast system,probably thats one reason why hindus are raciest.
Anyways,someone also mentioned that sikh praise shai islam than sunni Islam, bhai shia ho ya sunni ho,hain to musalmaan,we both sects believe on ONE GOD, try following the same Prophet.I don't find anything wrong with both sects, they both have valid points and who is right,who is not is an unsolved mystery.
Masooma
banta singh ji,
"There is no doubt that a large percentage of the Pakistanis today are the offspring of those cowards who converted to Islam in order to stay alive and become wealthy"
This is absolutly wrong, i agree that some of the converts did so because they got scared,this was mostly during the time of partition,but when indo-pak was called subcontinent under the british rule, as far as i know hindus dominated muslims, there is no question about that,yes during that mughal rule muslims ruled but after that it was hindu population greater,as far as i know about my ancestors,that single guy converted because he found Islam the best relegion and than he tought rest of the family the right path,this was during the british rule,what about now,didn't u hear that a whole village converted to Islam in indi.a?who are they scared of?its a hindu govt
Masooma