Re: Shia Sunni Dialogue
Brother thanks for your detailed post.... Regarding my post i have cleared some points in replying to Brother Hanibal.... Now on the point you have objection and you quoted a Hadees I now will give reply to clear the difference between Dua and Worship.... Once this difference would be clear to us then many other things would also be clear to our eyes......
So to clear this view first of all we have to see that what are the meaning of Woship... To start with i want to give a base to clear this view.. *The Word Worship or In Arabic "Ibadat" or in Persian "Paristish" are very clear among all of us just like the word "Sky" and "Earth" are clear whether people may define these words or not but they know what actually they are.... *
The Word Worship is just like these words, we know the actuall meanings, its a different matter that for some people it is hard to explain the meaning of these words... *Say a lover kisses the walls of the house of beloved or may give respect to the dresses of beloved or spend lot of time and kisses the grave of beloved.... Whatever the case never in any nation or religion it is known as worship... everyone says that it is form and expression of Love... *
So the translation of Worship ""In terms of Islam, ibadah is the ultimate obedience, the ultimate submission, and the ultimate humility to God along with the ultimate love for him."" (wikipedia)
Refferencing Holy Quran Word Ibadat or to do Worship have come in three senses... 1. Worship to whom who is "Illah" 2. Worship to whom who is "Rub" 3. Worship to who is responsible for all Goddess works like granting life, Applying Death, Controling Sun & Moon and Day n Night etc etc...
For this purpose you may read The Following Ayaat... Sora Airaaf 59, 65, 73, Sora e Hood 5, 61, 84, Sora e Maayda 72 Sora e Aal e Imran 51 Sora e Mominoon 80 Sora e Inaam 61.....
Other than these three meaning there is not any other meaning of worship is there in Quran according to my knowldge...And the meaning of Shirk is that to think all these three meanings for whom who have not any capability stating in these meanings....
Brother ND
"Ilah, Rub and Creator/Sustainer" taht you mentioned are the ones who "should" be worshipped. You have not cleared what "worship" is in light of Quran. I haven't looked upon this subject frankly. But it will be interesting to look up to Quran to see what "worship" means and if "Dua/Prayer" is part of worship or not.
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So you can not say this Prayer a Shirk as i have clearly stated *we dont Pray to Hazrta Ali by considering Him God rather we believe that Hazrat Ali is very respectable in the Court of Allah Almighty and can transfer our request to Allah Almighty... And Allah Himself asks us to come in the Bargaah of Allah Almighty through some waseela.... *
So i think i have made myself clear if you have any other point then please state it.....
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This is a bit diffrent than what you earlier stated, which is
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We ask help from Hazrat Ali not in the sense that Hazrat Ali grant us like Allah Almighty.... Rather we do believe that Allah has given him some powers from which He grant us...
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Do you beleive in both?
We will discuss further after you reply on these issue.
And i am in no hurry so don't feel pressured to respond quickly.