Shia And Sunni Muslims

Society Religion & Philosophy
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If still any shias have doubt…hey can see the …“Original Scans from Books”…

yes …the arabic ayats and persians …clear cut form… here

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I have just ran throught this exhaustive list, which would be locked any moment.

Just out of topic if brothers and sisters who are willing to answer instead of mud slinging can answer few of my questions below, i will greatly appreciate your efforts. I know, its out of topic but answer my stupid questions.

Please dont give me any reference, if you can define it from you own knowledge fair enough otherwise dont even try ittttttttttt. Just joking go ahead.

Define Nasibi to me.

Define Khariji.

Explain incompleteness of the quran.

Define whether Quran is got more weight then the hadith.

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Salam SlaveofAllah


Khariji simply means the "expelled" and the very name of it hints that the group may not have kept this name themselves. In my opinion, this was a label contrived by the Umayyads who labelled any dissidant group by this term... hence there were a variety of uprisings, and all were dubbed as "khawariji".


My Shia and Sunni brothers/sisters both claim the incompleteness of the Quran IN THEIR OWN WAY.
- Shia brothers/sisters maintain that Quran in its current form was only a portion of much of the additional information that would have been good if it was retained, but is not vital to the Quran.
- Sunni brothers/sisters maintain that although the Quran is complete, it does not go into details and that is why you need Sunnah/Hadith (which takes you back to square one that it is not complete since one would have to rely on the Sunnah/Hadith to understand/interpret the message).

The Quran itself claims to be complete and mubeen and that God is its protector... My personal feeling is that there were no additional (lost) revelations, the order of the Quran is as it was when revealed ALL-AT-ONCE (not in piece-meal form) to the prophet, and delivered to people over the course of time. It was written and compiled in proper form on parchment/papyrus within his lifetime, and that we do not need any hadith AT ALL to understand what is it that God asks us to do.

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Define Nasibi please. Thanks hypnotix for a good reply.

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One who hates Ali bin Abi Talib [as] or according to a broad definition One who hates Ali bin Abi Talib [as] and prefer Muaiwyah.

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Nasabis = Shias, who claim to love ahlye bayat.

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AOA dear Br's

Especially Boy-nice and dawi-dil.
looking at the replies of boy nice , i need to change his name to boy bad and looking at dawi dil , i must call him bemaariye dil.

So my brothers please be logical and respectful to each other and respective school of thoughts. This is no way to debate or solve the issues or differences of 1400 years +/- .

so please be faith ful, sincere, short, precise and logical.
I am sure no one other than u 2 have time to read this many replies.

Do NOT TAKE IT NEGATIVE.

take care and khuda hafiz

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In case if your molvies with Nasibi tendencies had hidden the actual definition from you just because they are now are shameful of the fact that there are some Nasibi and Khariji characters in your principle books, and their piooner ones had good relations with those people, then let me enlighten you with correct definition :slight_smile:

In *“Lisan al Arab” page 762, Ibn Manzur *states:

“Nawasib are those who hate Hadhrath Ali, and embrace that hatred as part of their faith”

In *"Taj al Uroous page 277, Volume 4 Chapter “Al Ba Murtazi al Zubaydi” *we read:

“Nasibi are those who hate Ameer ul Momineen Ali bin Abi Talib (as) and take that enmity as part of their faith”.

"*“Tadhrib al Radhi” page 311 Allamah Jalaladeen as-Suyut *provides the following definition:

“Nasibi ideology means hating Ali and preferring Mu’awiya”.

“Hadiya al Sahil” ay adalta al Masail" page 96elaborates yet further:

“Nasibi ideology is a type of flawed character that is very bad, in its worst form is has a hatred for the Imam of Guidance Hadhrath Ali, and takes this as part of its Deen / Iman”.

If that is not suffice, then let me cite from Ahla Sunnah’s one of the important work “Siyar Alam al-Nubala” by Imam Dahabi. On its margin wirrten by by Shaykh Shu’aib al-Arnaout, we read:

من الناصبية وهم المنافقون المتدينون ببغضة علي رضي الله عنه ، سموا بذلك لأنهم نصبوا له وعادوه

“From Nasibiyah there comes Nasibi and they are hypocrites, they have made the hate of Ali as their religion. This name was given to them because they have made the hate of Ali as their aim of life (Nasbu) and had enmity for him”
Siyar Alam al-Nubala, Volume 4 page 37 (published in 1993 by Risalah foundation, Beirut. Lebanon)

Also see the definition of ‘Nasibi’ in famed Islamic dictionary 'Al-Qasmoos al-Muheet"

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Pagl are u educated at all?

and how old are you? my dear there are lots of backwards Pakistani ppl - i mean our illeteracy rate is significantly high, thats why i am usually very surprised when i find that often even the people who have access to computersand internet are this ignorant!

now lets see there are only about 1000 weblogs, and websites that could have given u this information. However u have chosen this forum to discuss this issue in such volatile times, and when all Muslims across the World are on the brink of what would be called “civil war”

millions are being spent to create propaganda for Muslims to kill each other! and in these times u have decided to discuss a hot topic htat u know will illicit ignorant comments from both shias and sunnis - and u must know will lead to hatred being created and promoted in the hearts of both shias and sunnis!

I dont understand it, are u truly a pagl, or are you this ignorant?

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who the hell hate the lion of God....

again...who the hell take sli enemity as a part of faith...plz...give a single name of this forum who did this...thankyou....

are you in your sesnse..who the hell prefer muavia to ali.....in deeds...respect...and knowledge etc....

again the same thing...what the heck is who made its aim of life...the hatred of one of the greatest sahabi of prophet(pbuh).......

so all your 5 definitions fails.....so that the answer......

by the way ..i am waiting for the reply of post 160.

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dual-i-dil here is my bud-dwa for you! i hope u see in your life-time before your family, before your own loved ones the kinds of pain you inflict on others!!!

this is the Iraqi body count website: http://www.iraqbodycount.org/

a washinton post report said that more then 655,000 iraqis have so far died. CNN reported tha 2.5% of the Iraqi population has been killed in the civil war!

Statistics show that every single person livingin Iraq knows someone, has some relative that has died in this war right now!!! and they are predicting that it will get worse! how much worse! when 2.5% of the population is wiped out! how much worse!!!

what will it take for you to realize that your “discussions” are not going to convert anyone, it will only create hatred which is now destroying Islam and costing so many lives!

but perhaps your bloody discussions and opinions are more important!

well i dont know where u live, but i pray from the bottom of my heart that it comes back to you! the differences the hatred you create that is ruining lives!!!

I PARY IT COMES BACK TO YOU!!!

I PRAY IT HAPPENS IN YOUR FAMILY! I PRAY IT HAPPENS IN YOUR BACKYARD!

you can not cause so much suffering int he world and get away with it!

and when u hurt ppl in the manner htat you do, believe that ba-dua it sticks!!

SO go on create those differences! I pray u all - all of u creating these differences, and hatred, i pray it comes back to you!

when they start exterminating Muslims in mass, maybe then u will realize, by then it will be too late!

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whether you call me "" beemari-a-dil """""or """"" tabeeba-i-dil """"""

i will not mind....you are just angry because i provided more than 60 proofs from your own books..with page no...vol no...edition...writer...date of printing.....place of printing...everything that.....all your great scholars till 5 century believe that quran is incomplete......altered and changed......and all these scholars are those on whose books...the whle shia doctrine is standing....so either accept that these all shia scholars are right and quran is incomplete......

or

accept that all these shia scholars are wrong and quran is complete...so since quran is complete...so means all these shia scholars are wrong.....thats implies....

which they have written in thier all books ...and the books...on which shia doctrine has pillars...are totally wrong......because they also wrote that quran is complete......so what these false scholars wrote in thier books about

*immamt ...a continuation of prophethood

  • wilayat of ali

*wisayat of ali

*saqlainai sagheer

*ali being superior to all prophets except last one

*ali has a right of caliphate after prophet(pbuh)

  • dirty and filthy remarks against companions

    All are totally wrong..wrong...wrong....and wrong.......because these all great scholars did fault in Quran matter...how could not they do it in above points...i have given........

and only 4 persons in 500 years "openly" accepted this quran as complete.....and in page 6...i alo discussed these 4 persons did it by the sSooper Dopper Formula of "Taqiyya"...so that all muslim ummah will not sent Lanat on this filthy concept that quran is incomplete......

and i have discussed in page 6 about Ibne qummi and other that in thier books..theytalked about quran missing and etc...and how they ranked ...the Sooper Dooper Formula of Taqiyya = Namaz

and said who will miss Taqiyya..will miss imaan ..on ali..allah and prophet(pbuh)........

Again to all shia brotheers and sisters......

plz...answer me....this post........

  1. all shia scholars are right and quran is incomplete....

2.all shia scholars wrong and quran is complete.......

plz plz...no Taqiyya.....

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these kinds of propaganda are to instigate sunni and sheite against each other.
so do not ever give any attention to this ignorance.
Allah does not like arrogance and loss of brother hood among Muslims.
wake up from this illusion of muslims being divisible into sheite and sunni - and even if there is a difference in the way the faith and its rituals are practiced - as muslims, we must respect the fact that we are from prophet’s decedents.
never again make sheite sunni look like they are actually pit against each other, because they are not.
and even if they are - those sunnis and sheites who are fair and considerate of each other, will do nothing but ought to denounce such abhorrence of each other, in each other’s hearts.

-dushwari

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plz..farwa..do not give me bud duas like that......i request you...plz...

i am trying to eradicate these differences...by giving the truth.....tell me....if shias of iraq ...helped with sunnis to fight unanimously against the big evil shaitana-i-kabeer ...should all this happen.....i am not supporting sui cde bombers which kill innocent people in iraq.....but why shias not fighted against USA..when they invaded thier country....

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and believe me...i do not started..as Faisal Bhai...previously commanded not to post anymore and we all respected that....but its your shia fellows who started this fight again...by giving "challenges" ......you can check in the thread """"A Questions to a shia """"......

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and you can also check that..and then tell me…who is responsible for that…

http://www.paklinks.com/gs/showthread.php?t=238272&highlight=shia+doctors+baghdad+sunni

~~~Ask any question~~~
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Mercenary you are a bigot who hates Muslims! i still am grappling with why you are on this forum! i dont care about your extensive virtual library, its irrelevant if you are reading all that you are reading with a bigoted mind!

you are not open-minded enough for us to have a proper diologue with you! its just not possible to have objective conversations with bigots! its just not!!!

so to the persons responding to merc. dont waste your time! the man is a bigot! and he intends to remain so...apparently!

Chat Soona Soona Laagay
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First of all everyone is fighting everyone right now in Iraq! shia's are fighting sunnis and americans, sunnis are fighting americans and shias, and americans are fighting everyone in iraq also! so everyone is killing everyone!

so whats needed isnt more fighting! whats needed is peace! A STOP TO ALL!!! fighting! i dont care who is fighting who! ALL of it needs to STOP!!!!!!! okay!

but hte reason for hte bloodbath is the growing hatred b/t shias and sunnis! which is being propagated! and you are furthering it on this website!!!

I dont care who asked which questions to whom! if u are contributing to creating divisions b/t shias and sunnis! if u say that sunnis are wrong/ that shias are wrong u are creating differences which are causing bloodshed in Iraq, pakistan all over the Muslims world! and it needs to stop!

And ofcourse if you are so insensitive that you know! YOU KNOW Muslims are dying.....and still u further this hate! that ofcourse when i see thousands of Muslims dying in one month! when i see mothers crying over thier lost children! and i see u being insensitive and contibuting to it! that u better stop dua-i-dil!

b/c everytime i read your hate laden posts - my heart burns! and i think of those widowed women and htose orphaned children, and i curse you!!!

so if u want me no give u such bud-duwa then be less selfish if u dont want it to come to your doorstep then stop pushing hate on the rest of muslims!

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You can check the second post of this thread when Pagal asked fatwa...i give that zaisi shias are quite moderate .......

you disputed the history..we accepted..as history can be disputed.....

you disputed the sahabs ..we accepted..as sm sahabas can be disputed.....

you disputed the ahadees..we accepted..as ahadees can be disputed.....

but ...but...but...ifsome will dispute the purest...the greatest..and the holiest gift of Allah Taala....."""""" Quran Majeed """"" by uttering some "bakwas" against its...incompleteness...deletion....loss and such nonesense etc....

i will not stop..by just seeing what is happening to the book of Lord !!!!!

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There are number of people (Nawasib and Khawarij) in the principle books of Ahle Sunnah who hated/cursed/abused Ali bin Abi Talib [as] and yet you people adore those munafiqeen, deem them as one of the Thiqa (most reliable) people in hadeeth.

[quote]

again...who the hell take sli enemity as a part of faith...plz...give a single name of this forum who did this...thankyou....

[/quote]

As above.

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are you in your sesnse..who the hell prefer muavia to ali.....in deeds...respect...and knowledge etc....

[/quote]

The followers of Muawiyah did.

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of life...the hatred of one of the greatest sahabi of prophet(pbuh).......again the same thing...what the heck is who made its aim
[/quote]

Nawasib, who else!

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so all your 5 definitions fails.....so that the answer......

[/quote]

You are a think head, those were not my defitions rather definitions advanced by Sunni scholars.