What makes you think that Hamid Gul types are in majority in Pakistan. Yes it is true that inspite of them being a tiny minority have played a significant role in shaping our policies and structure and I do admit that this mentality has a strong foothold in Pakistan and we as a nation have failed to stop these guys...
I dont think that ppls like Hamid Gul are in majority in Pakistan.
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However the point I want to put across my Indian friends is your failure to see your short comings. You made a sweeping statement that you have achieved tolerance, peace, and harmony in your society and you do not want to admit that likes of Modis, Varuns, and Thackreys play a significant role in your society. You guys are too much biased to see wrongs in Indian society...and fail to admit your failures. This kind of arrogant attitude was the reason for creation of Pakistan just like West Pakistani arrogant attitude created Bangladesh.
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We are well aware of our short comings brother. We know that we face a serious threat from religious fundamentalism. I have acknowledged several times on this forum that we have our share of Talibaans in Modis, Thackreys and Varuns. But what I want to underline is that these kind of ppls have been always sidelined by tolrant and peace-loving majority of our ppls. Had we been biased in seeing the wrongs in Indian society than ppls like Modis and Varuns would not be facing stiff resistance for their mentality from the society.....We admit presence of religious bigots in our society, if this is our failure.........than I m one to admit it. But they are still far far away from shaping our policies. And InshAllah will always be sidelined.
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As far as misconception of Islamic values being non tolerant exist in your mind and you become too judgemental to critisize these values. This frame of mind will not do any good in your society as you should not forget that you have 200 million muslims living in your country who live in a state of fear and are not able to express themselves freely when they see this kind of attitude against their faith.
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Where I critisized Islamic values? Now who is becoming too judgemental? Care to answer this? What misconceptions are U talking about? What is my attitude which is against Muslim's faith? care to answer? I only said that,
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While Jinnah's secularism can clash with Islamic society.
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Now may I know how can U remain secular and an Islamic society together? Secularism by Indian standards is that one is absolutely free to practise and propogate his or her religion. Those 200 million muslims U are talking about are not just living in India, they are as much Indians like any other Indian. India belong to them as much as to me or any other hindu or sikh or christian or even atheist. Why they are living in fear? Dont U watch Dr. Zakir Naik on peace tv telling to audience that Islam is only true religion and only way to jannah? even converting hindus live on his shows? Has he ever been persecuted for all this? And U are saying they are not able to express themselves. Students from all over the world come to India to learn Islam from Indian Islamic institutions, and U are trying to make things like muslims are opressed and second class citizens of India.
Can U answer this? Are these kind of freedom possible for hindus, Christians, Sikhs in Pakitan, now or ever? So Has Gandhi's values met the same fate as Jinnah's met in Pakistan?
Now U are most welcome to throw Gujrat, Modis, Varuns, Thackreys on my face, I m ready to blacken my face with that, but will that completely wipe out the achievements I just described?
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Jinnah's secularism does not clash with real Islamic values. However this is a seperate discussion which is not being discussed in this thread. What matters more is the attitude, mind frame, and biases against a certain community which is clear from your post...
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Well I may be wrong in thinking that Jinnah's and Gandhi's secularims were two different things. I can claim for sure that Gandhi's secularism clash with real Islamic values, now U plz enlighten me how Jinnah's secular values were different than that of Gandhi's. We can discuess this seperate discussion in another thread if U want, but plz let me know what were Jinnah's secular values we are talking about.
And plz also point out what attitude, mind frame, and biases are in my post that U needed to remind me. Hope U obilige.
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And let's forget the governments...Please come to Pakistan and introduce yourself as a Hindu Indian... you will see yourself the sort of welcome you get here...
When I was in India some of my friends stopped me from introducing myself as a Pakistani muslim in a gathering as being my close friends they did not want that someone should start misbehaving with me...so much for a tolerant society and your tall claims !!!
I hope you can see the difference !!!!
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I take strong exception of ur comments. While I dont deny the warmth and hospitality Pakistani ppls have shown to Indians, I often read these things to my utter pleasure in media.
But U cant say otherwise for Indians brother. I cant imagine that U had to concele ur identity in India for fear of misbehave. U have every right to use it for creating ur understanding for India and tolrant nature of Indians. I cant say anything but begging for apology for this behaviour. But believe me, Indians I know are not like that. I dont know what kind of Indians were they.
No, I reject this as a exceptional incident where a Pakistani has to hide his identity among Indians just for fear of being misbehaved. However this is very unfortunate, but not happens too often in India.
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assure you that I will think about what you say to the best of my ability... I hope you can do the same brother !!!
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InshAllah.
Biased much?!?!