As things stand on the ground, Pakistan lacks second strike capability in responding to Nuclear attacks from India. Due to our geography and the positioning of the Indian delivery systems, our Pakistan lies exposed.
What I was suggesting in terms of second strike capability was to have a military base in a different country bordering India. Guantanomo & Diego Garcia are such examples of bases under the control of the US. Perhaps we could negotiate a similar setup in Myanmar or Maldives.
Geopolitically, the proposition is tough, but an effort would be well worth it. If we can have another military base located in a different countries, we would be in a better position to move towards second strike capabilty. Hope the spectre of a Nuclear exchange never comes true, however we must be prepared to gve our enemy a fitting response!
RajputFury, please enlist the countries which you think can help Pakistan with such a matter, who will be so kind to give some space so as to establish a missile launching facility on their own land . If there is one country, which I can think of right now is China, but it will not require Pakistani missiles for that purpose . Besides, it is an open question as to whether China would want to escalate any nuclear exchange by participating in any such war . Besides, any fixed ground launching facility in some other country will face the same problem as any other fixed facility, i.e. , that of pre-emption, and not to mention attack on not just nuclear infrastructure, but other collateral and exonomic assets .
I do not think that Pakistan needs separate bases in other countries for a second strike . That's because it has mobile launchers, which are pretty difficult to find and pre-empt . Ofcourse, an underwater nuclear launch capability would be good too, but I doubt it is really required .
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*Originally posted by PegasusOnline: *
Besides, any fixed ground launching facility in some other country will face the same problem as any other fixed facility, i.e. , that of pre-emption, and not to mention attack on not just nuclear infrastructure, but other collateral and exonomic assets .
I do not think that Pakistan needs separate bases in other countries for a second strike . That's because it has mobile launchers, which are pretty difficult to find and pre-empt . Ofcourse, an underwater nuclear launch capability would be good too, but I doubt it is really required .
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Interesting points Pegasus.
I want to address the first paragraph. I don't think that the other country (where Pak. Missiles can be based) will face the same preemption problem because any Indian attack on a missile base in a different country will be an attack on that country as well. Nuclear exchanges never stay in the confines of a limited area so it would pretty much destroy that country as well. Now I see it as a deterrant because suppose India does get trigger happy and decides to launch, in my scenario, it would have to hit two DIFFERNT countries which would undoubtably look horrible in the International arena, plus the Pakistan response will be from two different locations. For example, if Maldives is the hypothetical country where our base is located, then we can cover South India.
As for your second point, I disagree. Pakistan can be obliterated if it faces an Indian onslaught whereas India still has the ability withstand an initial Pak. strike simple because it has a greater territory. I like the mobile launch idea or even the underwater idea, but the R& D required will take too long. I think in the meanwhile, we should be focusing on securing an off-shore base (for the lack of a better word).
I don't think China is an option- too many ramifications. I like Maldives very much. The grouping of the islands and the location make it a desirable location.
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*Originally posted by RajputFury: *
... Nuclear exchanges never stay in the confines of a limited area so it would pretty much destroy that country as well.
This whole idea is reminiscent of the Cuban missile crisis during the cold war. Looks like Pak is moving in the Soviet direction (in installments though)
Second strike capabilities would be better achieved by two means.
1) Submarines. If Pakistan can miniturise its warheads enough to fit inside an Exocet missile in the same way that France does, it would have the capability to deliver at least tactical nuclear warheads to economic targets such as Bombay and Calcutta. In the long run, we'd want to look at developing/purchasing submarines capable of launching nuclear-tipped ballistic missiles.
2) A less favourable option would be underground missile silos, such as the ones where most of the USA and USSR's missiles were based during the Cold War. Underground missile launch sites are fairly well protected against strikes
A third option
3) We could continue with our current policy of using exclusively mobile missiles. A second strike capability would exist by using missiles that would have survived the first strike through being hidden.
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*Originally posted by mAd_ScIeNtIsT: *
Second strike capabilities would be better achieved by two means.
1) Submarines. If Pakistan can miniturise its warheads enough to fit inside an Exocet missile in the same way that France does, it would have the capability to deliver at least tactical nuclear warheads to economic targets such as Bombay and Calcutta. In the long run, we'd want to look at developing/purchasing submarines capable of launching nuclear-tipped ballistic missiles.
2) A less favourable option would be underground missile silos, such as the ones where most of the USA and USSR's missiles were based during the Cold War. Underground missile launch sites are fairly well protected against strikes
A third option
3) We could continue with our current policy of using exclusively mobile missiles. A second strike capability would exist by using missiles that would have survived the first strike through being hidden.
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how it will protect pakistna's security it will be wiped off the map
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*Originally posted by rvikz: *
how it will protect pakistna's security it will be wiped off the map
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2 words.
Nuclear deterrent. A second strike capability protects Pakistan's security by discouraging anyone from threatening Pakistan's security in the first place.
Quite simply, having a second-strike capability by definition means that there there is no way for an enemy to eliminate all of a nation's nukes before they can be fired.
In turn, this means that anyone who attacks that nation will be guaranteed to come under nuclear attack.
In turn, this would discourage any offensive moves against that nation.
I tend to agree with Abdali and the Sciencedaan
Our best shot at Second Strike Capability is nuclear armed subs. Such submarines would offer a terrific threat to Indian assetts in the far south.
rvikz you comment about wiping Pakistan off the map is simply a repeat of what Georges Fernandes said last year.
This may be true at the moment, but with every passing year Pakistan's continued development of nuclear weapons ensures that in the near future we too will be able to make the same claim.
Time is not on your side on this matter
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*Originally posted by elahi: *
I tend to agree with Abdali and the Sciencedaan
Our best shot at Second Strike Capability is nuclear armed subs. Such submarines would offer a terrific threat to Indian assetts in the far south.
rvikz you comment about wiping Pakistan off the map is simply a repeat of what Georges Fernandes said last year.
This may be true at the moment, but with every passing year Pakistan's continued development of nuclear weapons ensures that in the near future we too will be able to make the same claim.
Time is not on your side on this matter
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we want same detterent against china so it does not matter what pakistan does.
I find all this talk about a nuclear war a bit depressing. I hope the bombastic talk from the leaders of the two countries is only a bluff, and that they really aren't seriously thinking of the nuclear option.
Apart from the humanitarian horror of a nuclear strike, it is also unadvisable simply because the nuclear radiation from the affected part of one country can easily be blown into the other country, by wind. If I remember correctly, I read somewhere that if India (God forbid) uses a nuclear weapon against Pakistan, the nuclear radiation will blow back into India because of the "Westerly" winds (that is the name given to the winds which blow into India from the West.).
I think you people should know that there is already a project going on. Pakistan are making subs in a joint venture with France. These subs have Second Strike Capability.
If you ppl remember the Karachi incident, in which french ppl were killed. Those were actually the experts working on this project. Due to their death the project is delayed a bit but Pakistan will have second strike capability in a year or so. InshAllah
The French were not there to bestow any SS capability onto Pakistan. They were there to help in the construction of the Agosta 90B submarines which Pakistan has purchased from the French. Just having a submarine does not mean a SS capability, having a sub which can launch the nuclear-capped Ballistic/Cruise Missiles means a SS capability. The subs which Pakistan currently has, can fire the Exocet missile, which is actually an Anti-Ship Missile and not a nuclear missile. There is no SS capability associated with them as of now.
it will be an absured idea for pakistan considering bases around india.first of all pakistan has got a crippling economy to do that and lacks forces in number for such massive deployment of troops.
no county including china would allow pakistan bases in their soils as that would mount tensions in the region and china fears the fact that indian militray power can some what nullify their presence in the region.
as one said abt moble missile launchers,they too are not viable options as mobile launchers cn easily come under indian spy satellite reconnaissance and pakistans geographical features do not permit such an option.
pakistans greatest flaw is its ol reserve and that parries pakistan itself from getting in to any misventure.
indian missiles have the ability to reach any corner of pakistan and that itself guarentees india from any sustained strikes from pakistan.
a scond strike from pakistan well depends on pakistans missile reservious existence and in any warlike situation with pakistan,india will try to destroy that in the first hand or strike.
so there is no question abt pakistans sustained emergence from a mutilated situation.
