Sajda.....

Re: Sajda.....

I guess we can agree to disagree … to me, the moment you put the Pakistani uniform on, you have only one obligation and that is to your country. You are responsible to evaluate your actions with 2 goals in your mind :

1)are my actions enhancing Pakistan brand or diluting it?
2)how can my actions - individually or collectively - help Pakistan winning?

And all I am saying that the Pakistani team has taken a combined approach to put religion on their sleeves (excessive sajdas, reciting quarn, bismillah etc.) ... and by the way it is a collective and calculated approach started by Waqar , enhanced by inzi and yoyo and since then followed by every Pakistani team and by doing so, they are coming short on both aforementioned goals .

First in today’s world where the social media has brought so many cultures together and the world has literally become a global village, exhibiting unnecessary religiosity and that too on a collective basis in a sport as national heroes sends wrong message and most importantly labels Pakistani brand in a certain way especially when no other group/country does that. Second, it definitely impacts team’s harmony… religious players vs non-religious players....minority players feeling out of space and the list can go on etc. and top of that same players are involved in many amoral activities.....

It is not a personal issue or a freedom of expression issue as i see it. yes the moment the match finishes and you take your uniform off, please do whatever you want to do... absolutely at that point it is a personal matter but not on the ground.

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see my response to lucid chaotic as to why it should not be viewed as a personal issue...or freedom of expression

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Yes. But then he started to fade.

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Some teams in American Football used to do their sajda equivalent. Didn't care for it. Of course freedom of speech gives them the right to do so. So issue need not be confused with freedom of speech.

Re: Sajda.....

I do think it's excessive. I also see it as a fake expression to gain points within the muslim community. It's obviously totally fake when fixers do it but even the non fixers seem to do it to impress their seniors or their country in general. PD is right on that this started with the Inzi Yoyo crew and newcomers seem to do it to gain points.

Starting every response with mentioning bismillah or first of all thanks to allah.. is quite a joke to be honest. I know this is mean and insensitive but I usually crack up when that happens and I've heard similar from a few Brits I've met. My reaction would be the same if Dhoni began with "First of all thanks to vaishno devi" or "busss, upar vaale ki kripa hai"... or if an Aussie said "Thanks to the alllmighty Jesus and mother Mary"... hahaahaha I'm cracking up already just picturing it.

I'm not religious but if there was a man in the sky as Abrahamic religions describe him... would he really give a f*** about a game? I'd hope he would concentrate on more important things that need his attention.

Re: Sajda…

and then he pours some more whiskey down his throat

I agree that some of it is excessive and ostentatious.

But not necessarily all. When done sparingly and at appropriate moments, it is actually very nice and satisfying.

You put weight behind your argument by quoting examples from players from other religions. :k:

But technically speaking, one religious community does not have to abide by the standards set by others in these matters.

And God couldn’t care less for a silly cricket match but his creation does. It’s for their satisfaction.

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But it does fall under freedom of expression. There are players in the NFL who pray during the game. Google "tebowing". There are players who wear/kiss cross and everything. It's their choice.

Re: Sajda.....

Let them do the sajda of thanks to Allah...

Let them start with Bismillah...

All we want is for them to be fighters and play good cricket....everything else will be icing...

Re: Sajda…

Yup, I take a shot of whiskey everytime I post.
It’s fine if its a big occasion or something. Hence I used the word excessive to describe the current/recent situation.
I used other players as an example to try to say that it’s not bias against a specific faith.
If god won’t give a damn then why keep saying “god willing” LOL.
On to the next shot. Ho gaya sharabbi mainu hor na pilaaooo ni main ho gaya sharaabeeeee. :shoaby:

Re: Sajda.....

so? does not make it appealing just because NFL does it

but more importantly, playing for NFL is not equivalent to representing the USA....for example, i can guarantee you that the USA will never allow its national basketball team to exhibit any act of religiosity in international matches against other countries especially on a collective basis ... no way! are you kiddin me.....

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Everyone does with age.

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For those who don't like religious excessiveness, maybe they should learn the art protesting from religious people i.e. destroy their own home...burn tires or just slap a relative

Only if we knew how to 'live' freedom of speech and expression and not just preach it...world would be a better place.

Re: Sajda…

:omg:

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Appealing??? It's my choice to how I want to express my self as long as I don't interfere with others life. Just because it doesn't appeal to others is not an issue. That's exactly what's called freedom of expression.

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^ agreed. And those who find such public display of religious fervor unappealing and in poor taste express their views. This is not about freedom of speech, just different opinions on whether such public displays are over the top.

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I'm amused at how ye are embarrassed by and worked up about a simple Bismillah and sajda.

Next time you see someone making the sign of a cross in public (something my Catholic friends do all the time), make sure you scrutinize their morality for their excessive and pretentious display of religious gestures. I'll give ye a name to bash to start off with - Tim Tebow - an American footballer who always proudly thanks "his lord his saviour Jesus Christ" and even kneels down on the field to "give glory to God". Pretty sure he doesn't follow every word in the Bible but you know what I'm glad he's not ashamed of his faith in a place and time where he'll be judged mostly negatively for his expression of faith.

Hadh hai.

Re: Sajda…

Tebow has been discussed before and discredited upon circumstance. :chai:

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Seriously? This is a issue too? wow.

Uniform or no uniform, matches or no matches.. everyone is responsible for their own deeds. If they are saying Bismillah or giving sajdas, it's been them and Allah. Why do you care? Why would any of us care?

We should just care about the fact that they play a good game and try their best to win.

And about the global message thing you're talking about.. seriously I've never seen anyone bring up this issue. Nationally or internationally. Because it is NOT an issue. =)

Re: Sajda.....

So funny how the liberal gora wannabes love to judge others but when their turn comes, they call it narrow mindedness.

Grow up, let them do what they want, not their fault you can't see beyond it. Nothing of their religion stops them to perform. That's just your bias.

Re: Sajda.....

OP makes an excellent point. And it has been pointed out in the thread that open and excessive expression of religious sentiments by players of any faith and anywhere including American Football is in poor taste.

Tim Tebow from my perspective is equally inappropriate in his public repeated expression. It would be nice if folks don't go RAH RAH over religion and just practise it in private.