In this forum, I often see muslims criticize christianity - saying that it’s not truly a monotheistic religion due to the way in which Jesus is viewed as the son of God and/or (by some christian sects) as a representation of God in human form.
The irony I see with this is that these same muslims, and apparently (from what I’ve seen) Islam in general, holds their prophet muhammed (pbuh) in much higher regard than christians do with Jesus.
Suggestions from moderate muslims, or non-muslims, that some context could or should be applied to his words are labeled as blasphemous. No image is allowed to be shown of him so that it is not worshipped as an idol (at least, I think that’s the reason).
While Jesus is viewed by all christians as a man who sinned as all people do, Muhammed (pbuh) is revered by muslims as a sort of super-human (again, from what I’ve seen) who made no mistakes, and whose every word was spoken at the direction of God.
He DID make mistakes; there is an incident of Prophet Muhammad (peace and blessings of Allah be upon him) frowning when a blind man had come to speak with him about Islam, because he was already engrossed in discussing the issue with members who were considered more "leading" or important" citizens of Makkah. For this, the Prophet was admonished in Surah "Abasa" ('He frowned'), number 80 of the Quran by Allah:
quote frowned and turned away,
Because there came to him the blind man (interrupting).
But what could tell thee but that perchance he might grow (in spiritual understanding)?-
Or that he might receive admonition, and the teaching might profit him?
As to one who regards Himself as self-sufficient, [the more "important" citizens of Makkah]
To him dost thou attend;
Though it is no blame to thee if he grow not (in spiritual understanding).
But as to him who came to thee striving earnestly,
And with fear (in his heart),
Of him wast thou unmindful.
By no means (should it be so)! For it is indeed a Message of instruction:
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[The addition in square brackets is mine]
It would be shirk to consider Prophet Muhammad (peace and blessings of Allah be upon him) as anything close to a super human. He was clearly not, he was a human being whom Allah had chosen for the most important task on earth. It may seem in this Forum to yourself that we tend to hold him in much reverence. That is only because of the Divine mission he was instructed with from Allah (also, he is considered in Islam as a role model for all of humanity). We do not revere him because of any 'super-human' qualities or attributes within him.
Additionally, muslims never belittle Jesus Christ (May Allah be pleased with him). He is revered as much as any other prophet, including Abraham and Moses. All of them are the chosen ones from God Almighty to spread His message on this world.
What muslims do disagree with from current day mainstream christians, is the belief of christians that Jesus was the son of God. We disagree, because God has clearly mentioned it in the Quran that He had no son, and Jesus was a Prophet and a human being. That doesn't diminish our respect for Jesus as a prophet. His life is covered in some detail in the Quran and his miracles are accepted by muslims as well.
I didn't imply that muslims belittle Jesus, or doubt his status as a prophet. In my experience, I just find that muslims place Muhammed (pbuh) on a higher level than christians do Jesus.
I can't see a situation where a christian community would riot and issue death threats if someone were to suggest that jesus might like a miss universe contestant. In another post here yesterday, someone threatened seminole when he suggested that Muhammed (pbuh) didn't like dogs.
In theory it is said that many Christians think of Jesus as "Son of God", and that gives Jesus too much prominence and is shirk. But in practice, it appears as though Muslims revere, worship or idolize Muhammed as much or more so than Christians do Jesus. Everything that was reported he said or did is mimicked by Muslims (even if these "sayings" are many times not substantiated) from the way he brushed his teeth to his "Godly advice" of not keeping dogs in the house.
Christians do attach such reverence or try to mimic every thing Jesus ever said or did. If they did they would be a lot less violent and a lot more tolerant than they are. So I think it is a matter of semantics to say Christians revere (idolize, worship) Jesus more than Muslims do Muhammed. It appears that in practice Muhammed has a position as lofty in Islam as Jesus does in Christianity. It's just that he isn't called "the son of God".
Lets just say muslims don't mix humor when it comes to comments about their Prophet. Its very different from how Christians (these days) discuss and treat their Prophet (Jesus Christ). Christians frequently make movies and photographs depicting Jesus, some times overtly sexual movies etc. All this is unthinkable for muslims about our Prophet, and it is even disliked when anyone makes fun of Jesus or Moses or any other prophet. We believe the prophets out to be revered and respected, unconditionally.
On to your first point about muslims giving more respect to Prophet Muhammad (Peace Be Upon Him)... yes, I believe thats true to an extent. The reasons vary.
Seminole, without being facetious, there is a big difference in trying to mould your life after someone or rever the whole life of another person; and to consider that person a son of God. No muslim considers Muhammad (Peace Be Upon Him) to be son of God. He was the son of Abdullah and Ameena, and he was a human being. The best of human beings, we believe, yes. But a human being, nonetheless.
Faisal, the "son of God" designation vs "the best of human beings" is the semantics of which I speak. It sounds good in theory, but in practice and day to day life, it comes down to idolizing, worshiping and revering a person (no matter whose son he is). A Christian could also say that he worships Jesus because he was the best of human beings and not because he was the Son of God.
Thats not semantics. Thats a critical difference. Both of us agree that Jesus is a Prophet of God. In addition, I believe that their is only one God and He has no sons, nor father, nor any partners. Monotheism is the critical foundation of all religions from Adam to Noah to Abraham to Moses to Jesus to Muhammad (May Peace and Blessings be upon them all). Monotheism. This is not sementics.
Once someone disrupts this belief by saying Jesus was the son of God, then we have a critical difference. Other than that, if you want to mould your life and live exactly the way Jesus lived his life, go ahead. More power to you. I don't believe Jesus ever said he is the son of God. His was an immaculate conception and that doesn't make him the son of God. His life, just like the lives of all Prophets is exemplary and we can all learn lessons from it. Muslims worship God; they don't worship Muhammad. If a Christian worships Jesus, then that is another difference, right there.
Then leave the whole "Son of God" thing out of it because there are plenty of Christians who don't believe it. In day to day practice, Muhammed is as revered by Muslims as much or more than Jesus is by Christians. And Christians do not have a collection of thousands of sayings that tell them exactly how Jesus lived his life to give them the do's and don'ts and how to mimic them to live their own life. I'm not knocking it, but it just seems like Muslims are hesitant to admit the reverence and idolization they attach to Muhammed. It is particularly puzzling when it is said that "we do not distinguish between the prophets".
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*Originally posted by Stu: *
Faisal, would you say that muslims love their prophet unquestioningly and uncritically?
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Love? Ofcourse.
Then again, as Madhanee pointed out. Present day muslims are not a conformist society. Maybe if you ask the exact same question to another muslim, his answer may be a lot hesitent or downright negative. I think there are some muslims, who completely discount the Prophet and only revere the message. I know they have their reasons, but, personally, I disagree with their approach and their reasons.
[QUOTE]
*Originally posted by Faisal: *
Thats not semantics. Thats a critical difference. Both of us agree that Jesus is a Prophet of God. In addition, I believe that their is only one God and He has no sons, nor father, nor any partners. Monotheism is the critical foundation of all religions from Adam to Noah to Abraham to Moses to Jesus to Muhammad (May Peace and Blessings be upon them all). Monotheism. This is not sementics.
Once someone disrupts this belief by saying Jesus was the son of God, then we have a critical difference. Other than that, if you want to mould your life and live exactly the way Jesus lived his life, go ahead. More power to you. I don't believe Jesus ever said he is the son of God. His was an immaculate conception and that doesn't make him the son of God. His life, just like the lives of all Prophets is exemplary and we can all learn lessons from it. Muslims worship God; they don't worship Muhammad. If a Christian worships Jesus, then that is another difference, right there.
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but do you claim special privilage as muslim or islam's superority
over other faiths? if you claim superiroty how you will enforce it?
by military or spirtual force or just preaching. or just accept everyone has their own way to god. how you can make everyone accept same concept?
[QUOTE]
*Originally posted by rvikz: *
but do you claim special privilage as muslim or islam's superority
over other faiths? if you claim superiroty how you will enforce it?
by military or spirtual force or just preaching.
[/QUOTE]
There is no enforcement of superiority.... whether military or spiritual. Islam is not so fickle. Muslims are supposed to live lives successfully i.e get education, work hard in their chosen profession, have families and thank Allah for all the blessings which He has bestowed. At the same time, Islam teaches us that this life is temporary. So make sure our focus is on the life hereafter and we do good deeds, and fulfill our obligations towards our Creator and our fellow human beings so on the Day of Judgement, we are successful and are permitted into Paradise where we will live everafter. This is a short summary of Islam, and it is fairly identical to all divine religions.
At the same time, muslims believe Islam is the purest, most refined and mature form of divine revelations. Once we follow Islam, we do not have to follow any earliers scriptures. We also believe that once Islam was perfected at the time of Muhammad (PBUH), anyone who is invited and informed about Islamic beliefs, and chose not to revert to Islam is a non-believer and thus is making a mistake. Whether they will be forgiven in the hereafter is upto the Almighty, ofcourse, but as a fellow human being, our responsibility is to tell the non-believers about the message of Islam and let them decide whether they want to find out more, or accept or reject the message. There is no force involved here.
Muslims in general do not revere Muhammad PBUH more than Jesus in any way. Jesus has been made into God by the majority of Christians and not the minority. This is the fact. It is an article of Faith in Christianity to accept Jesus as the Son of God, whether some Christians oppose this concept or not. However, not so in Islam. Yes, you may come across some Muslims who do border on Shirk with their undying unconditional love for the Prophet PBUH, but this in no way represents Islam. We only Worship Allah SWT. What we show Muhammed PBUH and every other Prophet is RESPECT. Similarily, we do not have the concept of godson, godmother, god daughter, god like qualities etc etc, as once again, the respect for God is taken away and God therefore becomes 'like anyone else', averagely normal. We do not treat any Prophet or God with a pinch of salt.
The Qur'aan which Muslims believe to be THE Word of God instructs Muslims to send blessings on Muhammad PBUH. Furthermore, Muhammed PBUH was sent as a mercy for ALL mankind to lead them out of the dark and into the light and not just for a select few Children Of Israel. He was the role model for mankind and we do try and emulate his actions, because Muslims believe that Muhammads PBUH actions were directly ordered from God using the Qur'aan as the guidance. You will therefore sometimes here people saying that Muhammad PBUH was the 'living' Qur'aan.
So you see in reality, we are emulating the Qur'aan and trying to lead a life as prescribed to us by God via Muhammed PBUH. What you should be saying is that by worshipping Allah SWT using the Qur'aan as our guidance, are we committing Shirk.
but do you claim special privilage as muslim or islam's superority
over other faiths? if you claim superiroty how you will enforce it?
by military or spirtual force or just preaching. or just accept everyone has their own way to god. how you can make everyone accept same concept?
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Everybody will not accept the concept that everyone has there own way to God.
Eveybody will not believe it. Some don't because they want to be right.
Others don't because many peoples belief system discourages the thought.
Not everyone is taught to think with an open heart and mind.
And everyone are not taught to think about the values that people of other persuasions believe in might be similar to ones own beliefs.
Even though the values and moral teachings are similar, some are not able to concieve the possibility that the reason why the basic beliefs are similar is because God decided so.
[QUOTE]
*Originally posted by Stu: *
I didn't imply that muslims belittle Jesus, or doubt his status as a prophet. In my experience, I just find that muslims place Muhammed (pbuh) on a higher level than christians do Jesus.
I can't see a situation where a christian community would riot and issue death threats if someone were to suggest that jesus might like a miss universe contestant. In another post here yesterday, someone threatened seminole when he suggested that Muhammed (pbuh) didn't like dogs.
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Yes, All Muslims revere Prophet Muhammad (Peace be upon him) and to emulate him as it is the command of Allah (swt) as shown in the Ayah below.
Certainly you have in the Messenger of Allah an excellent exemplar for him who hopes in Allah and the latter day and remembers Allah much. Holy Quran: 33:21
It’s not true that “that muslims place Muhammed (pbuh) on a higher level than christians do Jesus.”
Christians take Jesus to be Son of God. Muslims take Prophet Muhammad to be the last and greatest Prophet of God.
The Whole dogma of Christians revolves around Jesus whereas with Muslims it revolves around God.
The Christian Churches are full of statues of Jesus. Do you see Muslims doing that with Prophet Muhammad?
The most famous slogan of the Christians is “Jesus loves you.” For the Muslims would be “Allahu Akhbar”.
I could go on and on…….
“I can't see a situation where a christian community would riot and issue death threats if someone were to suggest that jesus might like a miss universe contestant.”
Yes, nowadays it’s true but it wasn’t like that before. Christians have somewhat ‘given up’ on Christianity but retained its festivals.
Make ‘fun’ of Jesus in front of a Christian he may most probably join in with you. And if one was to do the same of him or his family or his football team is asking for trouble. As jovial ‘broad minded’ person will be transformed into a raging tiger.