Religion vs Faith

[Madhanee]

Re: Religion vs Faith

MQ, lift your blinder that make you look like a horse. Kaleem brought Mirza Sahib’s name. You should know that Mirza Sahib is very important and highly respected Prophet for us Ahmadis.

[Muslim_Queen]

Re: Religion vs Faith

Now pray tell why I was brought up into the discussion? And whats wrong with how horses look? get a life madhanee jee.

[Madhanee]

Re: Religion vs Faith

Were you? I think Verizon was only showing disagreement with your views, and not with you personally, so don’t be so touchy. Shabash.

Kaleem on the other hand has a habit of sticking his foot in his mouth.

[Verizon]

Re: Religion vs Faith

No one is trying to ridicule anyone. I asked a question and MQ you responded in a manner quite un-Canadien. So read mah beginin poust and twy to answer. Heah lemme poust this fah yooo.

[QUOTE]
is it better to have strong faith and not be religious ?
OR
Be religious but lack of faith/understanding?
[/QUOTE]

[little_human]

Re: Religion vs Faith

@Verizon

Scenario 1: You have a devout muslim, classic book definition one, prays five times, reads quraan, prays, hajj etc. but doesnt really understand the real reason behind religion, has limited understanding of God, creation etc. Never really bothered to read the translation of Quraan.

Scenario 2: You have a person that lives his life peacefully, understands all religions and the concept of God, Prays (not traditionally like salat etc), has a strong faith about the oneness of God and the fact that god exists, believes in all prophets, be it Buddha, or Moses or Mohammad.

Who is a better person? and who will go to Heaven?
Also is it better to have strong faith and not be religious ?
OR
Be religious but lack of faith/understanding?

I think one cannot be religious if he/she doesn’t have strong faith.

I didn’t know Buddha was a prophet as well.

[homer_j_simpson]

Re: Religion vs Faith

@Verizon

Scenario 1: You have a devout muslim, classic book definition one, prays five times, reads quraan, prays, hajj etc. but doesnt really understand the real reason behind religion, has limited understanding of God, creation etc. Never really bothered to read the translation of Quraan.

Scenario 2: You have a person that lives his life peacefully, understands all religions and the concept of God, Prays (not traditionally like salat etc), has a strong faith about the oneness of God and the fact that god exists, believes in all prophets, be it Buddha, or Moses or Mohammad.

…
OR
?

very thought provoking post…
mate the answer to these 2 questions:
**Who is a better person? and who will go to Heaven?**that only God can decide who will go to heaven or hell
**Also is it better to have strong faith and not be religious ?
**seriously don’t know …I know i may be in this category…i wanna be both…but then only allah can decide
Be religious but lack of faith/understanding?
then what would be the use…u can have faith but not be religious…but if u r are religious and u lack faith and understanding then its not good…i think if u a religious then u strive to make ur faith more stronger and try to have more understanding about ur religion

[AQ]

Re: Religion vs Faith

@The Hunk

Two things:

1. Islam is a complete package. You cannot take your pick out of it and adopt that particular portion.
2. The definition of a Muslim is ‘One who submits to Allah’s will’. The trees, the earth, the mountains, the animals, the birds etc. are all Muslims. Even a fierce dog that bites is a Muslim, because he submits to the will of Allah and does what is required of him.

These Facts are the perfect example of the True Faith of Islam.

[Verizon]

Re: Religion vs Faith

@little human

I think one cannot be religious if he/she doesn’t have strong faith.

I didn’t know Buddha was a prophet as well.

There are people that believe because they are taught to believe, they lack understanding of Faith, they consider … actually forget all that here
Define Faith?

[AQ]

Re: Religion vs Faith

Faith = Things on which one's heart bears witness to be true.

[Muslim_Queen]

Re: Religion vs Faith

@Madhanee

Were you? I think Verizon was only showing disagreement with your views, and not with you personally, so don’t be so touchy. Shabash.

Kaleem on the other hand has a habit of sticking his foot in his mouth.

you being the bearer of Islami Jhanda with sister MQ in your tow in heavy claded burqah made in China assembled in India, but ofcourse halal (they have muslims you know) would be better at shedding some light on my humble question.

Right. Hes doing so in such a mature manner it brings tears to my eyes. And I guess kaleem has away of uttering the truth that makes you want to throw him off gs.

verizon – I did answer your questions. So American of you not to understand my answers. Btw I have an excellent article on faith, I will see if I can get it for you tomorrow. Actually its the opening of a book I have, so I will have to type it all out.

[little_human]

Re: Religion vs Faith

I think I get what you mean now.

But....I don't want to think who's better or who's gonna go to heaven.

For questions like these, I always tell myself Allah will do infinite justice. So no worries.

[Raihan]

Re: Religion vs Faith

It's not up to us to decide and your scenarios contain very few details.

There is an example of a Muslim who is devout, prays, fasts i.e. fulfils all his obligations yet Allah(swt) sent angels to destroy that city. When the angels said shall we take that man out of the city first, Allah(swt) said destroy him first and then destroy the city because his face didn't even grow red with anger when he saw all the evil around him.

As well as shattering the generally held idea that keep yourself to yourself and don't say anything to anyone it shows it is not enough to just fulfil your obligations.

If you ask who is the better person then the answer would be the result of whatever is the generally accepted concept of good and bad. According to secularism a dictator is good if he sells them cheap oil or recently if Sudan joins the war on terror then Sudan is an ally and is good otherwise Sudan is involved in genocide. So it all depends on what your belief is. Whether your belief is secularism or whatever the ideology you have convictions in.

What we have to accept as a fact is that secularism cannot decide good and bad and only Allah (swt) can decide good and bad. I don't have 'blind faith' in Allah, I am convinced Allah(swt) exists through use of the mind.

[rvikz]

Re: Religion vs Faith

@Raihan

It’s not up to us to decide and your scenarios contain very few details.

There is an example of a Muslim who is devout, prays, fasts i.e. fulfils all his obligations yet Allah(swt) sent angels to destroy that city. When the angels said shall we take that man out of the city first, Allah(swt) said destroy him first and then destroy the city because his face didn’t even grow red with anger when he saw all the evil around him.

As well as shattering the generally held idea that keep yourself to yourself and don’t say anything to anyone it shows it is not enough to just fulfil your obligations.

If you ask who is the better person then the answer would be the result of whatever is the generally accepted concept of good and bad. According to secularism a dictator is good if he sells them cheap oil or recently if Sudan joins the war on terror then Sudan is an ally and is good otherwise Sudan is involved in genocide. So it all depends on what your belief is. Whether your belief is secularism or whatever the ideology you have convictions in.

What we have to accept as a fact is that secularism cannot decide good and bad and only Allah (swt) can decide good and bad. I don’t have ‘blind faith’ in Allah, I am convinced Allah(swt) exists through use of the mind.

now you and your family live in secualr country you cant say to to the judge
i dont recognize the law of the land either you have to leave the country
or accept the secular law.

[Raihan]

Re: Religion vs Faith

not accepting the basis of the law is not the same as becoming a criminal in the land you are living in.

If I don't lie, steal, fraud, it is because Allah(swt) expects this from me and not that I'm obeying the law of the land.

If I leave the country then which country shall I go to as no country follows Islamic law.

[rvikz]

Re: Religion vs Faith

@Raihan

not accepting the basis of the law is not the same as becoming a criminal in the land you are living in.

If I don’t lie, steal, fraud, it is because Allah(swt) expects this from me and not that I’m obeying the law of the land.

If I leave the country then which country shall I go to as no country follows Islamic law.

i am not talking about breaking the law rather a uniform civil law relating to divorce inheritance and other family law which may have conflict with muslim
personal law.

[Raihan]

Re: Religion vs Faith

I don't know about other countries but in England this isn't really much of a problem. We even have interest free mortgages.

Can you be more specific as to where you see a problem? I don't want to guess at an answer.

[rvikz]

Re: Religion vs Faith

@Raihan

I don’t know about other countries but in England this isn’t really much of a problem. We even have interest free mortgages.

Can you be more specific as to where you see a problem? I don’t want to guess at an answer.

you agree you can basically practice your religen in secular democracy as opposed
to secular dictatoship or theological state.

[Raihan]

Re: Religion vs Faith

Well in France Muslim women can't wear Hijab to school and Turkey is even worse.

[vineshvk]

Re: Religion vs Faith

@Raihan

Well in France Muslim women can’t wear Hijab to school and Turkey is even worse.

in france.. crucifex and jews hat are also prohibited from being worn to schools. Now when u r stating something.. why dont u give it in full. U gave the impression as only hijabs are prevented from wearing.

[Raihan]

Re: Religion vs Faith

If you read 'properly' you would understand that we were discussing in terms of Muslims.