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*Originally posted by Aryan_Shponkai: *
Bro how did you say that without knowing about the history of some other languages. Bro our language, Pashto, has more than 4000 years of recorded history which also makes it either the oldest or one of the oldest languages on earth.
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Cool Aryan. I said 'probably'. My comments are not beacuse I speak Tamil, but are from published sources. You could be right about Pashto, and I wil be glad for that. Pashtos and Tamils must be brothers then, :-), no wonder we tolerate the neos :-).
Seriously, could you pm me more about Pashto. Is it very different from the other Pak languages?
Incidentally, I didn't say Tamil is 2000 years old. The oldest discovered written literature (note every single word), atreatise on grammar, is at least 2000 years old. Much of it was discovered in the last 150 years and countless works were lost because innocent people used the palmscripts on which they were written to light up their kitchen fires. :-( . I don't know for how long the Tamils were roaming around in tiger skins before they even got to writing.
Incidentally, I didn't say Tamil is 2000 years old. The oldest discovered written literature (note every single word), atreatise on grammar, is at least 2000 years old. Much of it was discovered in the last 150 years and countless works were lost because innocent people used the palmscripts on which they were written to light up their kitchen fires. :-( . I don't know for how long the Tamils were roaming around in tiger skins before they even got to writing.
Yeah bro, well i might have missed on that word though you cant just account in only Tamil for that. Pashto might not be the only old language, there has to be some other too. Yeah i wonder they might be, but i havent heard Tamil language, it might have some words or maybe lot. Yeah could be Brothers ;-).
Yeah it's a unique language in the whole of Asia perhaps the world. Pashto has its own ancient words not to be found in any other languages.
Most of the Pakistani languages have loaned words from Arabic, Farsi and Pashto languages. Even Farsi has Arabic words but our doesnt, in this case it is a unique one.
No you could be right, there is no dounbt in that. The oldest Pashto written litrature was found in today's Iran, it dated back to about 1000 BC. It's not written in todays Pashto - Arabic script but in CUNIFORM writing which was our main script back then. King Darius in Behistun inscriptions had left some of ancient Pashto literature.
Our history is been erased many times through history, our antiques have been stolen or destroyed by everyone who invaded us though still we have the amount of proof to shut their mouths from lieing.
All the Rajputs I have come across are noticeably brown whereas Pathans tend to be fairer with less sharper features. I doubt they are the same. For a purely white race to change colour naturally would take tens of thousands of years.
But you also have to consider the physical look of the Rajputs, whereas they do not resemble features of any other people in Asia except the Pashtuns. Btw they didn't go there just then, their migration to India is like more than 4000 years.
I still don’t think that’s a long enough time for a white race to become brown naturally, genetic mutations take very long periods of time to change colour of a whole race like that.
Maybe it’s because of intermarriages with the local women in the early days when they came to India.
I know you get a few pure blooded Pashtun’s who are even more browner than muts like us but a whole race?
I read in a book that Rajputs are White-Huns is that the same as Aryan?
I am Rajput Janjua on my mom’s side and am proud of it. What little bit I know is that Rajput are a warrior class of people who are fiercely loyal and honorable to what is theirs whether it be their people, their land, their religion/philosophy, their belongings, etc.
I would love to get the low-down once and for all about what the truth is regarding our background. I would imagine we are a healthy mix of historically part local and part migrant people. Any additional clarification is much appreciated.
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*Originally posted by Zakiii: *
I still don’t think that’s a long enough time for a white race to become brown naturally, genetic mutations take very long periods of time to change colour of a whole race like that.
Maybe it’s because of intermarriages with the local women in the early days when they came to India.
I know you get a few pure blooded Pashtun’s who are even more browner than muts like us but a whole race?
I read in a book that Rajputs are White-Huns is that the same as Aryan?
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Zakiii, get off the whiteness issue..your only making a joke of yourself. Seriously, do you realize the difference between "race" and skin color. To become brown or white is dependent on the environment. Why the hang up on the skin color? I don't need to embarrass you further by posting some personal pics, so I suggest that you reread the differences between race and skin color.
I’m not fighting it’s just the few Indian “Rajputs” I’ve come across look more Dravidian than Aryan, I have no idea if they are pure blooded or even part genuine Rajputs, I just wanted to dispel my confusion and a decent banda like yourself getting irritated that easily.
We do have some people who look brown but that’s not due to gene mutation, some ‘Pathans’ from Chach look like an average Punjabi and then others look just like Pashtuns which has lead me to think that (even though nowadays we only marry within the ‘Pathan’ tribes) our early patrilineal ancestors definitely must have married the local Punjabi women, so basically we have genes from both races even though nobody recognises the Punjabi side because our tribes are not matrilineal and lineage is only traced through the fathers side, the family trees in Attock don’t even have any mention of the women.
Values wise we are closer to Pashtuns than Punjabis but it’s obvious we are not pure blooded like some people pretend.
I’m proud of both my heritages, at the end of the day all what really matters to me is I’m a Muslim.
There’s other Chachis who are not Pathan like Awans, Qazis etc. they don’t have much in common with Pashtuns culture wise.
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*Originally posted by Zakiii: *
Maybe it’s because of intermarriages with the local women in the early days when they came to India.
I know you get a few pure blooded Pashtun’s who are even more browner than muts like us but a whole race?
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You're right. Rajputs are of Saka stock, they crossed Khyber and Bolan pass and settled down in Punjab and upper Sindh. Later some of their tribes went further eastwards to India. Most of them took local women as their wives. It could be a reason why they look somehow different than Pashtuns or Baloch, who themselves are a mixture of Aryan, Scythians and other central asian tribes. The Rajputs of Rajasthan tend to be more darker than Punjabi and Sindhi Rajputs. Bhuttos of Sindh are also Rajputs.
I’m not fighting it’s just the few Indian “Rajputs” I’ve come across look more Dravidian than Aryan, I have no idea if they are pure blooded or even part genuine Rajputs, I just wanted to dispel my confusion and a decent banda like yourself getting irritated that easily.
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Yara, no apologies needed. I'll never fight my fellow Attockwals. I think there are a lot of factors that count for skin color. I am not irritated, I just wanted you see the difference
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*Originally posted by Zakiii: *
Aryan what do you mean?
We do have some people who look brown but that’s not due to gene mutation, some ‘Pathans’ from Chach look like an average Punjabi and then others look just like Pashtuns which has lead me to think that (even though nowadays we only marry within the ‘Pathan’ tribes) our early patrilineal ancestors definitely must have married the local Punjabi women, so basically we have genes from both races even though nobody recognises the Punjabi side because our tribes are not matrilineal and lineage is only traced through the fathers side, the family trees in Attock don’t even have any mention of the women.
Values wise we are closer to Pashtuns than Punjabis but it’s obvious we are not pure blooded like some people pretend.
I’m proud of both my heritages, at the end of the day all what really matters to me is I’m a Muslim.
There’s other Chachis who are not Pathan like Awans, Qazis etc. they don’t have much in common with Pashtuns culture wise.
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I mean the colour of the Punjabi, why didnt it change durring all this time?
Btw you gave me a good answer, what you said is correct at some point.
Those PATHANS might be the Punjabis who have adopted Pashto culture, but even in our society sometimes you would find a guy like a Punjabi but would look Pashtun, sometimes as white as a european.
Nways i have to find out about this Chach thing, is this a city or people?
Chach is an area in the Attock District. Chachi is anyone who comes from that area which includes a wide variety of ethnicities and ethnic backgrounds.
There was an old post on some forum it might have been here about how it was once a battlefield.
Upon some research I found that the Afghan Mehmood of Ghazni fought a war here on the plains of Chach against the local Hindu Rajas, which is why today there are graves literally everywhere, some of the graves of the Muslim warriors are even in peoples houses, some have tried removing them but if its that of a Muslim he’ll come to them in their dream and warn them not to (worse than the Hindu Marhatta’s I tell you jo mar ke to hatt jaatey hein tum loag to marney ke baad bhi peecha nahein chortey )
Where it is known that a Muslim shaheed is buried the grave is respected.
Our area is quite haunted, local legend has it that it’s the evil spirits of the Hindus who got killed there but I think its Jinns, bechaarey Hindu if what Rajput bro says about Hindkowan being Indian, they might have been our own ancestors and we call them evil spirits and the foreigners are revered as saints.
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*Originally posted by Aryan_Shponkai: *
I mean the colour of the Punjabi, why didnt it change durring all this time?
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Well I don’t really know what race the Punjabis (mostly Jatts) are but if they were already brown then since south asia is quite a sunny place they’d stay that way or go darker.
The gene mutation theory says that say somebody gets a gene that’s more suited to their environment than those of its fellow people then he and his offspring who have that gene are more likely to survive in that environment and reproduce. Which in this case is dark skin/dark eyes/dark hair genes versus fair skin/light eyes/light hair genes, dark skin/dark eyes/dark hair are better at blocking the suns radioactive rays than the fairer…/lighter…/lighter… ones and hence better at preventing cancer and less likelier to get damaged due to the sun, keeping these and a lot of other advantages in mind they are more likelier to survive and spread their seed as compared to their fairer not as robust counterparts so they’ll eventually become dominant in that race but that takes a very very long period of time.
Gene mutation happens when (as the name suggests) a gene is copied wrong, sometimes they are not always positive mutations.
Zakiii, yara I NEVER said Hindko speakers were Indian..That is just what the name means, Hind Ko.
Ilaqa Chach has always been the battleground for invading armies. The last time it rose in power was during the Gandharan Period. The question remains, will it rise up again?
jo mar ke to hatt jaatey hein tum loag to marney ke baad bhi peecha nahein chortey 
)