Question to all

-== Of the Koran and Gradual Revealment ==-

Kindly spare us from all the content of all the websites that you surf. The verses of the Koran that you have quoted, were not used by me to prove the theory of gradual revealment, they were pasted by you, and if doing that suggests God got to know of his beliefs gradually, then it is only you who is suggesting so by posting what you did. Rather than creating your own arguments and replying to them, kindly reply to my arguments.

The first verse that you mentioned is the equality of all messengers in the eyes of the believers in terms of Iman on those Messengers. The other verses are about God giving some prophets superiority over the others, which is a different subject altogether. Nobody can use these mutually unrelated verses in order to prove Gradual revealment, and you never saw me posting any of them. It is you who posted them, and then spent more than half of your post in trying to justify that they do not support the theorem of gradual revealment.

If you got access to those verses and the commentry on them, on some website, that does not mean you have dug up gold and we will be jealous of you if you post that unrelated information on here. You do not look like a scholar either, you only make a clown out of yourself.

However, talking about the Koran in relation to gradual revealment, when the first of the words of God were revealed to the prophet, did he tell Khadija about the incident with fear and curosity, or did he claim to be the Seal of Prophets straight away? Did he know what he had to do? The fact is, that he did not. He was scared and confused. Then it was revealed: ''O thou enveloped in thy cloak, Arise and warn! Thy Lord magnify.'' (Chapter 74:1,2,3) If you deny gradual revealment, how do you justify the prophet nor arising and warning straight away? Did prophet Mohammad went outside straight and started claiming he was the most superior of all prophets? Did he even claim prophethood straight away even after this verse?

-== Of the Hadith, Gradual Revealment & Your Everchaning Stance ==-

Your debate on the Hadith of prophet Abraham being the greatest of all creatures is vague and based on paranoid denial. It is illogical and lacks any proper meaning. In your prior to the last one post, you had denied that prophet Mohammad has ever claimed superiority over the other prophets. You said:

[quote]
He does not say anything about him being SUPERIOR.
[/quote]

In your previous post however, you have somersaulted back to a new stance, that prophet Mohammad was superior and any Hadith in which he denies superiority is to be explained with the most absurd and confused logics. My question to you is, if he never claimed superiority, what in you eyes, is the harm in letting prophet Abraham superior to him them?

The fact is that your point that prophet Abraham was an ancestor of prophet Mohammad and that is why he refused being called superior to him, can not be supported from the Koran or the Hadith. You may prove that prophet Abraham was a direct ancestor of prophet Mohammad, but you can not prove that the Koran or the Hadith supports your point of view that being an ancestor, prophet Mohammad should have considered him superior.

  • The hadith that I quoted does not contain any such words that since prophet Abraham is my ancestor, I therefore hold him superior to me. It is direct and clear.

  • The other person did not say anything bad about prophet Abraham that could incite prophet Mohammad on an exagerated praise.

  • If prophet Abraham was to be respected as a father by prophet Mohammad, by giving him superiority over himself, then why was it said: "Don't give superiority to any of Allah's prophets." as I quoted earlier. Why did he not say, do not give superiority to any of Allah's prophets except my ancestor Abraham?

  • If Arabs can not claim superiority over their ancestors, why did the prophet claim superiority over all prophets: ''I have been given preference over all the other prophets.'' as quoted by me earlier?

Kindly come up with one solid logical stance. Stop changing your excuses.

-== ** Questions on your Questions ** ==-

1- Which Scholar claimed that all the religion was revealed on prophet Mohammad at once?

2- If the Hadith of Abraham being superior to all creation does not contain any 'terms', who gives you the right to add them? It states that Abraham is the best of creations and does not provide any terms and conditions for that. Who gives you the right to add terms and conditions?

3- I fall back on a lot of points when it comes to the belief in superiority of prophet Mohammad, the most important of them is prophet Mohammad being the Seal of Prophets. Do you, or do you not believe in the superiority of prophet Mohammad over all the rest of the prophets?

4- Mirza Saheb had the courage to correct his belief when he got to know the truth. Do you have the guts to change your belief too?

-== ** Final Question ** ==-

Was the Koran revealed to the prophet gradually, or was it revealed all at once, on the first day of prophethood? If it was revealed gradually, how on earth can you deny gradual revealment? How can you justify the acts by the companions of the prophet that were later revealed to be sins? Can you disrespect them for drinking, before drinking was prohibited? If no, then how can you deny gradual revealment?

[quote]
=======Final Question======

If for some reason you would still like to stay firm in the theory of G.R., I would like for you to explain this.

According to the www.alislam.org Mirza Sahib did not understand his own claims till 1901. Then, afterwards he claimed to be a Prophet. He published one of his last books which is titled "Haqiqat-ul-Wahy" a year before his death which would be 1907. There have been four different accounts of him saying that Prophet SAW was the last Prophet!!!!!

Observe one of them.......

“This news was given only by that God Who sent our Holy Prophet, may peace and the blessings of Allah be upon him, at the end of all the prophets, in order to gather all the nations under his banner.”

— Titma or Appendix to Haqiqat-ul-Wahy, p. 44; in Ruhani Khaza'in, vol. 22, p. 477.

[/quote]

I think in all the mud slinging and flow of emotions you forgot the above posted Question. Kindly answer that question.

[QUOTE]
*Originally posted by Perplexing: *

I think in all the mud slinging and flow of emotions you forgot the above posted Question. Kindly answer that question.
[/QUOTE]

My argument with you was about the theorem of gradual revealment in the light of the religious scriptures, and not on whether the Lahore or Rabwah group correctly represent the claims of Mirza Saheb. That is why I chose to ignore your question. Mirza Saheb has explained in detail as to what type of prophethood he has denied, and what he means when he says prophet Mohammad was the last prophet. Read the book properly.

However, as you have no other option left, you have decided to use Mirza Saheb for your rescue. With the above post you have left the decision to Mirza Saheb. It has now become obvious that the theorem of gradual revealment is not of any importance to you, and you have decided to base your belief solely on the sayings of Mirza Saheb.

Here is what you should read:

[thumb=C]Thw.JPG[/thumb]

Since you have left the 'final question' to be answered by Mirza Saheb, you have no choice but to believe in him.