Re: Punjabi Establishment, Punjabi People and Injustices with other Provinces !
Oh so this thread has been modified by some mods
Re: Punjabi Establishment, Punjabi People and Injustices with other Provinces !
mis moded. aaan? theek tarah modify kerna nahe aya mods ko. look at misterious guy's relply.
Re: Punjabi Establishment, Punjabi People and Injustices with other Provinces !
Some MODS are trying to create conflicts among ourselves. now look at aasimtoms post. i had posted it for kehkashan and where the mods have set it to create conflicts. there are also some traitors in MODS also which must be taken to task,
now if i would have not seen the actual post then i would have said something to aasimtom bhai.
Shame on irresponsible particular MODS who are doing this irresponsible things.
NWFP Budget 215 billion (20%) Population 16% Balochistan 80 billion ( 7%) Population 5%
Can you provide link or the bases of these figures?
its because anti-pakistani parties need a bogey to blame and hide their shortcomings and heinous agendas. The MQM for a long time used Punjab, spread hatred against them as part of their agenda (king kong bhai would even blame the big bang theory on Punjab too), and once people start realizing the truth and the whole thing becomes stale, they find new things, like talibunnnization to start the organized genocide of the Pakhtuns in Karachi.
Can you provide link or the bases of these figures?
Niden these are budget figures of respective provinces in 2009-10. Have been reported in EVERY pak newspaper. I just google it, Punjab Budget 2009, SIndh Budget 2009 etc.
Lets see the financial aspects
Punjab Budget 490 billion (43%) Population 56% Sindh Budget 327 billion (30%) Population 23%
NWFP Budget 215 billion (20%) Population 16% Balochistan 80 billion ( 7%) Population 5%
Not even sure how true these numbers are, but the big issue is revenue generation by provinces other than punjab then end up in punjab through one way or another.
its because anti-pakistani parties need a bogey to blame and hide their shortcomings and heinous agendas. The MQM for a long time used Punjab, spread hatred against them as part of their agenda (king kong bhai would even blame the big bang theory on Punjab too), and once people start realizing the truth and the whole thing becomes stale, they find new things, like talibunnnization to start the organized genocide of the Pakhtuns in Karachi.
"Hain jee, sub theek hai"
i think the budgetary figures quoted betray a basic misunderstanding of how pakistan's system works. The budget allocations are projected federal transfers ..emphasis on projected.. Provinces which are largely dependent on transfers (NWFP and balochistan) due to royalty claims..these transfers have two problems ..one the federal govt frequently does not transfer in time two the transfers have been frozen at the same level for decades.
The first problem is compounded by another, when the province doesn't receive it's transfer..it has to borrow from somewhere to manage its day to day expenses..limited to where it can borrow from by law the provinces end up borrowing from the Fed gov usually at high interest rates. The end results is the two poorest provinces arre bankrupt.
Also these allocations dont even factor in AJK, FATA and Northern areas which get virtually nothing.
Re: Punjabi Establishment, Punjabi People and Injustices with other Provinces !
^Zakk, opposite of it is also true, provinces do not pay bac what they owe the centre.
^Zakk, opposite of it is also true, provinces do not pay bac what they owe the centre.
Only to an extent icon..if you were to breakdown who owes more it's the federal govt which owes the provinces far more. Using NWFP as an example the supreme court ruled that the federal govt owes NWFP 120 billion rupees for the period between 1990-2002 the total owed by NWFP from 1972-2003 is in the region of 70 billion rupees. So adjusted the province is still owed in dollars almost a billion dollars in lost money.
These figures are specific to NWFP ..Balochistan is owed far far more in % age terms as the Sui gas royalties go back to the 1950's.
These figures dont factor in the NFC awards which are also blatantly unfair too
Re: Punjabi Establishment, Punjabi People and Injustices with other Provinces !
^Balochistan indeed is the most underdeveloped of all provinces and requires more from federal budget. Parlimentry comittee headed by Shujaat before the Bugti saga had recomended to increase gas royalties by 20% but was not done a *******. In this respect, urban Sindh receives much more than its fair share of sate funds.
Though, "equitable" distribution of finances is essential, no one wants to give into its share to others. And what should be the basis of fund allocation is also not agreed upon by provinces, more so by smaller ones. Like Sindh demands share according to revenue, Punjab according to population etc.
ANother thing is that for "most politicians" funds does not seem to be a priority at all. All they talk about is demarcation along ethnic lines. At one hand its so important for "some" pushtun leaders that pushtun areas of Balochistan and Punjab be merged with NWFP, bcoz of language and on other hand they want that every citizen shud have right to move and stay wherever they want to.
^Balochistan indeed is the most underdeveloped of all provinces and requires more from federal budget. Parlimentry comittee headed by Shujaat before the Bugti saga had recomended to increase gas royalties by 20% but was not done a mohajir General. In this respect, urban Sindh receives much more than its fair share of sate funds.
Though, "equitable" distribution of finances is essential, no one wants to give into its share to others. And what should be the basis of fund allocation is also not agreed upon by provinces, more so by smaller ones. Like Sindh demands share according to revenue, Punjab according to population etc.
ANother thing is that for "most politicians" funds does not seem to be a priority at all. All they talk about is demarcation along ethnic lines. At one hand its so important for "some" pushtun leaders that pushtun areas of Balochistan and Punjab be merged with NWFP, bcoz of language and on other hand they want that every citizen shud have right to move and stay wherever they want to.
When the Kalabagh dame issue was hot in Nawaz Sharif time, some nationalist politicions from NWFP agreed to the Kalabagh Dam on the condition that district Miawali that will be irregated though the dam should be allowed to merge with the NWFP but the Punjab government refused. So you are right that politicion whether they are NWFP or Punjab always think locally not nationally.
Not even sure how true these numbers are, but the big issue is revenue generation by provinces other than punjab then end up in punjab through one way or another.
well u will definitly say that now coz everyone knows who u are belonging to and this budget is made by the party belonging to sindh mind it. its PPP's president and prime minister and the president is also from balochistan, now if they all of ur own province and of balochistan are not giving ur own provinces ur rights then why are u propagating about punjabis?
and mind it the propaganda campaigns in sindh and balochistan are not from ordinary patriotic good ppl, they all are from traitor parties who are very ignorant and are getting money for their terrorism from accross the border.
Now look at zardari and PPP Govt, what it has done for sindh? as it belongs to sindh, what the hell MQM has done for karachi? just bomb blasts and terrorism?
So man! just keep ur eyes open and eye on all sides rather then only one side
When the Kalabagh dame issue was hot in Nawaz Sharif time, some nationalist politicions from NWFP agreed to the Kalabagh Dam on the condition that district Miawali that will be irregated though the dam should be allowed to merge with the NWFP but the Punjab government refused. So you are right that politicion whether they are NWFP or Punjab always think locally not nationally.
yes lapak ur right politicians either they are from punjab, sindh, nwfp and balochistan just only think about themselves their personal interests not for the whole nation and Pakistan. selfishess is very high thats why such stupid and ignorance movements are being created and followed up
well u will definitly say that now coz everyone knows who u are belonging to and this budget is made by the party belonging to sindh mind it. its PPP's president and prime minister and the president is also from balochistan, now if they all of ur own province and of balochistan are not giving ur own provinces ur rights then why are u propagating about punjabis?
and mind it the propaganda campaigns in sindh and balochistan are not from ordinary patriotic good ppl, they all are from traitor parties who are very ignorant and are getting money for their terrorism from accross the border.
Now look at zardari and PPP Govt, what it has done for sindh? as it belongs to sindh, what the hell MQM has done for karachi? just bomb blasts and terrorism?
So man! just keep ur eyes open and eye on all sides rather then only one side
Well said Captain, that's pretty much all i wanted to say.
That's quite IDIOTIC to say that funds end up in punjab one way or another, there has been MASSIVE and i mean MASSIVE projects in karachi in the last 5-10 years (i am proud of that) and it's more developed than most cities in Pakistan so only a JAHIL PAINDU or traitor can claim that all funds end up in Punjab.
Even if we suppose most funds end up in punjab, what do non punjabi politicians do about it??? Musharaff ruled for 7 years, Zardari has been there for almost 2 years so non punjabis have been in power in the last decade.
There goes your RUBBISH propaganda out of the window again.
The revenue allocation argument requires a better understanding of how federal systems work and how the Pakistani system works.
Firstly the NFC has two parts, the first is how much money the federal govt compared to the provinces (since 2007 50-50 )and the second is how much is distributed between the provinces and how. So till 2007 only 35% of all revenue was distributed amongst the provinces. So whichever groups dominated the federal govt benefitted more.
Secondly no federal to provincial revenue distribution system in the world allocates according to population or revenue. The reasoning is simple, in the federal system the provinces are equal regardless of size, population or wealth. ThirdlyProvinces/ states join a federal system to be treated equally and not distinguished by population, size or wealth. That is why the key criteria in distribution is usually poverty.
This is one of the most wretched threads one can ever see.
Both sides are trying to win against each other and nobody really cares about making Pakistan more civilized and hence more livable place. Perhaps Pakistanis' belief in too much spirituality means that they are now permanently "out of body", and thus galaxies apart from the reality.
O Bhai logo! Balochistan is underdevelped because of a simple reason! They are way too much tribal compared to other areas.
OR
FATA is underdeveloped compared to Peshawar because FATA is way too much tribal compared to Peshawar.
Getting civilized, having peace, and respecting teachers, schools, police, courts, and army are the preconditions for becoming developed. Major Highways is the second precondition, and after that having large infrastructure projects makes an area more civilized.
On the other hand, even if you pour $billion on primitive bideuns, all of it will surely go to waste.
Instead of blaming Punjab or defending Punjab, how come Balochis are not turning their province to a business friendly place, what stops them from creating the best schools in the country, and what is obstructing Baloch leaders to become less "Sardar" and more like ordinary Balochis?
Why Balochi Sirdars who live in mansions, but exploit ordinary Balochis on daily basis?
Why these Sirdars do not open more schools? and build motorways in their province?
Can any of you quote a Sirdar who has a proposal of building major motorways in the province?
Can any of you quote a Sirdar who has a proposal of building three new IIT standard universities in the province?
The reality is that Balochi Sirdars have been against building highways, and schools, and colleges.
The same is true for the FATA's primitive nomadic tribals. They are the ones who kidnap engineers, and blow up infrastructure.
Come to think of it, if Lahore was a place where engineers are kidnapped for ransom or killed, or the Lahorees refuse to have police officers posted in the city, then guess what?
Even with all the wealth, and schools, and colleges, Lahore will soon be a copy of Kabulistan.
The bottom line is that it is the people who maintain and respect institutions. but if they are held hostage by tribal leaders, and petty nomads, then there is no development.
Look at some of the pathetic tribal societies of Africa. They have diamond mines, they have oil, and they had good schools established by Europeans. But these tribals were too primitive to maintain schools and infrastructure and run good corporations. And guess what? They are killing each other in countries like Liberia. Blood diamonds is a term that identifies primitive tribal behavior of those who could have had more civilized way of processing God given wealth.
All those who sincerely want Balochistan or FATA to develop, must strive for making these areas more civilized.
^pashtun tribal society is different frm baloch one. pashtun tribals dont have sardars and there is no one among them to keep them underdevelop. pashtun tribal backwardness is all bcoz of pakistan governament ignore them.