[QUOTE]
*Originally posted by fatehahmad: *
Mr. Degas:
Nobody is saying that his birth is not a miracle! Can't you read the posts of other readers thoroughly. Indeed its a miracle but not against the laws of Allah. Can't you understand such a simple point!
Why we respect Jesus? because he is the prophet of Allah. Just like every muslim respect Ibrahim, Moses, Noah and other prophets, they also respect Jesus AS.
Why does christians respect Jesus? Why don't you ask that from a christian?
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Thats what I asked how coming of Jesus (AS) against Allah'laws? how humans can know Allah's laws.. others said it was miracle but u said its not impossible.. and how u know its within Allah's laws?
Still waiting for 1 million claim.. was it predicting weather report for decades for rain?
Write now we are discussing the birth of Jesus and the second coming of Jesus. Claims of Hazrat Mirza Ghulam Ahmad of Qadian are not the point of discussion here. We would discuss it later.
Why are you insisting that a miracle has to be a impossible thing. You wrote
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others said it was miracle but u said its not impossible
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A miracle is an event which is rare and not common but that doesn't mean that it should also be impossible. Birth of Jesus is not an impossible thing. It can still happen today but it is such a rare phenomena that it is termed a miracle. But descend of a human from the skies where he has gone 2000 years ago is realy a bizzare idea.
About Allah's law: Can a human become alive after becoming dead? No he can't because its against the laws of Allah! Can you jump while standing on earth and without moving a muscle? No you can't as you can't defy the law of gravity!
About the birth of a child, a semen from men and an egg from woman is required. That is Allah's Law. If somehow both these are present in a woman, then a virgin birth is possible. That is not against the law of Allah.
[QUOTE]
*Originally posted by fatehahmad: *
Mr. Degas:
Write now we are discussing the birth of Jesus and the second coming of Jesus. Claims of Hazrat Mirza Ghulam Ahmad of Qadian are not the point of discussion here. We would discuss it later.
Why are you insisting that a miracle has to be a impossible thing. You wrote .
A miracle is an event which is rare and not common but that doesn't mean that it should also be impossible. Birth of Jesus is not an impossible thing. It can still happen today but it is such a rare phenomena that it is termed a miracle. But descend of a human from the skies where he has gone 2000 years ago is realy a bizzare idea.
About Allah's law: Can a human become alive after becoming dead? No he can't because its against the laws of Allah! Can you jump while standing on earth and without moving a muscle? No you can't as you can't defy the law of gravity!
About the birth of a child, a semen from men and an egg from woman is required. That is Allah's Law. If somehow both these are present in a woman, then a virgin birth is possible. That is not against the law of Allah.
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Those laws of gravitation are for humans.. Allah has no laws and is capable of doing anything.. how did Muhammad (PBUH) went to miraj? just by Allah's grace.. why everone believed him - faith. So saying someone 2000 years (that is human time ) cant come back if Allah wishes is absurd thinking.. I know from very start ahmadis have to learn Mirza is a messenger of Allah but I learnt Muhammad (PBUH) as messenger and last one on earth.. can u post what Mirza wrote about Jesus (AS) .. his birth and life after he left Bethlem for Kashmir..
[QUOTE]
*Originally posted by fatehahmad: *
Mr. Degas:
You are trying to make Islam look like some story out of old greek mythology i.e. gods living in skies, people flying, raising deal people etc. etc.
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There are some faith elements in every religion that one believes without any doubt.. so how did we got 5 daily prayers? As u believe in Mirza's 1 million miracles that is a bit more than and richer than any mythology I believe that those great prophets did at that time.. believing Mirza as messenger of God is the most queer thing in the universe to me and most muslims but u believe it wholeheartedly!
You are talking a lot about a million miracle of Hazrat Mirza Ghulam Ahmad of Qadian, please provide the reference from the books of Hazrat Mirza Ghulam Ahmad of Qadian.
And do you realy believe that offering 5 daily prayers can be equated to somebody flying in the air, making dead people alive, descending bodily from the skies? Funny! The religion of Islam you are trying to present looks more like the religion of a magician.
Proove from Holy Quran that a Prophet can come bodily from Heaven and we accept your theory of Jesus being decent bodily EVEN one incident... but remember one thing
the greatest prophet of all Hazret Mohammad Mustafa (saw) was never decened from heavn bodily IF HE WASNT i dont see anyother prophet would ever be its just that simple try to understand you give too much status to Isa (as) and lower the status of Hazret mohammad (saw) and then blame on Ahmadies.
Hum aah bhi karte hain tu ho jaate hain badnaam
wo qatel bhi karte hain tu charcha nahi hota
Do Justice atleast to your own prophet, What a muslim are you disgracing your own prophet for another prophet of israliets. Wallah What a joke.... Indeeed Holy Prphet (saw) was right when he said.. My ummah will go in the patren of Jews... Now jews didnt recognize Jesus as Massiah they are still waiting for ELEHJA to come from heaven bodily.... AND YOU muslims are doing the same NO DIFFRENCE what so ever between you and the JEWS... Indeed The greatest Prophet of all was right when he was mentioning this take the glasses of ignorance out and see the reality come out from teh fairytales but look what is said in reality.
[QUOTE]
*Originally posted by fatehahmad: *
Mr. Degas:
And the whole existence of Ahmadiyya movement in Islam is not based on Christ's death in Kashmir but rather based on the teachings of Quran and Hadith.
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Really, including the finality of the pophet muhammad(PBUH) which IS from the quran and sunnah itself?
Do Justice atleast to your own prophet, What a muslim are you disgracing your own prophet for another prophet of israliets. Wallah What a joke....
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wallah its a joke....
jesus was a prophet of israelites....
muhammad was of the arabs....
aap ka kon sa hai bhai????
hamaara to aqeeda hai ke sab nabi Allah ke bheje huway hain....
we respect jesus as much as we respect muhammad....
and if one of them is given an honor doesnt make him better than the other....
moosa talked to Allah directly, did he become better than Ibrahim or Isa who did not talk directly to Allah????
Ibrahim is called khaleel-Allah (friend of Allah) by Allah Himself, so does he become better than other prophets????
suleyman was given the kingdom of all the world and he travlled with his throne in the air, did he become the greatest of prophets????
so if Jesus was raised to the heavens why do u think muslims consider him greater than muhammad????
and even muhammad went to the heaven physically....
or do u ahmadis even deny the mairaaj????
have u other intresting stories, that we can tell our children later, how much Since finction we find in your so called Islam?? .
of course we beleieve that Mairaaj was spirituell and not physical, if we would believe in physical, then we HAVE TO believe that Hz Isa :as: will come with body from sky!!!
We respect all prophets, but we give a HIGH status to AnHz Mohammad :saw: for being the BEST Prophet accordig to Holy Quran and Hadith, AnHz Mohammad :saw: wasnt ONLY for arab, he was for the WHOLE world my dear, now u see the difference that Hz Isa :as: was for israilies and AnHz Mohammad :saw: was for the whole world.
and Hz Masih Maood :as: was sent to bring ALL religion to one stage which is ISLAM!
and if u dont believe in the physical miraaj of the prophet Muhammad :saw: u line up with the mushrikeen of Qureysh who denied and ridiculed the prophet when he told them about it…
for me religion supercedes science…
i believe more in religion than in science…
the Qureysh laughed at the thought of a physical miraaj cuz they cud not imagine how someone cud go overnight to jerusalem and be back…
now with the invention of aeroplane, atleast ur science-worshipping brain can imagine how such speeds r possible…
maybe a little more and u will also believe in greater speeds…
but i dont wait for science to tell me what to believe, i believe what Allah and His prophet say…
Mr. Mughal,
For your information there have been clearly two different schools of thought on the issue of Miraaj in Muslim Ummah. One who believed in physical journey and the other who believed in spiritual one.
when u dont have answers, you come up with this issue, which is answerd by me thrice, even I explained with the ORIGINAL Page, but NO NO you end up.
acctually zehan bhi chotha, soch bhi choti(small brain and small thought)
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