psyah's signature

Society Religion & Philosophy
21

Re: psyah's signature

no worries..=)

22

Re: psyah’s signature

Peace ashykh

Nice to see you’re selecting a worthy byline from the ahadith. The truth is both of these statements are true and they were said not necessarily at the same time. The understanding is this:

a) Protect and Guard
b) To be guided by

We have been instructed the take guidance from the Qur’an and Sunnah and hence we must protect the Qur’an (verses which have been scribed and memorised) and we must protect the Ahl-al-bayt who are the narrators and propagators of the Sunnah.

Kindly tell your friend that he/she is absolutely right that the other statement is true, but also say that your one is true also … You see we need to follow the Sunnah and in order to preserve the Sunnah we protect the Ahl-al-Bayt.

23

Re: psyah's signature

Prophets in the Quran are commanded not to ask for anything in return for the message that they deliver from Allah SWT.......

Nuh (a.s.) says:"And O' nation, no wealth do I ask from you for this. My reward is but with Allah."
(Hudd:29)

Nuh (a.s.) says:"And no reward do I ask from you for this. My reward is only with the Lord of the worlds.
(Shua'raa:109)

Hud (a.s.) says:"And no reward do I ask from you for this. My reward is only with the Lord of the worlds."
(Shua'raa:127)

Lut (a.s.) says: "And no reward do I ask from you for this. My reward is only with the Lord of the worlds."
(Shua'raa:164)

لShu'ayb (a.s.) says: "And no reward do I ask from you for this. My reward is only with the Lord of the worlds."
(Shua'raa:180)

these statements are a proof that the Prophets were sincere in their mission....and their claim to Prophethood had no personal benefit.....even their enemies could not accuse them of lying since a liar utilizes false power for a personal gain, whereas the Prophets sacrifice everything in order to spread the guidance of the Almighty (hallmark of the guides of Allah is that they sacrifice themselves for the sake of truth and not go around chopping necks of others).....and thus they were commanded by Allah SWT to reject any reward in return for guiding people.........

Prophet Mohammad SAWW too refused any reward from the people.......instead the goal is that people "take a way to his Lord".....

"Say: I do not ask any wage for this except he who wills take a way to his Lord."
(Furqaan:57)

If he SAWW asks for a wage then it is for the benefit of the believers so they get closer to the goal mentioned in the above verse......

"Say: whatever I have asked for a wage is for yourselves. My reward is only with Allah, and He is witness of all things."
(Saba:47)

The wage asked by the Prophet SAWW is.......

"Say: I do not ask any wage for this except the love for the close kin."
(Shura:23)

24

Re: psyah's signature

The Shi'ah believe that the twin legacy of Prophet Muhammad (s) is the Qur'an and the Ahl al-Bayt (specific members of his family).
The Ahl al-Bayt are the source for the authentic Sunnah of the Prophet (s).
Only by obtaining instruction from both these sources can a Muslim hope to attain true guidance.

Prophet Muhammad’s Legacy

[QUOTE]

"I am about to answer the call (of death). Verily, I leave behind two precious things (thaqalayn) amongst you:
the Book of Allah and my Ahl alBayt. Verily, the two will never separate until they come back to me by the side of the Pond."

[/QUOTE]

This authentic hadith from the Prophet Muhammad (s) is narrated by over 30 of his Companions and recorded by a large number of Sunni scholars.

**Some of the famous sources for this hadith include:

alHakim alNaysaburi, alMustadrak `ala al-Sahihayn (Beirut), volume 3, pages 109-110, 148, and 533). He expressly states that the tradition is sahih in accordance with the criteria of alBukhari and Muslim; alDhahabi has confirmed his judgement
Muslim, al-Sahih, (English translation), book 031, numbers 5920-3

alTirmidhi, al-Sahih, volume 5, pages 621-2, numbers 3786 and 3788; volume 2, page 219

al-Nasa'i, Khasa'is’Ali ibn Abi Talib, hadith number 79Ahmad b. Hanbal,

al-Musnad, volume 3, pages 14, 17, 26; volume 3, page 26, 59; volume 4, page 371; volume 5, pages 181-2, 189-190

Ibn al'Athir, Jami` al'usul, volume 1, page 277Ibn Kathir,

alBidayah wa alnihayah, volume 5, page 209. He quotes al-Dhahabi and declares this hadith to be sahih. Ibn Kathir, Tafsir al-Qur’an al-‘Azim , volume 6, page 199

Nasir al-Din al-Albani, Silsilat al-Ahadith al-Sahiha (Kuwait: al-Dar al-Salafiyya), volume 4, pages 355-8. He lists many chains of narration that he considers reliable.**

There are many more sources for this hadith than it is possible to list here.

Didn't the Prophet (s) say "I leave behind the Book of God and my Sunnah" ?

This is a popular misconception.
The fact is that there is no reliable basis for this statement attributed to the Prophet’s (s) Final Sermon.
It is completely absent from any of the six Sihah books!!

The version in Malik’s Muwatta’, Ibn Hisham’s Sirat Rasul Allah,
and from him in al-Tabari’s Ta’rikh,
all suffer from incomplete chains of narration with several links in the chain missing!

The other versions that have a full chain of narration (isnad) - of which there are very few - all contain narrators that are unanimously considered to be highly unreliable by leading
Sunni scholars of rijal.

These remarkable facts can be confirmed by those interested in research by referring to the relevant books.

Clearly, no one is suggesting that the Sunnah of the Prophet (s) should not be followed.
As stated before, the Prophet (s) wished for the Muslims to refer to his Ahl al-Bayt as a reliable, pure and inerrant source for his Sunnah.

25

Re: psyah's signature

Now I shall answer the bold part of your dual question:

What is so special about the Family of the Prophet (s) ?

When the verse
[QUOTE]
"(O Muhammad) Say, 'I do not ask for any reward for this (bringing of Allah's message) except the love for the near kinship.'" (42:23)
[/QUOTE]
was revealed, the Muslims asked the Prophet:
[QUOTE]
"Who are these near kin of yours whose love is obligatory upon us?"
[/QUOTE]
He replied,
[QUOTE]
"'Ali, Fatima, and their two sons."
[/QUOTE]

alHakim alNaysaburi, alMustadrak `ala al-Sahihayn, volume 2, page 444
al-Qastallani, Irshad al-Sari Sharh Sahih al-Bukhari, volume 7, page 331
al-Suyuti, al-Durr al-Manthur, volume 6, pages 6-7
al-Alusi al-Baghdadi, Ruh al-Ma’ani, volume 25, pages 31-2

The position of truthfulness and virtue of the Ahl al-Bayt was further confirmed by the Qur’an during the disputation with the Christians of Najran. When the verse was revealed

[QUOTE]
"But whoever disputes with you in this matter after what has come to you of knowledge, then say: come let us call our sons and your sons and our women and your women and our near people and your near people, then let us be earnest in prayer, and pray for the curse of Allah on the liars." (3:61)
[/QUOTE]
, the Prophet (s) called ‘Ali, Fatima, al-Hasan and al-Husayn and said:
[QUOTE]
‘O Allah, these are my Family (Ahli)’.

[/QUOTE]

Muslim, al-Sahih, (English translation), book 031, number 5915
alHakim alNaysaburi, alMustadrak `ala al-Sahihayn, volume 3, page 150. He states that it is sahih in accordance with the criteria of al-Bukhari and Muslim
Ibn Hajar al-‘Asqalani, Fath al-Bari Sharh Sahih al-Bukhari, volume 7, page 60
al-Tirmidhi, al-Sahih, kitab al-manaqib, volume 5, page 596
Ahmad b. Hanbal, al-Musnad, volume 1, page 185
al-Suyuti, History of Khalifas Who Took The Right Way, (London, 1995), page 176

Isn't it enough to show respect towards the Ahl al-Bayt ?

Is it sufficient to just show respect towards the Qur’an? Surely the Muslims have no choice but to follow it, as a source of Divine guidance, in all their affairs. The Prophet Muhammad (s) left two things as legacy to the Muslims, and promised that they will never separate from each other until the Day of Judgement. **By twinning the Ahl al-Bayt with the Qur’an, the Prophet (s) was telling us to not only show respect towards them, but also to take explanations of Islamic doctrine, practices, hadith and tafsir from them.

**

[QUOTE]
"Behold! My Ahl al-Bayt are like the Ark of Noah. Whoever embarked on it was saved, and whoever turned away from it perished"

[/QUOTE]
alHakim alNaysaburi, alMustadrak `ala al-Sahihayn, volume 3, p. 151 and volume 2, page 343.
He states that it is sahih in accordance with the criteria of Muslim
al-Suyuti, al-Durr al-Manthur, volume 1, pages 71-72
Ibn Hajar al-Makki, al-Sawa’iq al-Muhriqa, page 140. He states that this tradition has come down through many chains of narration that strengthen each other.

Who are included in the Ahlul Bait?
**
It has been shown that the Family of the Prophet (s) – interchangeably referred to as the **Ahl al-Bayt, ‘Itrah and Aal - included his daughter Fatima al-Zahra’, her husband Imam ‘Ali, and their children Imams al-Hasan and al-Husayn (‘a).

The members of this Family of five, with the Prophet Muhammad (s) at its head, were the ones alive at the time the Qur’anic verses regarding their virtue were being revealed to the Prophet (s). However, nine other Imams from the descendants of Imam al-Husayn (‘a) are also in this chosen Family, the final one being Imam al-Mahdi (‘a).

The Prophet (s) said:

[QUOTE]
"I and ‘Ali and al-Hasan and al-Husayn and nine of the descendants of al-Husayn are the purified ones and the inerrant."
[/QUOTE]

al-Juwayni, Fara'id al-Simtayn, (Beirut, 1978), page 160. Note that al-Juwayni’s greatness as a scholar of hadith has been attested by al-Dhahabi in Tadhkirat al-Huffaz, volume 4, page 298, and also by Ibn Hajar al-‘Asqalani in al-Durar al-Kaminah, volume 1, page 67

[QUOTE]

"I am the chief of the Prophets and ‘Ali ibn Abi Talib is the chief of successors, and after me my successors shall be twelve, the first of them being ‘Ali ibn Abi Talib and the last of them being al-Mahdi."
[/QUOTE]
[al-Juwayni, Fara'id al-Simtayn, page 160]

[QUOTE]
"Al-Mahdi is one of us Ahl al-Bayt" and "al-Mahdi will be of my family, of the descendants of Fatima"
[/QUOTE]
[Ibn Majah, al-Sunan, volume 2, page 519, numbers 4085-6; Abu Dawud, al-Sunan, volume 2, page 207]

26

Re: psyah's signature

Bro Psyah, out of curiosity, why won't you have the Sahi version from 6 famous Sunni books of hadith?

27

Re: psyah's signature

Appreciate the reply. :). Jazak Allah Khair

28

Re: psyah's signature

Jazak Allah

29

Re: psyah's signature

:)

30

Re: psyah's signature

Peace Pagluu

They are both Sahi and they are both saying two different things:

The narration which mentions the Ahl-ul-Bayt is about obligation to protect

And the narration about the Sunnah is about how we will never go astray

31

Re: psyah’s signature

Whats the point ?

Ahlul Bayt & Sunnah go side by side. would you expect from Husayn(ra) , Hassan(ra) , Fatima(ra), Zainul Abideen(ra) , Jaffar Sadiq (ra) etc & above all Janab-e-Ameer (ra) that they ever acted against Sunnah of Prophet (pbuh) ?

Yes thats another debate that changing every Ritual & Aqaid from kalima , namaz , roza , zakat , wuzu to concepts of Wilayt-e-Faqih , Imamat ,Taqiya & Incomplete Quran etc ever be believed or practised by Ahlul Bayt or came after Safavid Dynasty took control of present Iran in 1501 !

32

Re: psyah's signature

STA Bro!

What do you mean by original family of Prophet Muhammad (saw)?

33

Re: psyah's signature

All the versions from the Sahi book of hadiths read "Quran and Ahlul Bayt". Outside Sahi book of hadiths too, 95% of the versions read "Quran and Ahlul Bayt". I will research the one that reads "Quran and Sunnah" and get back to you here. If it is true then I agree more with what you said in post # 22 about its meaning that "and we must protect the Ahl-al-bayt who are the narrators and propagators of the Sunnah".

34

Re: psyah's signature

No dear, there are no two different things. The 'protection' interpretation advanced by you seem quite odd actually because the Hadith al Thaqlayn clealry says about adhering to Ahulbayt - so that you may not go astray i.e. this Hadith directs us to follow Ahlulbayt.

يا أيها الناس ! إني قد تركت فيكم ما إن أخذتم به لن تضلوا ؛ كتاب الله وعترتي أهل بيتي
“O people! I am leaving among you what if you follow them, you will never go astray; the book of Allah and my Etra my Ahlulbayt’
Declared ‘Sahih’ by Imam Albaani in Silsila Sahiha, volume 4 page 355.

And I do not intend to get invovled into any controversy but a Salafi scholar of this age namely Hassan bin Farhan al-Maliki in his book “kitab Allah wa Sunnati” page 71 has stated:

(...كتاب الله وسنتي) وهو حديث ضعيف عند محققي أهل السنة(…
**"(The book of Allah and my sunnah) this is a weak tradition according to Sunnis scholars"

**

35

Re: psyah’s signature

[59:7] …So take what the Messenger assigns to you, and deny yourselves that which he withholds from you. And fear Allah; for Allah is strict in Punishment.

The point is that^. There must be a very good reason why Prophet (saww) reiterated this point over and over. And there is a reason why he was denied writing a will.

errr…actually it is not a a debate at all. If you open new discussion then a simple mathematical equation will show you the fallacy of the above notion.

36

Re: psyah’s signature

Al Muwata’ by Imam Dal Al Hijra Malik Ibn Anas, vol. 2, pg. 480. Assesses two chains of narrations for the hadith “Quran and Sunnah”. Grades it ‘very weak’ and says “these two narrations are virtually nothing!”.

In Al Mustadrak, vol.1, pg. 93; “the weakness of this hadtih becomes apparent to me”

Ahmad Ibn Hajar says that the “chain is unknown”

Salafi scholar Amr Abdul Munim Salim says that “the chain is very weak” and the word “‘my Sunnah’ have no authentic chain!”

110.JPG
110.JPG487×303 17.6 KB

Restored attachments:

110.JPG
110.JPG800×600 18.3 KB

113.JPG
113.JPG800×600 24.2 KB

111.JPG
111.JPG800×600 27.1 KB

112.JPG
112.JPG800×600 23.4 KB

37

Re: psyah's signature

Very interesting verses. In Nahjul Balagha Imam Ali (as) says that in a battlefield Prophet (saww) used to send his own family members of Bani Hashim to fight out the battle at the front. Imam Ali (as) too in the battles of Jamal, Siffein, Naharwan had his sons Mohammad ibn al Hannafiya, and Abbas leading the people. This was so nobody could ever get a chance to doubt the truthfulness and sincerity of their mission.

38

Re: psyah’s signature

Peace Pagluu

This wiki link I don’t agree with 100% however it will give the gist of this debate. Ultimately for many informed Sunnis all four khalifas were from ahl-al-bayt anyway it is a non- issue for me since both of these Hadith are complementary and not contradictory in any way.

39

Re: psyah's signature

^"Quran and Ahlulbayt" is undoubted in terms of authenticity and is in line with the message of the holy Quran. "Quran and Sunnah" is far weaker in authenticity however if it is interpreted in a certain way then it can be said that it is complementary in matan with the "Quran and Ahlul Bayt".
I will be keen to see how you view the term 'Ahlul Bayt'. Though it is already mentioned in Quran in a very special way that protects it from being misinterpreted. It is present in the books of Hadiths too. Historical accounts will also show which people claimed to be from this special group.

40

Re: psyah's signature

And nobody could feel that Islam owes them.......can u refer me to the sermon? Allahuma salleala Mohammad wa aalay Mohammad......