Proud to be a Pakistani?

Proud to be a Pakistani?
Ahmed Sadozai

It has been almost 56 years but India and Pakistan have not yet overcome their hatred against each other which has been fuelled by two things, mainly the Kashmir issue & secondly by the stories of butchery and loss of Muslim lives at the time of the partition which our parents and grandparents have been telling us.

Being a Pakistani, hating India and wanting to destroy India and all Hindus come natural to us. It is a national pastime to sit in the living room with some friends and criticise the riots in India where lots of Muslims are butchered. In our conflict with India over Kashmir, Pakistan’s side of the story is that we want justice for the people of Kashmir, and we want the people of Kashmir to decide their future for themselves, our point being that the Muslims in Kashmir are living in unsafe and unjust conditions. India’s claim is that Pakistan supports terrorist groups in their deadly incursions across the border in the “occupied” Kashmir. I do not know how much truth there is in this claim but that is a fact that all the radical Islamic groups known to us as ‘Mujahideen’, who find pride in taking the blame for countless massacres of Hindu civilians in Kashmir, are trained and based in Pakistan where they have originated.

Pakistani ministers and generals, who are the men of utmost power in Pakistan, claim that Pakistan wants peace in the region, but they do not let an opportunity get away to also boast that if India shows aggression, Pakistan will answer it with even more aggression, and ‘Pakistan knows how to defend its borders’, and ‘Pakistan is not Iraq, and we know how to fight the invaders’ and stuff like that. Someone should ask them that regardless of Pakistan’s ability to fight off India and our so called great achievement of being a nuclear power; does Pakistan match India in other, a bit positive aspects? Does Pakistan have educational institutes like IIT (Indian Institute of Technology) and IIM (Indian Institute of Management) where the quality of education matches the best universities of the western world and where it is said that getting admission in IIT Madras or Kanpur is harder than getting admission in Stanford, Harvard or MIT (Massachusetts Institute of Technology)? Does Pakistan match the software exports of India? Does our state bank hold more than $75 billion as foreign exchange reserves? Does Pakistan enjoy as much foreign investment and confidence as India? Do the most successful businesses in the world invest in Pakistan as they invest in India? Will Bill Gates ever pay a visit to our Haiderabad as he did in the Indian state of Hyderabad and met with its chief minister and invested huge sums of money in their Software industry?

Our leaders do not even seem to be interested in educating the people of Pakistan. In our government schools, teaching English alphabets ABC starts from the 6th grade, what can we expect from such a system? Where there is a subject called Pakistan studies, the most of which revolves around what atrocities Hindus and Sikhs committed to Muslims at the time of the partition and how unfairly Lord Mount Batten divided the subcontinent. Our leaders sitting in their big houses, driving their big cars, surrounded by body guards, partying at their farm houses do not seem to bother as to what the future holds for overly ambitious students like myself who are made to stand at the end of the line at every job opportunity around the world because of the known educational standards in Pakistan and the green colour of our passports.

It has been a long time since I stopped caring about what happens in Kashmir and paying any attention to all those mass emails which are sent to me with grizzly pictures of corpses in Kashmir and Palestine and which say in the end that if I am a true Muslim I will forward this email to at least 10 other people. I simply delete all those emails. I did not take sides in the war on Iraq. I feel sorry for a dead Iraqi soldier as much as I feel sorry for a dead American or British soldier. Because firstly, I am not Iraqi and secondly, I am too concerned about me and my future and the future of millions of other Pakistani students who can only dream of a career as promising as that of an American or a British student or even an Indian student, to be paying attention to whoever wins the war in Iraq. We should try to follow India, not regarding the missiles and weapons but regarding economic growth, health and education. If enemies like Britain and France who fought for centuries can become friends and trade partners, so can we.

I want to see my fellow Pakistanis getting jobs, supporting their families better, educating their children and ensuring a bright future for them. I want to see a branch of HSBC, a McDonald’s, a school, a university, a Gucci outlet, and a Ferrari showroom in my village and I want the sons of our “Mazaras”, whose fathers and forefather had served my father and forefather, to drive a Mercedes or to win the Wimbledon or the PGA tour, or to get a Nobel prize.

I think the day that we stop using Islamic fanaticism to hinder our country’s progress and development, the day that we forget that we have a right on the Indian part of the Kashmir as well and the day a student like me, a teacher, a scientist, an economist, an educationalist, a banker or a scholar can have a chance of getting elected by the same people who only elect candidates from their “Biradari”, and ruling Pakistan, that is the day when I will be literally “Proud to be a Pakistani”.

http://www.chowk.com/show_article.cgi?aid=00002874&channel=civic%20center

Re: Proud to be a Pakistani?

All he wants is foreign firms to drain Pakistan’s wealth. Why did he not have the honour to think about Pakistani companies doing the same. A very silly example he gave. How is he going to be a proud Pakistani while sitting on an Italian car and wearing Western clothes?? I wonder what kind of pride would the great nations like Japanese , Koreans, etc. have while using their own stuff. Thats what I would call a proud citizen. Besides, there is more to like than just these materitic things; honour, respect, values, traditions and most importantly Allahs’s happiness.

Re: Proud to be a Pakistani?

He has stopped caring for his brothers, so his consciounce is dead!

Here is nationalism for you :rolleyes:

No Iam not proud. Cause the reason why Pakistan was made, was never understood by the people they dont even want to talk about it. We are cheating the ONE who provided us with freedom, who provided us with a country in which we could live freely.

You talk about being proud? Dude....iam ashamed rite now.

This guys article only shows how selfish he is. What is happening to Pakistanis? Do we want to turn into another Turkey? Musharraf’s already said that Kamal Attaturk is his role model :eek: That statement of his just freaked me out.

Do we just want to forget our religion, the reason why we are called Pakistanis in the first place? Pakistan was solely made so that we can practice our religion freely. If we dont care about Islam and Muslims around the world anymore we should just get back with India. Live happily with India, have one huge secular state and live happily ever after.

I 2nd that.

Keeping in view where we are heading, i have lost hope. Maybe in the next 50 years there will be no pakistan. it will be all india.

These secular morons on this board blindly support mushi, to the extent that they even forget what the reality is. I ask all of them, forget about Islam for a moment. I am not talking of an islamic system. Ok, lets consider a secular system. What is more important for a coutnry is democracy and justice. No one, none of the military rulers want that there be rule of law. Which fools paradise do you live in. We don’t have justice in our country. forget all politicians, mma, ppp, ml etc…all crap..!! all fools! Where are we heading. Allah hi bachaey.

Re: Proud to be a Pakistani?

since people took some words of this guy and started jumping up and down, let me also showcase a few words and ask what is wrong with those words..and some other words that are idiotic

lets not get some of his words and statements, that you or I disagree with, get in the way of the good points he is making..

** It has been almost 56 years but India and Pakistan have not yet overcome their hatred against each other **

*Being a Pakistani, hating India and wanting to destroy India and all Hindus come natural to us. *

maybe in his lil peela school..but that is not the case.

*It is a national pastime to sit in the living room with some friends and criticise the riots in India where lots of Muslims are butchered. *

the same way events in Pakistan are criticised, even on this board pak govt is criticized more than indian :)

Pakistani ministers and generals, who are the men of utmost power in Pakistan, claim that Pakistan wants peace in the region, but they do not let an opportunity get away to also boast that if India shows aggression, Pakistan will answer it with even more aggression, and ‘Pakistan knows how to defend its borders’, and ‘Pakistan is not Iraq, and we know how to fight the invaders’ and stuff like that.

so what should they say "oh please please dont attack us" and "my bad, I am sorry"

*Does Pakistan have educational institutes like IIT (Indian Institute of Technology) and IIM (Indian Institute of Management) where the quality of education matches the best universities of the western world and where it is said that getting admission in IIT Madras or Kanpur is harder than getting admission in Stanford, Harvard or MIT (Massachusetts Institute of Technology)? *

no disrespect to IIT and IIm which are indeed world class institutions which our institutes can learn a lot from, but on the point that its harder to get admission into them than it is to get admission into harvard, MIT etc, its a simple supply and demand and capacity issue, applicants to accepted students ratio in pakistani institutes like LUMS, IBA, AKU and actually most enginering and medical schools surpasses those of harvard and MIT. just count the number of pre-med high school students or pre-engineering high school students and compare that to how many get in these schools.

*Does Pakistan match the software exports of India? Does our state bank hold more than $75 billion as foreign exchange reserves? Does Pakistan enjoy as much foreign investment and confidence as India? Do the most successful businesses in the world invest in Pakistan as they invest in India? Will Bill Gates ever pay a visit to our Haiderabad as he did in the Indian state of Hyderabad and met with its chief minister and invested huge sums of money in their Software industry? *

Good points, we need to do a lot more, and it appears that the current govt is taking the right steps to make improvements in this area.

Our leaders do not even seem to be interested in educating the people of Pakistan. In our government schools, teaching English alphabets ABC starts from the 6th grade, what can we expect from such a system?

agree with first point, disagree with second point. education system needs a major overhaul, and english is important as it is really the global language for business, however sciences and even trades need to be taught more ..ppl can catch up with language if their field requires it.

** Where there is a subject called Pakistan studies, the most of which revolves around what atrocities Hindus and Sikhs committed to Muslims at the time of the partition and how unfairly Lord Mount Batten divided the subcontinent. **

must not be the same books I read.

*I am too concerned about me and my future and the future of millions of other Pakistani students who can only dream of a career as promising as that of an American or a British student or even an Indian student, *

any issues here?

*We should try to follow India, not regarding the missiles and weapons but regarding economic growth, health and education. If enemies like Britain and France who fought for centuries can become friends and trade partners, so can we. *

anything wrong with this comment?

*I want to see my fellow Pakistanis getting jobs, supporting their families better, educating their children and ensuring a bright future for them.....and I want the sons of our “Mazaras”, whose fathers and forefather had served my father and forefather, to drive a Mercedes or to win the Wimbledon or the PGA tour, or to get a Nobel prize. *

any issues here?

[QUOTE]
*Originally posted by laeeqkhan: *
These secular morons on this board blindly support mushi, to the extent that they even forget what the reality is.
[/QUOTE]

who do you support? hey I will even allow u to give more than one answer :)

name 1:.................. and why...........
name 2:.................. and why...........
name 3:.................. and why...........

PS: Islam, Allah and rasool are not the answers I am looking for. I am looking for the names of a person or persons that you support to run pakistan and why. gracias

^ Imran Khan. Read his article on India. Man makes perfect sense, plus doesn’t have any sort of favoritism or past bad history associated with him. We do need a new face in our politics. He is a strong willed and independent person, we already have lots of YES men. He has a vision for Pakistan, his objective isn’t simply to gain and remain in power. Pakistan is usually the last thing on our politicans’ minds. Lastly, he would never be involved in any corruption scandals.

Tehreek-e-Insaaf :jhanda:

PS. If anything, our cricket will be in better shape :smiley:

Aaap ka naam laeeq khan hai?

Wisay, I like Imran, its bad that the rest of the country does not really like him. The mullah types drag his personal life and past into it, dunno why others dont support it.

I had requested from Imran, just like I have requested from numerous political parties to share their plans, not just the manifesto and charter but the specific ideas that they will implement, and how for all sorts of different things.

I did not get anything, so am assuming that either there is nto plan, or that its a big secret and not to be shared with public.

dont get me wrong, I think Imran has a good heart, although his leadership style may be similar to musharraf than most think, after all his track record as the cpatian of pak cricketteam shows him to be quite autocratic.

Some of his statements also, although good for news fodder dont really have much supporting it. I man its political posture and stance, but being anti-this and anti-that does little unless you can show what you would do instead and how...tehrik e insaaf although a good party on paper, has failed miserably in this arena.

but, i still think Imran is sincere and will do what he feels is right, even if majority of ppl in pakistan seem to reject him

[QUOTE]
*Originally posted by Fraudz: *
Aaap ka naam laeeq khan hai?

Wisay, I like Imran, its bad that the rest of the country does not really like him. The mullah types drag his personal life and past into it, dunno why others dont support it.

I had requested from Imran, just like I have requested from numerous political parties to share their plans, not just the manifesto and charter but the specific ideas that they will implement, and how for all sorts of different things.

I did not get anything, so am assuming that either there is nto plan, or that its a big secret and not to be shared with public.

dont get me wrong, I think Imran has a good heart, although his leadership style may be similar to musharraf than most think, after all his track record as the cpatian of pak cricketteam shows him to be quite autocratic.

Some of his statements also, although good for news fodder dont really have much supporting it. I man its political posture and stance, but being anti-this and anti-that does little unless you can show what you would do instead and how...tehrik e insaaf although a good party on paper, has failed miserably in this arena.

but, i still think Imran is sincere and will do what he feels is right, even if majority of ppl in pakistan seem to reject him
[/QUOTE]

Well, considering this is a public thread, I don't see why I shouldn't interject. I am sure laeeqkhan will also respond.

I agree with what you say, in no way is he an ideal candidate. But if I had to choose someone from the current lot, I would say he miles ahead of the competition. Having a sincere and good heart in the interest for Pakistan is indeed a rare commodity these days.

Fraudz an excellent response. Very unbiased and very shagedalic. Yeah baby!. I liked it

[QUOTE]
*Originally posted by Fraudz: *

who do you support? hey I will even allow u to give more than one answer :)

name 1:.................. and why...........
name 2:.................. and why...........
name 3:.................. and why...........

PS: Islam, Allah and rasool are not the answers I am looking for. I am looking for the names of a person or persons that you support to run pakistan and why. gracias
[/QUOTE]

Musharraf is following his own agenda or maybe someone else's. He has taken many positive steps but a LOT of negative ones. I do not see anyone capable enough to rule, atleast till now. May Allah give us a leader with a vision.

I will tell you why I would **NOT **support the following.

name 1:.......PML (their rep) maybe Nawaz........... and why....coward and was a thief.....(there is no big or a small thief, a thief is a thief) +he was a peer faqeer mazar chaddar kind of a person. Mushrik!..

name 2:........Bibi (Bhutto's daughter).......... and why.. biggest thief. Most importantly she was a women and a women leader is not allowed Islamically, as Allah did send us disgrace.+Her father broke away East Pakistan........

name 3:......Qazi Hussein Ahmed............ and why...He does not have the vision + he is using Islam for his own goals. I am no more a fan of Jamaat e Islami, it is into politics more than Islam , Their direction ain't right........

name 1:.....Imran Khan............. and why...... No way,. I may agree with what he says, but he cannot lead us because of many reasons. He is not that experienced + he has no Islamic vision + his party same like others - iqtidaar, iqtidaar iqtidaar.....

Somebody from Hizb Tehrir , no! Because their ideals are correct but strategy wrong!

I do not even see someone even far away who would be eligible to lead the Islamic Republic of Pakistan in the right direction.

I do not believe in the same election process anymore. It will be a miracle from Allah that someone will take over and kill thousands of thieves. I will telll you why... The lection process of democracy is good but it won't work and lead to justice in Pakistan until we have waderas, landowners and jgeerdars. These dogs left by the Brtish should either be beheaded and their land taken or warned to voluntarily give up their land. Then we can have a fair election. India got rid of them earlier and so is seeing the fruits in the form of a working democracy.

After a complete education for everyone would we have an Islamic revoltion by the people , not imposed. Change would not come from top but from within. It has to be accepted and understood by the people. Elections is not going to bring change. It will only change faces and thats it. Pakistan will run the way it is but without much respect in the world. So I am waiting for that miracle. And I really have given up hope on Pakistan the way it is being run. Most importantly, when Islam is being taken out of the equation and secularisation promoted, you may see in the near future provinces asking for autonomy as Muslims we are one, otherwise we are more proud to be Punjabi, Pathan, Sindhi and Baluchi. Its quite simple to understand what is going wrong.

Laeeq, I agree with you 98%. I also dont like Imarn because he was once married to a Jew. That’s really very very bad.

:jhanda:

I vote for Laeeq Khan.

Meri Laee Teri Laee Sab ki Laee, Laeeq Khan!

Laeeq Khan Zindabad. Baqi Sab Murdabad

:jhanda:

[QUOTE]
*Originally posted by skhan: *

Well, considering this is a public thread, I don't see why I shouldn't interject. I am sure laeeqkhan will also respond.

[/QUOTE]

qibla, its is a public forum aap ki jahan marzi taang arrayen, no issues. its just that sometimes ppl use multiple nicks and in the josh o jazba of posting forget which nick they are using, I was just trying to be nice and make sure I indicated that if u were laeeq khan using 2 nicks that saved u some sharmindagi, but since u are not, it does not even matter.

I agree on your point about Imran, but realize that even with a good heart and sincere intentions, his mgmt style would make some ppl cry that he is not letting the right ppl do this or he is letting the wrong ppl do that. In the end he will use whatever means at his disposal to do what he thinks is right.

That is something musharraf does as well.

[QUOTE]
*Originally posted by Fraudz: *

qibla, its is a public forum aap ki jahan marzi taang arrayen, no issues. its just that sometimes ppl use multiple nicks and in the josh o jazba of posting forget which nick they are using, I was just trying to be nice and make sure I indicated that if u were laeeq khan using 2 nicks that saved u some sharmindagi, but since u are not, it does not even matter.

I agree on your point about Imran, but realize that even with a good heart and sincere intentions, his mgmt style would make some ppl cry that he is not letting the right ppl do this or he is letting the wrong ppl do that. In the end he will use whatever means at his disposal to do what he thinks is right.

That is something musharraf does as well.
[/QUOTE]

I am sorry for the confusion. Nope we both may be khans but we are not related. :)

As for your point regarding doing what's right, well to me it matters more what the leader's vision of "right" is rather than what others are going to say about how he gets things done. I am sure Musharraf may well have a similar style, but I doubt he has the same idealogies.

How do you know, lets just contrast musharraf and Imran's ideologies here. I think there are more similarities than not.

i dint read the article :smiley:

but: am i “Proud to be a Pakistani”?

HECK YEAH!

PAKISTAN ZINDABAD

:jhanda: :jhanda: :jhanda:
:jhanda: :jhanda:
:jhanda:

Irem, your Jhanda arrangement reminds me of the poem:

Panch Chohay jo Ghar say Niklay
Karnay Chalay Shikar

Aik Chohay ko Kha gae Billie
Baki reh gaey Char

:jhanda: