President Trump tweet on Pakistan

[Anwer_Pasha]

Re: President Trump tweet on Pakistan

@phoenixdesi

and to your point, i raised these 2 questions in post 15](http://gupshup.org/gs/usertag.php?do=list&action=hash&hash=15) above and folks started to get mad at me:

1. what if USA takes hafiz saeed down by a drown strike? he is roaming around openly these days and is an easy target. if you dont know, hafiz saeed is an internationally designated terrorist and in April 2012, the United States announced a bounty of $10 million on him and US can pursue any terrorist anywhere on this planet as it has in the past without any legal implications.** if this happens what will we do? will be utter humiliation for us and matter of great joy for India**

2. reports suggest that US agencies are vigorously gathering intelligence about haqqani and afghan taliban leadership whereabouts in Quetta, Peshawar, Karachi and punjab. what if Americans carry drone strikes on our cities targeting these leaders? we all saw how pathetic, buzdal, ineffective, and loser we were when Americans came for bin laden. our army became a laughing stock globally. we will become a laughing stock again. do we have any strategy? are we going to take those drones down? what if they are manned?

Big fear is this that these US drone could fly from India

[Anwer_Pasha]

Re: President Trump tweet on Pakistan

****Matiullah Jan**‏ **@Matiullahjan919](https://twitter.com/Matiullahjan919)FollowFollow @Matiullahjan919

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[RIGHT]چودھری صاب ! تے فر میں انکار ای سمجھاں ؟[/RIGHT]
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[ehsan]

Re: President Trump tweet on Pakistan

@phoenixdesi

maeray mohtram sir jee, if you read my post with less emotions, you will realize that I was raising a totallly different question. my question was why do we lie in our narrative? when US and their allies blame us for supporting afghan taliban/haqqani network who attack on Afghan cities and allied froces, we say bul****, we have sacrificed 70K lives but that is a white lie. we did not sacrifice a singe life fighting afghan taliban/haqqanis. we actually supported them one way or the other. we lost 70K fighting TTP which has an intrrnal agenda in Pakistan and who does not attack allied forces or afghan citizens. That is why our narrative is so weak.

I never said that US does not support TTP or shelter them

so sir jee, why cant Pak army establishment stand up and say the right narrative. why cant they say openly and publicly (not behind the dorrs) that Yes we support haqqani/afghan taliban because this is in alignment with our strategic objectives to control afghanistan to gain freakin strategic dept and counter india instead of keep on repeating we lost 70K lives when they did not lose one person fighting afghan taliban.

they cannot say it openly because we are on wrong side of the history. afghan taiban/haqqani are dark forces and there is no room for these animals in today’s world.

In a war you don’t lose people on war front only these people were killed by TTP coming over to pakistan with the active support of America. tell me something, lets forget haqqani group for a moment, why has ISIS mushrooming under the US forces in afghanistan? Any answer. is it incompetence of the American forces as usual or a deliberate attempt by US.

And you didnt reply to that idiot keeping his promises, you believe in trump well I rather not comment on that.

[ehsan]

Re: President Trump tweet on Pakistan

As for drone attacks deep inside Pakistan it is just not going to happen. I believe in our armed forces more than the anti army forces on this forum. Let them come, they have seen what happened to them in iraq and afghanistan, Pakistan s a much stronger country. Dont underestimate us nether overestimate the army which has lost badly in afghanistan and before that in iraq and Vietnam.

[hanibal]

Re: President Trump tweet on Pakistan

With all these war and tensions! let me be very clear about one thing…In case of war, Mumbai shall be mine and when i say Mumbai i mean all the actors and actresses…specially actresses…actors i can negotiate..
same with Hollywood!!!

now rest can claim their lands

[ajazali]

Re: President Trump tweet on Pakistan

almost every other day NATO containers of advanced and sophisticated arms are looted by Taliban. still US never demanded security for transit and keep on transporting sensitive ammunition along the insecure route. In Syria they have other options to support ISIS in pakistan they have Afghanistan plus NATO containers.

[Bobby1]

Re: President Trump tweet on Pakistan

@hanibal

With all these war and tensions! let me be very clear about one thing…In case of war, Mumbai shall be mine and when i say Mumbai i mean all the actors and actresses…specially actresses…actors i can negotiate..
same with Hollywood!!!

now rest can claim their lands

So the corrupt generals stealing billions from a starving nation with their kids going to school in US and having properties and butlers in UK will be your saviours..lol

[phoenixdesi]

Re: President Trump tweet on Pakistan

@ehsan

In a war you don’t lose people on war front only these people were killed by TTP coming over to pakistan with the active support of America

sir jee, how many times do you want me to repeat but I will do it again…where did i say that TTP does not exist or TTP did not kill 70K Pakistani people or TTP is not supported or sheltered by USA/Afghanistan/India? if I have, pls point out.

but if you say that TTP is not an internal problem, or it never existed before 911 i do not agree. TTP is 100% Pakistan’s internal problem. these elements were there way before 911 by different names (containing chechans, uzbaks, mahsuds, some Kashmiri groups joined them too after 2002). ISI knew about them, sheltered them and used them for proxy wars in afghanistan. When Musharaff tried to contain them after 911, they turned against us on the name of sharia implementation in Pakistan and finally branded them as TTP in 2004 under Mahsood. USA/Afg/India started to support them to get even with pak who they believed is supporting afghan taliban/haqannis. please read Ahmed Rashid on this topic. He is not afghan but a Pakistani journalist

I also am pointing out the strategic fallacy in Pakistan’s narrative because of which no one in this world is buying Pakistani chooran. when USA and rest of the world asks us to do more in afghan war on terrorism, they want us to stop harboring afghan taliban/haqqinis. Our response is always: we lost 70K lives. Oh bhai, we lost those live fighting TTP not afghan taliban/haqqani. why cant we say the truth? we support them due to our strategic needs

@ehsan

And you didnt reply to that idiot keeping his promises, you believe in trump well I rather not comment on that.

to be honest, not sure what did you want me to say on that topic? and then you asserted that I am trump’s fan :). trump is a crazy guy but my comments are beyond trump. i am talking about putting our house in order. we are on wrong side of the history. when will we realize this. hafiz saeeds, daood abrhahims, talibans, haqqanis, azhar masoods, why do we always support dark forces. this is not 70s or 80s. there is no space for supporting such actors in todays world.

[Sachaydino]

Re: President Trump tweet on Pakistan

@Anwer_Pasha

Big fear is this that these US drone could fly from India

These drones can still fly from Afghanistan can hit in center of Karachi, controlled by pilots in USA. Watch the movie ‘Eye in the Sky’ to get clear idea.

[Sachaydino]

Re: President Trump tweet on Pakistan

@ehsan

As for drone attacks deep inside Pakistan it is just not going to happen. I believe in our armed forces more than the anti army forces on this forum. Let them come, they have seen what happened to them in iraq and afghanistan, Pakistan s a much stronger country. Dont underestimate us nether overestimate the army which has lost badly in afghanistan and before that in iraq and Vietnam.

It is an unfortunate phenomenon that Muslims live in these countries including Pakistan do not share same faith and values. The exploitation of Shia, Sunni differences created more havoc than drones and bombs. Such mess created in Afghanistan and Iraq will take centuries to correct the problem. Pakistan is not immune to such menace either. When Zia-ul-Haq founded his jehadi program based on Wahabism, he should have thought that same disintegration would destroy Pakistan too.

[phoenixdesi]

Re: President Trump tweet on Pakistan

@ehsan

As for drone attacks deep inside Pakistan it is just not going to happen. I believe in our armed forces more than the anti army forces on this forum. Let them come, they have seen what happened to them in iraq and afghanistan, Pakistan s a much stronger country. Dont underestimate us nether overestimate the army which has lost badly in afghanistan and before that in iraq and Vietnam.

Sir jee, it is a very strong statement. now if you think Afghanistan, Iraq, Vietnam won those wars what can i say but i certainly dont want my country to follow those footsteps where we end up with millions died, infrastructure totally collapsed, whole generation finished. iraq had a huge army as well and i know our amry is great but these days air strikes for months precede ground wars. anyway, i dont even want to imagine going towards vietnam/iraq/afghanistan path. everyone in my family lives in pakistan…

[SID_NY]

Re: President Trump tweet on Pakistan

Whats baffling to me is why not all self-critiques start from the first step saying that its outrageous that trump is blaming Pakistan for its failures. And that too through a “lie”

I already mentioned in one post how the figures are completely wrong.

Second, how brutal and wounding is that he is saying that Pakistan has given “nothing”. Seriously? What about all those dozens and dozens that were handed over to US? And ofcourse the documents say that those criminals become a clue towards capturing OBL eventually.

So why not first condemn Trump? Why are these foreign Pakistanis hit back at Pakistan itself first? Its appalling and I’ve only seen it with Pakistani origins. The NRIs never do this. Same goes with other countries like Russia, china and others. Their immigrants always support and protect their origin country first.

So I guess those attacking Pakistani institutions first grow a pair and condemn this crazy person first and then we can talk about Pakistani institutions as a secondary subject.

[Sachaydino]

Re: President Trump tweet on Pakistan

@SID_NY

Whats baffling to me is why not all self-critiques start from the first step saying that its outrageous that trump is blaming Pakistan for its failures. And that too through a “lie”

I already mentioned in one post how the figures are completely wrong.

Second, how brutal and wounding is that he is saying that Pakistan has given “nothing”. Seriously? What about all those dozens and dozens that were handed over to US? And ofcourse the documents say that those criminals become a clue towards capturing OBL eventually.

So why not first condemn Trump? Why are these foreign Pakistanis hit back at Pakistan itself first? Its appalling and I’ve only seen it with Pakistani origins. The NRIs never do this. Same goes with other countries like Russia, china and others. Their immigrants always support and protect their origin country first.

So I guess those attacking Pakistani institutions first grow a pair and condemn this crazy person first and then we can talk about Pakistani institutions as a secondary subject.

Sons and daughters of generals studying US, citizens of US have millions of $s of properties earned through illegal means. Army is getting billions of dollars since Liaqat Ali Khan. Trump generals k chootrhon par chittar mare ga ya nahin. That stupid lady Maliha barking in US should stop barking. Get first your own house in order then bark. Those stupid who are saying they will fight with US and don’t care if America stop aid to Pakistan and slap ban, how Pakistan is going to survive? Do you think China and Russia will come to rescue in time of crisis. I don’t think so.

[SID_NY]

Re: President Trump tweet on Pakistan

@Sachaydino

Sons and daughters of generals studying US, have millions of $s of properties earned through illegal means. Army is getting billions of dollars since Liaqat Ali Khan. Trump generals k chootrhon par chittar mare ga ya nahin. That stupid lady Maliha barking in US should stop barking. Get first your own house in order then bark.

That stupid lady was first appointed by your stupid PM. Got it?

Your party had got 4 govts, Completed tenure in 2 of them. What action did you take against those generals?

[TheRealDeal]

Re: President Trump tweet on Pakistan

@SID_NY

That stupid lady was first appointed by your stupid PM. Got it?

Your party had got 4 govts, Completed tenure in 2 of them. Whait action did you take against those generals?

Take action against the murderous generals??

Do you not know the history of Pakistan?

[SID_NY]

Re: President Trump tweet on Pakistan

@TheRealDeal

Take action against the murderous generals??

Do you not know the history of Pakistan?

If you cant do the right thing, dont govern then. Its that simple.

[phoenixdesi]

Re: President Trump tweet on Pakistan

@SID_NY

Whats baffling to me is why not all self-critiques start from the first step saying that its outrageous that trump is blaming Pakistan for its failures. And that too through a “lie”

Dear SID, lets take emotions out. I am first one to say that trump is an idiot, crazy and psycho person, a disgrace to presidency. and yes it is outrageous that trump thinks Pak failed USA. There are many other factors as well. why didnt they put a wall on border for example?

I have said this many times but I didn’t know we need to say this as disclaimer. now that I have said that, you also need to remember that your favorite Obama said the exact same thing many many times (not through twitter but he did say it) and so did hillary clinton, john kerry and GW Bush …that Pak is supporting afghan taliban and haqannis.

So now you need to answer a simple question. Do you think Pak army is supporting afghan taliban and haqannis or not? take emotions out. mullah omar died here, mullah mansoor died here. so pls answer this question.

@SID_NY

I already mentioned in one post how the figures are completely wrong.

OK. that is interesting. You are the first person I have seen who is saying this. which numbers? 33B? well, everyone in Pak govt and army admit that we did receive 33 billion. no one said 33B figure is wrong. the question could be that we shd have paid more.

@SID_NY

So why not first condemn Trump? Why are these foreign Pakistanis hit back at Pakistan itself first? Its appalling and I’ve only seen it with Pakistani origins. The NRIs never do this. Same goes with other countries like Russia, china and others. Their immigrants always support and protect their origin country first.

this is really sad. few posters have made it “foreign Pakistanis” vs local Pakistanis and they are now judging the patriotism of foreign Pakistanis. this is really sad and has never happened on this site before. anyway, I am a “foreign pakistani” I guess but my whole family and my wife family everyone lives in pakistan. is this true about you SID as well? maybe it is, i just dont know.

and all the comments I am making is to make my family life and other Pakistanis lives safe. we are in critical stage of Pakistan and we believe our establishment has put our country’s safety in a huge mess. they have emotionalized people and we are going on iraq, Afghanistan and Vietnam path. I have criticized USA and will do it again but we are not willing to put our house in order. our goal shd be to get away from this mad elephant not come in his way deliberately.

[phoenixdesi]

Re: President Trump tweet on Pakistan

@Sachaydino

That stupid lady Maliha barking in US should stop barking. Get first your own house in order then bark. Those stupid who are saying they will fight with US and don’t care if America stop aid to Pakistan and slap ban, how Pakistan is going to survive? Do you think China and Russia will come to rescue in time of crisis. I don’t think so.

I have to say that it is a valid point. many Pakistani anchors said the same thing (rauf klassara, amir mateen). Maliha is really stupid. 128 countries voted against USA but did you see anyone doing press conference against US and making tall claims? oh bhai vote dalo, and go on side. why trying to become a hero? this is the same lady who showed a fake wrong picture in UN few months ago while talking about Kashmir atrocities and became a laughing stock and embarrassed pakistan to no end. she shd have been fired right there…

[SID_NY]

Re: President Trump tweet on Pakistan

@phoenixdesi

Dear SID, lets take emotions out. I am first one to say that trump is an idiot, crazy and psycho person, a disgrace to presidency. and yes it is outrageous that trump thinks Pak failed USA. There are many other factors as well. why didnt they put a wall on border for example?

I have said this many times but I didn’t know we need to say this as disclaimer. now that I have said that, you also need to remember that your favorite Obama said the exact same thing many many times (not through twitter but he did say it) and so did hillary clinton, john kerry and GW Bush …that Pak is supporting afghan taliban and haqannis.

So now you need to answer a simple question. Do you think Pak army is supporting afghan taliban and haqannis or not? take emotions out. mullah omar died here, mullah mansoor died here. so pls answer this question.

OK. that is interesting. You are the first person I have seen who is saying this. which numbers? 33B? well, everyone in Pak govt and army admit that we did receive 33 billion. no one said 33B figure is wrong. the question could be that we shd have paid more.

this is really sad. few posters have made it “foreign Pakistanis” vs local Pakistanis and they are now judging the patriotism of foreign Pakistanis. this is really sad and has never happened on this site before. anyway, I am a “foreign pakistani” I guess but my whole family and my wife family everyone lives in pakistan. is this true about you SID as well? maybe it is, i just dont know.

and all the comments I am making is to make my family life and other Pakistanis lives safe. we are in critical stage of Pakistan and we believe our establishment has put our country’s safety in a huge mess. they have emotionalized people and we are going on iraq, Afghanistan and Vietnam path. I have criticized USA and will do it again but we are not willing to put our house in order. our goal shd be to get away from this mad elephant not come in his way deliberately.

Few points:

• Emotions will never be taken out. Tomorrow if Pakistan is wiped off by a nuclear attack (God forbid), will you be sad or happy? Isnt it an emotional state?

• What you said about trump is right and thats the basic thing to begin with.

• Read post#17, i’ve explained figures and the source is a US site.

• No, Pakistani govt is not accepting the claim of 33B either. Go read what Pakistani foreign minister tweeted someone posted earlier, and in that response US govt is silent.

• When there is a HUGE conflict between two countries, you have to pick a side. And you’ll be judged on the base of which side are you on?
  If you are on trump’s side then you keep repeating what he said.
  If you are on Pakistani side then you do what I mentioned in last post. i.e. Condemn Trump first and call his BSbecuz its a lie and he is under the influence of Afghan and Indian propoganda. None of these two are Pakistani friends.
  And then later you can talk about what can be done better from Pakistani end to make relationship better. And the list goes on from there. But without the first step, you just cant hammer Pakistan as if its your dirty b!tch whom you can spank whenever you want

[KimJongUn]

Re: President Trump tweet on Pakistan

Don’t forget Haiti. Of each US dollar announced, only a net of 1 cent ended up in the hands of Haiti government. There is a huge overhead in the foreign aid business. Most of that overhead money goes into the pockets of US government employees and contractors.