only 6 ppl voted?
Akif yaar, This looks like a survey designed by the General himself. You don’t make 3 favorable categories and 1 unfavorable.
In any event, his performance sucks. He shouldn’t be there to begin with.
NYA its just a survey posted at a members request:) Votes count either way.
Agree :k:
I voted 'Good'.
He's handled himself pretty well so far, with one or two gaffes along the way. No, in an ideal world he shouldn't be there, but Pakistanis have only themselves to blame for the fact that he is.
[QUOTE]
*Originally posted by Judge^MentuLL: *
I voted 'Good'.
No, in an ideal world he shouldn't be there, but Pakistanis have only themselves to blame for the fact that he is.
[/QUOTE]
In case you didn;t notice, he took over by force. By sending his armed men. Might makes right in Pakistan.You want us to take on the whole Army? Rememebr what happpened in East Pakistan, Sindh, Balochistan when some people tried. Massacres.
[QUOTE]
*Originally posted by The_Real_Deal: *
In case you didn;t notice, he took over by force. By sending his armed men. Might makes right in Pakistan.You want us to take on the whole Army? Rememebr what happpened in East Pakistan, Sindh, Balochistan when some people tried. Massacres.
[/QUOTE]
I remember East Pakistan, and also the salogan of ZAB
Idhar Hum, Udhar Tum
If we had politicians worthy of the name, his takeover wouldn't have been greeted with such relief throughout Pakistan at the time. BB and Nawaz have mede mockeries of their respective parties and they have to take some of the responsibility for the failure of democracy in Pakistan. Politicians are supposed to look out for the interests of their nation not loot it.
Long term, miltary rule can't work, but in the meantime it's up to the political parties to rebuild the people's confidence in them. I don't see any signs of that just yet.
[QUOTE]
*Originally posted by Judge^MentuLL: *
If we had politicians worthy of the name, his takeover wouldn't have been greeted with such relief throughout Pakistan at the time. BB and Nawaz have mede mockeries of their respective parties and they have to take some of the responsibility for the failure of democracy in Pakistan. Politicians are supposed to look out for the interests of their nation not loot it.
Long term, miltary rule can't work, but in the meantime it's up to the political parties to rebuild the people's confidence in them. I don't see any signs of that just yet.
[/QUOTE]
I understand your point, but you must also realize Pak has been ruled by Army for over half its history now, it is as responsible for Paks state as anyone.
You must also remeber Army also manipulates the politcial system to suit its wants. Remmebr, Sharif gained prominence as a Zia/Army protege. Rememebr Gen.Beg even admitting Army rigging the elections?
Only when we get a proper system free of Army manipulation, will the people be able to elect someone who builds Pak.
[QUOTE]
*Originally posted by The_Real_Deal: *
I understand your point, but you must also realize Pak has been ruled by Army for over half its history now, it is as responsible for Paks state as anyone.
You must also remeber Army also manipulates the politcial system to suit its wants. Remmebr, Sharif gained prominence as a Zia/Army protege. Rememebr Gen.Beg even admitting Army rigging the elections?
Only when we get a proper system free of Army manipulation, will the people be able to elect someone who builds Pak.
[/QUOTE]
Who dragged Army into Politics?
Why the hell politicians always dragged Army men, specially COAS whenever there's a problem? Why? Can you tell that?
Even ZAB didn't accept his defeat in 1970's election and allowed Yahya to decide the fate of Pakistan. Why?
What! Are we living in the same planet?
[QUOTE]
*Originally posted by Pakistani Tiger: *
Who dragged Army into Politics?
Why the hell politicians always dragged Army men, specially COAS whenever there's a problem? Why? Can you tell that?
Even ZAB didn't accept his defeat in 1970's election and allowed Yahya to decide the fate of Pakistan?
What! Are we living in the same planet?
[/QUOTE]
If you lived in Pakistan you will know nobody 'drags' teh Army into anything. They do what they want.
No major decsion is made without Army approval which is why some 'consult' Army when a major decision needs to be made.
Army would not let any major decision go against their wishes, Army approval is needed, you should know this.
And no,considering your 'whiter than white' view of Mush, I don;t think you are talking about teh same Pak as teh rest of us.
The reason I disagree with his presence is simply that he is a dictator. Is he doing any different than others (elected that is) would have done? Probably not.
The other reason is that I don’t look at Wars/conflicts, etc, being a detriment to who comes to hold the Government. There is no reason for the General not to have followed the same options dictated to him by the elected civilians (soldiers should be good at following orders). Now what we have is a Government who is spending 92% of our collective effort into fighting a war (that we can ill afford), while the basic areas where we need Government (education, healthcare, economic stimulation) are being totally ignored.
The basic problem is the rift and power struggle between difference forces in our country, until that is handled and taken care of, we can kiss the Democracy good bye.
Even if he did an ‘outstanding’ job, I would still personally not approve of him. It is not about him (I am sure he is a nice and decent fellow), it is about rectitude and ethics.
I agree with Judge-mehtull that previous governments did not meet the expectations of the populace, but at least people brought them upon to themselves. It takes more than one generation to learn, but if we keep breaking that cycle of learning, we have to start over every few years. That's been the case with Pakistan. India should serve as an example to us where despite all the regional unrest (both internal and external), they have managed to keep Democracy functional and alive (with only when exception when Indira declared embergency).
[QUOTE]
*Originally posted by The_Real_Deal: *
[/quote]
If you lived in Pakistan you will know nobody 'drags' teh Army into anything. They do what they want.
Rubbish! Read the history of Pakistan. Mirz Iskandar wanted Ayub to be his puppet. Result, Ayub overthrew him
No major decsion is made without Army approval which is why some 'consult' Army when a major decision needs to be made.
YAWN.
*Army would not let any major decision go against their wishes, Army approval is needed, you should know this. *
Same goes for Politicians.
*And no,considering your 'whiter than white' view of Mush, I don;t think you are talking about teh same Pak as teh rest of us. *
Yes, because only politicians can do that.
[QUOTE]
*Originally posted by NYAhmadi: *
The reason I disagree with his presence is simply that he is a dictator. Is he doing any different than others (elected that is) would have done? Probably not.
The other reason is that I don’t look at Wars/conflicts, etc, being a detriment to who comes to hold the Government. There is no reason for the General not to have followed the same options dictated to him by the elected civilians (soldiers should be good at following orders). Now what we have is a Government who is spending 92% of our collective effort into fighting a war (that we can ill afford), while the basic areas where we need Government (education, healthcare, economic stimulation) are being totally ignored.
The basic problem is the rift and power struggle between difference forces in our country, until that is handled and taken care of, we can kiss the Democracy good bye.
Even if he did an ‘outstanding’ job, I would still personally not approve of him. It is not about him (I am sure he is a nice and decent fellow), it is about rectitude and ethics.
I agree with Judge-mehtull that previous governments did not meet the expectations of the populace, but at least people brought them upon to themselves. It takes more than one generation to learn, but if we keep breaking that cycle of learning, we have to start over every few years. That's been the case with Pakistan. India should serve as an example to us where despite all the regional unrest (both internal and external), they have managed to keep Democracy functional and alive (with only when exception when Indira declared embergency).
[/QUOTE]
Yaar NYA, you should read your own words carefully.
At one point, you said people brought them on their own wishes. On the other hand you said Govt. is not working on education. Should we also blame this military regime for lack of education in Pakistan? Can you tell me one only one specific progress by politicians in the field of education? Can you? If it is, then I shouldn't have left Pakistan.
If people want these politicians so desparately, they should also remember that these were the politicians who raised the salogans of Idar Hum, Udar Tum. As I said eariler, Pakistanis are well - professional in running from the problems caused by THEMSELVES!!
Read what you write. Do you know what it means to ‘overthrow’ someone?
No one is ‘forced’ to overthrow someone this is just common sense.
Your posts are increasingly filled with empty rhetoric, like I said it is obvious you have a personal reason for supporting Mush, because he sure as hell isn’t building Pak.
If you don’t accept this now after all the statistics showing how bad he is for Pak, you won’t accept another ten that come out later.
Lets just agree to disagree. 
NYA,
previous governments did not meet the expectations of the populace, but at least people brought them upon to themselves. It takes more than one generation to learn, but if we keep breaking that cycle of learning, we have to start over every few years
I agree to that. Sooner or later we will have to go through this process.
India should serve as an example to us where despite all the regional unrest (both internal and external), they have managed to keep Democracy functional and alive (with only when exception when Indira declared embergency).
It's not a great example. Hopefully the Indian electorate will boot out the current bunch of loons sitting in office and your point will be vindicated.
[QUOTE]
*Originally posted by The_Real_Deal: *
[/quote]
**Read what you write. Do you know what it means to 'overthrow' someone?
No one is 'forced' to overthrow someone this is just common sense. **
Do you know the meaning of puppet? Do you?
Your posts are increasingly filled with empty rhetoric, like I said it is obvious you have a personal reason for supporting Mush, because he sure as hell isn't building Pak.
Saala, baat karta. What ideas does your comments indicate?
If you don't accept this now after all the statistics showing how bad he is for Pak, you won't accept another ten that come out later.
Would you tell me one thing about politicians how good they really are for Pakistan? Suck it up RealDeal, it ain't gonna swallow easily!
Lets just agree to disagree.
I don't have to agree/disagree with you. I'm different and so do you.
Do you what it means to be a soldier obeying orders? Do you see any US,UK, etc general overthrowing their elected leader because they don’t to do what teh leader tells them?At teh most they resign their posts, not overthorw or kill them!
What is the use of talkig to you as people say you don’t want to believe anything apart form your crooked dictator is the best.
So enjoy your dream world, continue to ignore facts and reality on the ground. You need someone to slap you to your senses. goodbye, and don’t bother to reply, I won’t be reading your brainwashed rubbish.
You are fooling no one. 
[QUOTE]
Originally posted by The_Real_Deal: **
Do you what it means to be a soldier obeying orders? Do you see any US,UK, etc general overthrowing their elected leader because they don't to do what teh leader tells them?At teh most they resign their posts, not overthorw or kill them! **
Keep US, UK out of this. Will you? What kind of elected leaders? Is this the meaning of Democracy you are talking about who looted the country. The country was near default when we had coup in 1999. Blame Army for that, too
What is the use of talkig to you as people say you don't want to believe anything apart form your crooked dictator is the best.
What is the use of talking to you? Why you applying people's comments over me? Is that the only way you can reply at large?
So enjoy your dream world, continue to ignore facts and reality on the ground. You need someone to slap you to your senses. goodbye, and don't bother to reply, I won't be reading your brainwashed rubbish.
You are a dork! It was me, who pointed out Mush's fault along with his right decision. The point, I made about ZAB, no one even dared to response it back, not even you. Even, you call BB for help. Perhaps, you haven't brainwashed as NS called BB his sister :p
You are fooling no one.
I don't have to. People are naturally!